New Disneyland Parking Garage and Transportation Hub

[Curious Constance]

Haha... What's his name?

Beary Fancyton

 

[LongLiveTheKing]

Beary Fancyton

I was expecting "Sir Doge"

 

[Deleted member 107043]

I see someone is ready for Halloween.

 

[RMichael21]

Alright, I hate to be 'that guy' but could we stay on the thread's topic please?

 

[Deleted member 107043]

No, please, be that guy. Thank you..

 

[Darkbeer1]

Here is an interesting read regarding traffic and parking at the Disneyland from 2015 and TEA.

http://teachapman.weebly.com/tea-of...isneyland-expansion-not-as-direct-as-it-seems

>>
Yesterday afternoon The LA Times released an article (read it here) describing recent land purchases made by The Disneyland Resort in Anaheim and their supposed correlation to potential park expansion. The piece, written by legendary correspondent Hugo Martin is classical reporting at its finest providing readers with the facts and nothing more, but facts have never been the full story. In fact the saga and what this purchase means for the company begins nearly 20 years ago. So lets break down the article, analyze the rumors, and see what's likely going on backstage at the happiest place on earth.
The article begins by discussing Disney's recent purchase of three parcels of land (outlined in blue in the image below) that the Walt Disney Company purchased within the past year for an undisclosed sum. The land, which totals around 15 acres, is currently home to two large business park/buildings and the Carousel Inn, home of the original Pizza Press. The land is in an exceptionally valuable position for the resort expanding their current holdings, outlined in red, and providing them with access to the Eastern side of Harbor Blvd. directly across from the Resort's iconic entrance. <<

MUCH more at the link.

 

[Darkbeer1]

And here is an official city map showing daily traffic counts.

Interesting to not, the worse (highest counts aka Red) on Harbor is the section just south of Ball Road to the I-5. But there is a lot of heavy traffic (Blue) in the entire area.

http://www.anaheim.net/DocumentCenter/View/367

 

[NobodyElse]

Here is an interesting read regarding traffic and parking at the Disneyland from 2015 and TEA.

http://teachapman.weebly.com/tea-of...isneyland-expansion-not-as-direct-as-it-seems

>>
Yesterday afternoon The LA Times released an article (read it here) describing recent land purchases made by The Disneyland Resort in Anaheim and their supposed correlation to potential park expansion. The piece, written by legendary correspondent Hugo Martin is classical reporting at its finest providing readers with the facts and nothing more, but facts have never been the full story. In fact the saga and what this purchase means for the company begins nearly 20 years ago. So lets break down the article, analyze the rumors, and see what's likely going on backstage at the happiest place on earth.
The article begins by discussing Disney's recent purchase of three parcels of land (outlined in blue in the image below) that the Walt Disney Company purchased within the past year for an undisclosed sum. The land, which totals around 15 acres, is currently home to two large business park/buildings and the Carousel Inn, home of the original Pizza Press. The land is in an exceptionally valuable position for the resort expanding their current holdings, outlined in red, and providing them with access to the Eastern side of Harbor Blvd. directly across from the Resort's iconic entrance. <<

MUCH more at the link.

That seems to be a pretty good (yet necessarily dated) recap of other reports over the years. One thing kind of bugs me about their illustrations:

More than once they reverence the parcel(s) east of Pumba lot (what I might refer to as the "Bergstrom's Triangle") as "current holdings". This concept seems nebulous if not questionable to me. If Disney (or one of it's mysterious holding companies) owned this lot, I would think it would be quite valuable to them, and play into plans to cohesively develop that entire area. In the past, TP2000 has mentioned Bergstrom's intent to "never sell to Disney". Now we have a new hotel going in, with Bergstrom's shuttered building still "for sale or lease".

The history of this plot just baffles and intrigues me...

 

[TP2000]

I was working a special DCA event regarding a Guinness World Record event. I had media credentials from both Disney and from Guinness and the TV production company holding the event. I knew who he was (Yes, it was a male using a synonym, and I knew very shortly after the "debates" started on MouseInfo. A good source showed me a group picture of TDA folks that was taken at DCA in regards to the construction period and one of the contractors. He asked me to play "Where's Marcie?", it took me a few tries until I got the right person. And then was asked not to tell people who he was. And it was confirmed by many others later.

Oh. My. Gawd. My mind has been blown.

For 15 years I had always thought Marcie was a lady. I had an image in my mind what she looked like, down to the hairdo and corporate uniform. (She was brunette, by the way, not unattractive but never a beauty queen, favored tailored slacks and silk blouses. Carried a leather padfolio with her. Probably lived in Yorba Linda.)

