The Spirited 8th Wonder (WDW's Future & You!)

[Computer Magic]

I'm replying to your post here because you bring up some interesting points about DVC but I'm going to have to veer completely off the topic of the other thread ("FP+ only Toy Story Midway Mania") in order to discuss them, which I am glad to discuss on this thread, which is about DVC.

I respectfully suggest you look at DVC from a cash flow perspective. Look at it from Disney's perspective.

To Disney, it does not matter what someone paid for a DVC membership back in (for example) 2008. That money is gone. Disney spent that cash long ago; for construction & maintenance, to pay Cast Members, for executive bonuses, as stock dividends, or as stock repurchases. (This year alone, Disney spent over $6 billion buying back its own stock.) Those managing WDW in 2014 don't give a hoot about cash flow in 2008.

They care about cash flow in 2014.

In 2014, someone who is a DVC member at Bay Lake Tower (BLT) paid $4.78/point in Maintenance Fees (MF).

In the summer of 2014, it took 139 points to rent a Bay Lake Tower standard view Studio. Someone who is a DVC member at BLT paid $94.92/night in 2014 to stay within walking distance of the Magic Kingdom.

Disney was counting on that family to buy theme park tickets, dine at WDW restaurants, and purchase WDW souvenirs.

However, after visiting WDW for 6 years and seeing how little has changed at the theme parks, they've become bored. Ticket prices are up an average of 25% since 2008 and, frankly, they just don't see the value anymore.

Meanwhile, Universal has been adding a ton of attractions since 2008. A 4-day Uni ticket costs $156 while a 4-day WDW ticket costs $294. Why not give Uni a try?

If that DVC member decides they want to skip Orlando this year, then they rent their DVC points through David's DVC Rentals and make a tidy profit. David's is just begging DVC members for points. David's rents these out at $14/point, meaning a non-DVC member can either pay Disney's $583/night rack rate to stay in a Tower Room at the Contemporary, or pay David's $278/night to stay at Bay Lake Tower.

And you wonder why David's is begging for more points to rent.

Rather than pay WDW $4081 for a week's stay at the Contemporary, that same family pays David's $1946.

Disney's cut of this? The exact same $664 they would have gotten from that DVC member, had that DVC member even bothered to visit WDW.

Disney just lost $3417 ($4081 - $664) in revenue (which happens to be almost pure profit, by the way) because of that DVC member who supposedly is "locked in".

That's the problem Disney is facing today.

These DVC members most definitely are not "locked in".

And Disney most definitely has a problem.

Disney is offering that DVC member a $199 4-day ticket this year not only to get that DVC member back into the theme parks, but to stop them from renting out their points and costing Disney $3417.

I wonder when Disney will implement a policy to stop people from renting their points.

Funny, I was just now looking at the inflated 30% room rate discount thought, and said I wonder if I could just rent points.

 

[GoofGoof]

I wonder when Disney will implement a policy to stop people from renting their points.

Funny, I was just now looking at the inflated 30% room rate discount thought, and said I wonder if I could just rent points.

This is a tough dilemma for Disney. It would be difficult to regulate. When someone makes a reservation in another person's name Disney doesn't know if they rented the points to a stranger for cash or just offered a family member or friend use of the condo. They could restrict it so that the owner must be present at check-in, but that would limit a family where mom and dad let full grown kids use their points or someone lets their brother or cousin or friend use the points.

They do restrict point transfers from member to member to 1 per year so I guess they could restrict reservations in someone else's name to once every third year or something like that.

 

[jlsHouston]

This is a tough dilemma for Disney. It would be difficult to regulate. When someone makes a reservation in another person's name Disney doesn't know if they rented the points to a stranger for cash or just offered a family member or friend use of the condo. They could restrict it so that the owner must be present at check-in, but that would limit a family where mom and dad let full grown kids use their points or someone lets their brother or cousin or friend use the points.