Seriously, I had always known that Marcie was a fake name for an online personality, but I had assigned her a gender and it stuck for 15 years. She wrote like a lady. A passionate and angry lady trying to get back at Al Lutz and defend Cynthia, but a lady nonetheless.

I am laughing so hard right now. I had no idea she was a dude!

 

[lazyboy97o]

Here is an interesting read regarding traffic and parking at the Disneyland from 2015 and TEA.

http://teachapman.weebly.com/tea-of...isneyland-expansion-not-as-direct-as-it-seems

Just a note, but this article was not published by the TEA. It is from TEA @ Chapman, a student-run university club that is part of the TEA NextGen program that engages students interested in themed entertainment.
http://www.teaconnect.org/NextGen/TEA--University-Clubs/

 

[TP2000]

That seems to be a pretty good (yet necessarily dated) recap of other reports over the years. One thing kind of bugs me about their illustrations:

More than once they reverence the parcel(s) east of Pumba lot (what I might refer to as the "Bergstrom's Triangle") as "current holdings". This concept seems nebulous if not questionable to me. If Disney (or one of it's mysterious holding companies) owned this lot, I would think it would be quite valuable to them, and play into plans to cohesively develop that entire area. In the past, TP2000 has mentioned Bergstrom's intent to "never sell to Disney". Now we have a new hotel going in, with Bergstrom's shuttered building still "for sale or lease".

The history of this plot just baffles and intrigues me...

It is baffling. It's possible that Disney once owned most of that land when the business park was torn down last year, and it was integral to an earlier parking plan for that area. But when the streetcar fell apart and they bought Carousel Inn, they no longer needed it. Disney either sold the land that the new Country Suites is being built on, or they still own it and leased it out for long-term hotel development.

Bergstrom's still sits there empty and for sale, now wedged between the freeway and the new hotel and the future Eastern Gateway. Disney really won that war, and I'm sure the Bergstrom family is furious if only for the optics of the whole thing.

There's part of me that thinks Disney might have sold the adjacent land to a hotel developer only to make the Bergstrom's property rather worthless just out of spite. Bergstrom's had value when it could be bundled into the land next door. Now it's just a wedge of land that will be worthless as retail or even office property.

Walt Disney Company 1 - Bergstrom Family 0.

 

[TP2000]

Just a note, but this article was not published by the TEA. It is from TEA @ Chapman, a student-run university club that is part of the TEA NextGen program that engages students interested in themed entertainment.
http://www.teaconnect.org/NextGen/TEA--University-Clubs/

And what's even more interesting is that they appear to have read nearly every single Miceage Update of the last five years as research for their thesis. Lucky for them their professor didn't charge them with plagiarism.

 

[truecoat]

Ah, remember when we used to talk about this stuff back in 2015? Good times...

From one of my posts in that thread:

A couple of quick observations, in no real order.

• The HKS drawing shows the proposed sky bridge taking up roughly half (the north half) of the existing structure.
• Google Maps earth view shows it contains mechanical equipment. It would need to be relocated / removed.
• I took a quick field trip there yesterday. The only open businesses on the upper level are Johnny Rockets and Fire+Ice.
• There does seem to be active construction for the Toby Keith's I Heart This Bar and Grill.
• (That name has always bugged me.)
• There appears to at least be prep for demo in the old theater location (future HOB).
• The two plots to either side of the fire station are still dirt and weeds.
• On a positive note, nobody will need to be displaced to run that sky bridge straight into the courtyard.
• Positive note 2: their generous 1st hour of free parking was double what I needed to do a couple laps of looking around.

The entries in bold are applicable here. Where the drawn-up sky bridge would terminate at AGW is existing retail space. What I was eluding to was that everything in that area was empty. if AGW wanted to work with the new hotel, they could reconfigure the space to allow an interior walkway.

A assumed that it would just be built above the existing equipment.

 

[tikiphil]

I doubt there is any Disney money with the current ownership group, but...

Land that Disney officially claims to own is in blue, Anaheim Garden Walk is in red. It is incredibly difficult to imagine Disney not wanting to own AGW as part of any future expansion plans (3rd park to the south east?) Either Disney has some secret deal with the "group" that bought AGW or they are killing themselves for not bidding on it in 2012 when they had a chance.

 

[NobodyElse]

A assumed that it would just be built above the existing equipment.

View attachment 159734

Well, looking more closely at that HKS top-down drawing, it does appear that the "roof" of the bridge is lining up with the "roof" of the AGW building.