They do restrict point transfers from member to member to 1 per year so I guess they could restrict reservations in someone else's name to once every third year or something like that.

And that would be a drag and a bummer because renting points is a really great way for a non dvc person to stay deluxe at a really good price. I love renting dvc points. Every stay since the first time I tried it now has part onsite rooms using a passholder discount and part onsite having purchased points direct from a member.

 

[Captain Chaos]

This is a tough dilemma for Disney. It would be difficult to regulate. When someone makes a reservation in another person's name Disney doesn't know if they rented the points to a stranger for cash or just offered a family member or friend use of the condo. They could restrict it so that the owner must be present at check-in, but that would limit a family where mom and dad let full grown kids use their points or someone lets their brother or cousin or friend use the points.

They do restrict point transfers from member to member to 1 per year so I guess they could restrict reservations in someone else's name to once every third year or something like that.

I remember reading somewhere, maybe one of the DVC books you get when joining, that they do limit you to the amount of booked vacations for other people. I forget the number I saw. But it was like X times in X amount of years. And if they see that kind of a pattern, they have the right to refuse your use or something cause they deem it profiting from your purchased points. I'll look to see if I can find that again and post it for you if I do.

 

[DisneyDenis]

This is a tough dilemma for Disney. It would be difficult to regulate. When someone makes a reservation in another person's name Disney doesn't know if they rented the points to a stranger for cash or just offered a family member or friend use of the condo. They could restrict it so that the owner must be present at check-in, but that would limit a family where mom and dad let full grown kids use their points or someone lets their brother or cousin or friend use the points.

They do restrict point transfers from member to member to 1 per year so I guess they could restrict reservations in someone else's name to once every third year or something like that.

DVD has given DVC owners a legal right to rent their points, except if it constitutes commercial activity. DVD has specified that 20 or more rentals per year would indicate commercial activity. This is a major advantage to BOTH the DVC owner and the renter.

Please note: I do not intend to rent again for a long time. I only present this as a concrete example of the possibilities. This year I rented a studio at Wilderness Lodge (a boat ride to Magic Kingdom) to an Indiana couple for 13 nights for about $ 200 / night complete which is the same as $ 178 before taxes. My other rental coming up is to an Ohio family of 5 for 7 nights just before Christmas in a one bedroom at Boardwalk Villas (walking distance or boat ride to both EPCOT and Hollywood Studios with all the restaurants and activities of the Boardwalk area) with a washer / drier and full kitchen in the villa for $ 264 / night which is the same as $ 234.50 before taxes. The price is great for my renters and I make twice my membership fees: a win-win for all.

 

[AEfx]

I remember reading somewhere, maybe one of the DVC books you get when joining, that they do limit you to the amount of booked vacations for other people. I forget the number I saw. But it was like X times in X amount of years. And if they see that kind of a pattern, they have the right to refuse your use or something cause they deem it profiting from your purchased points. I'll look to see if I can find that again and post it for you if I do.

Well there is yet another thing that makes DVC less like a time-share, much less "ownership", and more like a lease.

 

[GoofGoof]

DVD has given DVC owners a legal right to rent their points, except if it constitutes commercial activity. DVD has specified that 20 or more rentals per year would indicate commercial activity. This is a major advantage to BOTH the DVC owner and the renter.

Please note: I do not intend to rent again for a long time. I only present this as a concrete example of the possibilities. This year I rented a studio at Wilderness Lodge (a boat ride to Magic Kingdom) to an Indiana couple for 13 nights for about $ 200 / night complete which is the same as $ 178 before taxes. My other rental coming up is to an Ohio family of 5 for 7 nights just before Christmas in a one bedroom at Boardwalk Villas (walking distance or boat ride to both EPCOT and Hollywood Studios with all the restaurants and activities of the Boardwalk area) with a washer / drier and full kitchen in the villa for $ 264 / night which is the same as $ 234.50 before taxes. The price is great for my renters and I make twice my membership fees: a win-win for all.

I think I read somewhere that they also restricted point transfers for cash. You can transfer points once a year to another owner without being compensated. I think it's intended to prevent a person from owning multiple contracts and transferring points around to make perfect sized blocks of points to rent out.

I agree that renting points is a big benefit for both owners and the renters.

 

[Captain Chaos]

DVD has given DVC owners a legal right to rent their points, except if it constitutes commercial activity. DVD has specified that 20 or more rentals per year would indicate commercial activity. This is a major advantage to BOTH the DVC owner and the renter.

YES!!! This is it. I knew I wasn't going crazy. Thanks for posting this!

 

[Cesar R M]

DVD has given DVC owners a legal right to rent their points, except if it constitutes commercial activity. DVD has specified that 20 or more rentals per year would indicate commercial activity. This is a major advantage to BOTH the DVC owner and the renter.

Please note: I do not intend to rent again for a long time. I only present this as a concrete example of the possibilities. This year I rented a studio at Wilderness Lodge (a boat ride to Magic Kingdom) to an Indiana couple for 13 nights for about $ 200 / night complete which is the same as $ 178 before taxes. My other rental coming up is to an Ohio family of 5 for 7 nights just before Christmas in a one bedroom at Boardwalk Villas (walking distance or boat ride to both EPCOT and Hollywood Studios with all the restaurants and activities of the Boardwalk area) with a washer / drier and full kitchen in the villa for $ 264 / night which is the same as $ 234.50 before taxes. The price is great for my renters and I make twice my membership fees: a win-win for all.

Thanks to reminding me of DVC points.

I'm seriously thinking in renting some to stay at AKL for a trip on february.

AKL seems to have very good prices, even cheaper than convention prices!

 

[Longhairbear]

I'm replying to your post here because you bring up some interesting points about DVC but I'm going to have to veer completely off the topic of the other thread ("FP+ only Toy Story Midway Mania") in order to discuss them, which I am glad to discuss on this thread, which is about DVC.

I respectfully suggest you look at DVC from a cash flow perspective. Look at it from Disney's perspective.

To Disney, it does not matter what someone paid for a DVC membership back in (for example) 2008. That money is gone. Disney spent that cash long ago; for construction & maintenance, to pay Cast Members, for executive bonuses, as stock dividends, or as stock repurchases. (This year alone, Disney spent over $6 billion buying back its own stock.) Those managing WDW in 2014 don't give a hoot about cash flow in 2008.

They care about cash flow in 2014.

In 2014, someone who is a DVC member at Bay Lake Tower (BLT) paid $4.78/point in Maintenance Fees (MF).

In the summer of 2014, it took 139 points to rent a Bay Lake Tower standard view Studio. Someone who is a DVC member at BLT paid $94.92/night in 2014 to stay within walking distance of the Magic Kingdom.

Disney was counting on that family to buy theme park tickets, dine at WDW restaurants, and purchase WDW souvenirs.

However, after visiting WDW for 6 years and seeing how little has changed at the theme parks, they've become bored. Ticket prices are up an average of 25% since 2008 and, frankly, they just don't see the value anymore.

Meanwhile, Universal has been adding a ton of attractions since 2008. A 4-day Uni ticket costs $156 while a 4-day WDW ticket costs $294. Why not give Uni a try?

If that DVC member decides they want to skip Orlando this year, then they rent their DVC points through David's DVC Rentals and make a tidy profit. David's is just begging DVC members for points. David's rents these out at $14/point, meaning a non-DVC member can either pay Disney's $583/night rack rate to stay in a Tower Room at the Contemporary, or pay David's $278/night to stay at Bay Lake Tower.

And you wonder why David's is begging for more points to rent.

Rather than pay WDW $4081 (7 X $583) for a week's stay at the Contemporary, that same family pays David's $1946 (7 X $278).

Disney's cut of this? The exact same $664 (7 X $94.92) they would have gotten from that DVC member, had that DVC member even bothered to visit WDW.