My concern has to do with this:

When entering AGW from the shown parking structure, you come out of the fourth level, right onto what we'll call the second retail level of the mall (the level the old theater's entrance was on). That elevation is represented by the red line in the above photo. I had assumed that the hotel would want to come in at that same level to avoid ADA issues, but who knows. i'm also not sure how much space that currently existing equipment needs (right now it's open to the sky).

As stated, last time I checked, the retail space in the area of the bridge is empty, so perhaps they could employ a proper ramp to get to pedestrian level, but how much space is AGW willing to give up in this area?

This may indeed all be figured out, but it seems like more details need to be leaked to meet my satisfaction/comprehension.

 

[Next Big Thing]

Toby's Keith is a chain

http://tobykeithsbar.com/

And here is why they stopped work at AGW

http://www.azcentral.com/story/mone...iens-raise-questions-across-country/71916554/

There was going to be one at the Artegon Market in Orlando but i'm not sure if that one ever opened either. It certainly isn't anything I hear of if it did.

 

[Darkbeer1]

OK, my knowledge of AGW from experience.

The area where a possible bridge would go is currently an interior hallway with restrooms. Restrooms are on the north side of the hallway. When the area hosted the movie theater, the corner had Cinnabon store facing east. The south side is the wall for the parking structure. So the building, as far as I can tell, was designed to allow the addition of a bridge

 

[NobodyElse]

OK, my knowledge of AGW from experience.

The area where a possible bridge would go is currently an interior hallway with restrooms. Restrooms are on the north side of the hallway. When the area hosted the movie theater, the corner had Cinnabon store facing east. The south side is the wall for the parking structure. So the building, as far as I can tell, was designed to allow the addition of a bridge

Once again, when it comes to these images, you get what you pay for.

Here is a deep, dark, hallway that runs between the parking structure and the retail space. It leads to bathrooms, and a stairwell (as well as a door to a not-for-public-consumption hallway that runs at a 90 degree angle along the back-side of said retail, on down to the HOB space). This may or may not be the hallway @Darkbeer1 was speaking of, but to me it doesn't quite line up.

Here's a little something I came across. (It might be useful later.) Please excuse the shadows, exposure, etc. Phone camera and I was trying to avoid flash reflections.

In this image, I tried to overlay the above photo with a google earth image. Noted is: (orange) what would be the straight-line path from the assumed sky-way, (green) the existing hallway to the bathrooms, (blue) the existing off-limits hallway that runs north/south. Also note, I may have the shape of this hallway messed up a bit. I wasn't doing any measuring.

Please note (if you wish) there's a clear (or not so clear) delineation between the empty retail space on the bottom half of this image, and the future HOB structure on the top half, complete with expansion joint on the walkway to the right.

Here's a picture from just inside the door of the north/south hallway. I guess you can use the fire extinguisher housing for scale.

Here's a shot from a little further down. It's intended to show those expansion joints, as well as the fact that the stairs go up to a small platform (the joints in the walls bisect it) then back down. Use the hand rails for scale and perspective. It must be avoiding something important.

Put this all together and what does it mean? I don't know. That's what discussion is for.

And one more bonus picture, with a story. When it was time to leave, I drove down the ramps and was presented with a choice of two exits. One way led to Katella (and it's forced right-hand turn towards Harbor. The other would lead to Disney Way, and quick access to the southbound 5 (where I was going). Following their clear signage, I was confronted with this dilemma:

Oh GardenWalk. You never fail to disappoint.

 

[Old Mouseketeer]

Well, nothing says they couldn't build the skyway above (north of) the orange portion of the existing utility bridge, all the way through the retail space below the expansion joint. In a redevelopment of the scale that AGW needs, engineering a connector to a major resort like this can be a major prioity. AGW was built with the expectation of two significant hotels on the expansion pads north and south of the Fire Station, along with the assumption that the aging former Hyatt Hotel to the west would be developed into a major hotel property. This is one of the biggest reasons AGW failed (at least from the retail perspective). The existing street-front restaurants mostly have strong brands and deep pockets and so have a better chance of surviving. AGW was ugly and unpleasant. It had plenty of walking, but very little garden. Ultimately there was no "there" there.

 

[Deleted member 107043]

This is one of the biggest reasons AGW failed (at least from the retail perspective).

I agree that not having hotels adjacent reduced the amount of traffic passing through the mall, and you are right to point out how conceptually bad AGW was from the start. With DLR beckoning across the street there's only so many tourists who are going to wander down from their hotel rooms to eat at Bubba Gimp's or visit Sunglass Hut #982.