Disney just lost $3417 ($4081 - $664) in revenue (which happens to be almost pure profit, by the way) because of that DVC member who supposedly is "locked in".

That's the problem Disney is facing today.

These DVC members most definitely are not "locked in".

And Disney most definitely has a problem.

Disney is offering that DVC member a $199 4-day ticket this year not only to get that DVC member back into the theme parks, but to stop them from renting out their points and costing Disney $3417.

I am a DVC member, and no longer using my points in FLA, but entirely in CA. This last weekend we stayed premium view at the Disneyland hotel. I looked up the rack rate for my room, and it is more than my annual DVC fee.I have several more trips booked at the villas later this year. Is Disney losing money on me?

 

[ParentsOf4]

I am a DVC member, and no longer using my points in FLA, but entirely in CA. This last weekend we stayed premium view at the Disneyland hotel. I looked up the rack rate for my room, and it is more than my annual DVC fee. I have several more trips booked at the villas later this year. Is Disney losing money on me?

Disney is not losing money on you. Quite the opposite. When you use your DVC points for anything other than DVC stays (e.g. the Disneyland Hotel), Disney is making even more off you. That's OK. It's your choice how to use your points and it's Disney's obligation to turn a profit.

Even at DVC prices, Disney is making a profit. Recalling my earlier example, even at $94.92/night, Disney is making a modest profit on that BLT Studio.

The most incredible facet of DVC pricing is that it demonstrates just how ridiculously overpriced Disney hotels have become.

When they charge $583/night for a Tower Room at the Contemporary, it just goes to show how out of whack WDW's prices have become, even with a "30% off" discount.

Corporate Disney has an obligation to its shareholders to make as big of a profit as possible. However, when customers pay these sorts of prices and still report problems such as those described on this thread, not only is Disney failing its customer, but they are failing to live up to the standards they claim to adhere to.

Quoting from Disney's own Standard of Business Conduct:

We are recognized as providers of high-quality content, entertainment and experiences of all kinds, including films, television programs, news and information, theme park attractions and resorts, online experiences, consumer products and stores. Each of us has a responsibility to build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share. That means being courteous, knowledgeable and passionate about providing a high-quality experience to all of our guests and customers. It also means creating products and services that we are proud to identify as ours.​

As customers who are paying a premium for the Disney experience, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver on its commitment to "build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share".

At the premium prices Disney charges for its theme parks and hotels, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver the highest level of quality, cleanliness, and service.

With a rack rate of $583/night, Disney sure as heck better deliver 100% of the time.

 

[Nemo14]

Disney is not losing money on you. Quite the opposite. When you use your DVC points for anything other than DVC stays (e.g. the Disneyland Hotel), Disney is making even more off you. That's OK. It's your choice how to use your points and its Disney's obligation to turn a profit.

Even at DVC prices, Disney is making a profit. Recalling my earlier example, even at $94.92/night, Disney is making a modest profit on that BLT Studio.

The most incredible facet of DVC pricing is that it demonstrates just how ridiculously overpriced Disney hotels have become.

When they charge $583/night for a Tower Room at the Contemporary, it just goes to show how out of whack WDW's prices have become, even with a "30% of" discount.

Corporate Disney has an obligation to its shareholders to make as big of a profit as possible. However, when customers pay these sorts of prices and still report problems such as those described on this thread, not only is Disney failing its customer, but they are failing to live up to the standards they claim to adhere to.

Quoting from Disney's own Standard of Business Conduct:

We are recognized as providers of high-quality content, entertainment and experiences of all kinds, including films, television programs, news and information, theme park attractions and resorts, online experiences, consumer products and stores. Each of us has a responsibility to build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share. That means being courteous, knowledgeable and passionate about providing a high-quality experience to all of our guests and customers. It also means creating products and services that we are proud to identify as ours.​

As customers who are paying a premium for the Disney experience, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver on its commitment to "build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share".

At the premium prices Disney charges for its theme parks and hotels, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver the highest level of quality, cleanliness, and service.

With a rate rack of $583/night, Disney sure as heck better deliver 100% of the time.

another post I wish I could "like" 1000 times!!!

 

[Darth Sidious]

Disney is not losing money on you. Quite the opposite. When you use your DVC points for anything other than DVC stays (e.g. the Disneyland Hotel), Disney is making even more off you. That's OK. It's your choice how to use your points and its Disney's obligation to turn a profit.

Even at DVC prices, Disney is making a profit. Recalling my earlier example, even at $94.92/night, Disney is making a modest profit on that BLT Studio.

The most incredible facet of DVC pricing is that it demonstrates just how ridiculously overpriced Disney hotels have become.

When they charge $583/night for a Tower Room at the Contemporary, it just goes to show how out of whack WDW's prices have become, even with a "30% of" discount.

Corporate Disney has an obligation to its shareholders to make as big of a profit as possible. However, when customers pay these sorts of prices and still report problems such as those described on this thread, not only is Disney failing its customer, but they are failing to live up to the standards they claim to adhere to.

Quoting from Disney's own Standard of Business Conduct:

We are recognized as providers of high-quality content, entertainment and experiences of all kinds, including films, television programs, news and information, theme park attractions and resorts, online experiences, consumer products and stores. Each of us has a responsibility to build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share. That means being courteous, knowledgeable and passionate about providing a high-quality experience to all of our guests and customers. It also means creating products and services that we are proud to identify as ours.​

As customers who are paying a premium for the Disney experience, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver on its commitment to "build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share".

At the premium prices Disney charges for its theme parks and hotels, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver the highest level of quality, cleanliness, and service.

With a rate rack of $583/night, Disney sure as heck better deliver 100% of the time.

Can I work for you? Haha

 

[Cesar R M]

Disney is not losing money on you. Quite the opposite. When you use your DVC points for anything other than DVC stays (e.g. the Disneyland Hotel), Disney is making even more off you. That's OK. It's your choice how to use your points and it's Disney's obligation to turn a profit.

Even at DVC prices, Disney is making a profit. Recalling my earlier example, even at $94.92/night, Disney is making a modest profit on that BLT Studio.

The most incredible facet of DVC pricing is that it demonstrates just how ridiculously overpriced Disney hotels have become.

When they charge $583/night for a Tower Room at the Contemporary, it just goes to show how out of whack WDW's prices have become, even with a "30% off" discount.

Corporate Disney has an obligation to its shareholders to make as big of a profit as possible. However, when customers pay these sorts of prices and still report problems such as those described on this thread, not only is Disney failing its customer, but they are failing to live up to the standards they claim to adhere to.

Quoting from Disney's own Standard of Business Conduct:

We are recognized as providers of high-quality content, entertainment and experiences of all kinds, including films, television programs, news and information, theme park attractions and resorts, online experiences, consumer products and stores. Each of us has a responsibility to build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share. That means being courteous, knowledgeable and passionate about providing a high-quality experience to all of our guests and customers. It also means creating products and services that we are proud to identify as ours.​

As customers who are paying a premium for the Disney experience, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver on its commitment to "build quality into every product and service we deliver and every interaction we share".

At the premium prices Disney charges for its theme parks and hotels, we have every right to demand that Disney deliver the highest level of quality, cleanliness, and service.

With a rack rate of $583/night, Disney sure as heck better deliver 100% of the time.

reminds me of @WDW1974 's post, on how a hotel of the likes of Waldorf Astoria.. is cheaper than the contemporary.

 

[JediMasterMatt]

I'm replying to your post here because you bring up some interesting points about DVC but I'm going to have to veer completely off the topic of the other thread ("FP+ only Toy Story Midway Mania") in order to discuss them, which I am glad to discuss on this thread, which is about DVC.

I respectfully suggest you look at DVC from a cash flow perspective. Look at it from Disney's perspective.

To Disney, it does not matter what someone paid for a DVC membership back in (for example) 2008. That money is gone. Disney spent that cash long ago; for construction & maintenance, to pay Cast Members, for executive bonuses, as stock dividends, or as stock repurchases. (This year alone, Disney spent over $6 billion buying back its own stock.) Those managing WDW in 2014 don't give a hoot about cash flow in 2008.

They care about cash flow in 2014.

In 2014, someone who is a DVC member at Bay Lake Tower (BLT) paid $4.78/point in Maintenance Fees (MF).

In the summer of 2014, it took 139 points to rent a Bay Lake Tower standard view Studio. In 2014, someone who is a DVC member at BLT paid $94.92/night to stay within walking distance of the Magic Kingdom.

Disney was counting on that family to buy theme park tickets, dine at WDW restaurants, and purchase WDW souvenirs.

However, after visiting WDW for 6 years and seeing how little has changed at the theme parks, they've become bored. Ticket prices are up an average of 25% since 2008 and, frankly, they just don't see the value anymore.

Meanwhile, Universal has been adding a ton of attractions since 2008. A 4-day Uni ticket costs $156 while a 4-day WDW ticket costs $294. Why not give Uni a try?

If that DVC member decides they want to skip Orlando this year, then they rent their DVC points through David's DVC Rentals and make a tidy profit. David's is just begging DVC members for points. David's rents these out at $14/point, meaning a non-DVC member can either pay Disney's $583/night rack rate to stay in a Tower Room at the Contemporary, or pay David's $278/night to stay at Bay Lake Tower.

And you wonder why David's is begging for more points to rent.

Rather than pay WDW $4081 (7 X $583) for a week's stay at the Contemporary, that same family pays David's $1946 (7 X $278).

Disney's cut of this? The exact same $664 (7 X $94.92) they would have gotten from that DVC member, had that DVC member even bothered to visit WDW.

Disney just lost $3417 ($4081 - $664) in revenue (which happens to be almost pure profit, by the way) because of that DVC member who supposedly is "locked in".

That's the problem Disney is facing today.

These DVC members most definitely are not "locked in".

And Disney most definitely has a problem.

Disney is offering that DVC member a $199 4-day ticket this year not only to get that DVC member back into the theme parks, but to stop them from renting out their points and costing Disney $3417.

While I completely agree with you that there is a problem, I don't agree that Disney is taking action to resolve the problem that DVC are facing as a top priority. I would entertain that getting DVC members back in their parks is below getting the Yeti out off the dance color on their "problems to be fixed radar".

You are discussing the loss of potential profit. In that there is no argument about the potential loss. Disney loses out when DVC members don't provide occupy the rooms on their property they already pay for as it opens the door for others to swoop in and use their points on the cheap and thus take away a potential reservation at the same comparable resort level. I think it would be a big leap to say that everyone paying to rent points would pay rack rates for the same level; but, assuming its a high enough percentage - then it does take away from the bottom line. I still think a high percentage of WDW guests don't start the process by thinking a Deluxe costs $600/night and then goes about finding ways to get the same resort cheaper... I would argue that a high percentage start off with "X" being the amount they want to budget per night and find out that by renting points - they can move up to a different tier of resort.

Either way, it's potential profits that are being discussed. The loss of those profits, as you personally attest to, haven't been incentive enough to spur Disney to take action to change your mind.

Unless I'm understanding you wrong, you are painting a picture of the cost of going to the parks isn't justified in your opinion as the admission prices keep going up and the value of visiting goes down as more gets taken away from the parks and so little gets changed or added.

My point is that DVC members have already committed to the bottom line of the resort. Their "minimum" expectation in terms of their upfront costs and their renewal are apparently enough for TDO as even you would agree, they aren't taken enough action to change your opinion.

In my opinion, this is part of a larger problem the resort is facing. It has to do with diminishing returns for the guests on repeat visits. For almost the past 20 years, the resort has made it clear that it is focused on catering to the new guest at the expense of the repeat guest. I think that has to do with TDO's understanding of how expensive it can be keeping a repeat customer happy. It's over time that you notice "the flaw in the plan" (intentional Potter reference) that WDW's neglect has exposed. A repeat customer notices the cuts in entertainment and services. A new guest only sees what is there today. I keep picking on it; but, everyone can ride Stitch once. A new guest may love the idea of not having a car while in town. A repeat customer may get to a point where they understand that waiting for a bus isn't as quick as getting in a car. A repeat customer may get to the point where they do want to see what's down I-4 and that free bus isn't needed.

If TDO really was concerned about DVC members not spinning the turnstile, it would be as easy enough for them to fix if they just did one of the two things you suggest. Change the price of admission or change what's going on inside the parks. Obviously, changing what's going on inside the parks is very expensive and the least probable, so let's talk about the other. Admission price for DVC. If they really wanted, they could drastically drop admission. If they wanted. There is no reason why a DVC member couldn't be priced for admission on a significantly reduced scale like they price out guests from overseas versus locals. 75% off, 50% off... why should it matter in the grand scheme if they really cared about keeping DVC members coming back to the parks? The park admission per day for a resort guest on their 10th day is trivial versus a guest on their first day. The difference is that the sliding scale is based on how many days you stay. They want you to stay longer. In DVC terms, they would want you to buy more points. DVC members are the ultimate level of "long term stay".

I think it's clear that TDO has other priorities than appeasing DVC members already committed to long term contracts.

In a resort that is desperate for capacity (so much so, they are trying to play the shell game with FP+ and trick guests into thinking there is enough for everyone), repeat business is a luxury item. If they wanted to build a captive audience, they could easily do so by going back to the traditions that the Disney Parks legacy was built on.

Currently, I believe that TDO is clearly focused on the short term. Keep those first time visitors happy, or the people who come once every decade. Their operations and business model paint a picture of short term gains being he priority. People like us (you a DVC member and me a Premier Passport holder) are icing on their cake. TDO is arrogant enough to expect a high percentage of us pixie huffers to keep coming back.

I hate it as much as you do. I can foresee what the long term damage will be with this model. It pains me to have to provide honest advice to people when they ask for my help in going to WDW.

 

[LuvtheGoof]

I think that one of the main reasons that they don't mind occasional point renters, is that a certain percentage (even if only 10%) of renters may become buyers at a certain point.

 

[rudyjr13]

People are foolish not to try renting through a 3rd party or direct with a member vs. paying rack rates or even discounted rates through Disney. The savings is comical. Hopefully they don't close the loophole.

 

[Cesar R M]

People are foolish not to try renting through a 3rd party or direct with a member vs. paying rack rates or even discounted rates through Disney. The savings is comical. Hopefully they don't close the loophole.

Well, the problem is the waiting list.
I for example, just noticed how fast the AKL space went in february. Almost all sold out, except the big villas and bedrooms..

 

[marni1971]

Speaking of DVC, did I mention what an absolute clusterbomb the Poly rooms on sticks actually look? Totally destroying a view and a vista - one of WDWS original and best - probably forever for a privileged few is surely one of the biggest mistakes of recent times. It is a travesty. Thankfully we chose not to see inside of the resort.

 

[FrankLapidus]

Speaking of DVC, did I mention what an absolute clusterbomb the Poly rooms on sticks actually look? Totally destroying a view and a vista - one of WDWS original and best - probably forever for a privileged few is surely one of the biggest mistakes of recent times. It is a travesty. Thankfully we chose not to see inside of the resort.

Completely agree, they've destroyed that hotel. Count yourself lucky you didn't go inside, its so disheartening to see close-up just how much of what gave the Polynesian its charm and and character has been ripped out and stripped away. And the villas are just awful in every way.