Disney (and others) at the Box Office - Current State of Affairs

[TP2000]

Speaking for myself, I don’t care what they say but I believe they have a right to express their opinions without their words being misquoted and twisted out of shape by people with malicious intent.

But it's not 1965 and we aren't reading about this in a supermarket tabloid. It's 2025 and the entire planet has instant access on their phones to a clear HD video of Mr. Mackie coherently stating his opinion in English.

No misquotes or twisted context is required, nor really possible, when you have the actual HD video of Mr. Mackie's statement to the media available instantly to anyone on the planet.

That’s what happened with Zegler and it’s what’s happening with Mackie. They said nothing to provoke a “blow-up” and don’t deserve to have their opinions censored by corporate.

Apparently they both did say things, at least once (several times in the case of Miss Zegler) that caused a "blow-up". If there wasn't a blow-up, we wouldn't be talking about it here.

You may not agree that it's deserving of a blow-up, or you may agree strongly with Mr. Mackie that Captain America doesn't represent the actual country called "America". But enough people disagreed that it actually caused a blow-up.

 

[Disney Irish]

Celebrities are sent out to promote their film. They are suppose to be trained by PR to stay on script. When they screw up the script or the script is poorly worded, people instantly jump on it. Some are really good at handling these PR interviews and others like Zegler sound like morons when they didn't study their talking points.

You're making the assumption that in this case Mackie wasn't PR trained and doesn't stay on script, both of which doesn't appear to be the case.

Also as has been pointed out numerous times now, people are jumping all over a 10 second partial response clip from a larger response, ie its taken out of context.

Reasonable people can disagree about the wording, but as has been shown this same wording has been used to describe the character many many times, including by the previous actor.

 

[coffeefan]

Did the chronically outraged people even watch Captain America: Civil War?
Sure, it's fiction but the themes were pretty obvious even then.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Did the chronically outraged people even watch Captain America: Civil War?
Sure, it's fiction but the themes were pretty obvious even then.

No…that one was pretty good with a bunch of good parts/actors

Including Mackey and Stan

 

[erasure fan1]

No I don't. You have spoken about getting past absolutes, except that is what you are doing now.

That was intentional because the responses I was getting. When the responses were I don't want a corporate canned response or limiting their right to express themselves. Yea, not what I said, at all. So just because I said a little PR training isn't a bad idea and I'm met with, their free speech shouldn't be taken away ,and statements like I just said. That's why I said it, to try and get a better response.

Are people so fragile today that they can't handle that a movie character from the comics isn't representing just a single nation but all people? No amount of rewording is going to change this faux outrage

Absolutely. Did you not think when you heard the clip, oh man, this is going to blow up? I know I did. You are telling me that he thinks cap doesn't represent one single nation. So I'm guessing, same as you, that if that's what is meant, he also thinks any person can look up to captain America. I don't think it's taking away anything from a personal standpoint, it's right in line with what we know. But it's a bit hard to say how he should rephrase it when you or I really don't actually know what he thinks. But the overall point is, maybe there's a better way to phrase it that does keep it his personal feelings. There's multiple ways to say things to get a feeling across. So just because he shifts how he says it, doesn't mean the meaning has to be different.

I just happen not to agree with it. From my perspective, it isn’t necessary and wouldn’t actually fix the issue, because those looking to agitate will always find a way

Fair enough. For me I personally don't not try things because I think they won't work. I try it, and if it doesn't work, try something new. Maybe I'm just more optimistic. Haters gonna hate, just as the sun shall rise. So do you think if he left off just the "and I don’t think the term ‘America’ should be one of those" we'd be having this conversation at all? I think we aren't, it's not a blip on anyone's radar.

 

[Disney Irish]

That was intentional because the responses I was getting. When the responses were I don't want a corporate canned response or limiting their right to express themselves. Yea, not what I said, at all. So just because I said a little PR training isn't a bad idea and I'm met with, their free speech shouldn't be taken away ,and statements like I just said. That's why I said it, to try and get a better response.

Well maybe change the discourse then if you're not getting the responses you think you should be getting; instead you're doing the very thing that you're accusing others of. Or maybe better yet realize that your stance is just not going agreed upon by the others here, so no reason to double down and just start doing the very thing you accuse them of.

Also its fairly clear Mackie has a lot of PR training. Just because its not worded the way you think it should doesn't mean he's not had PR training or that he doesn't have a PR team around him.

Absolutely. Did you not think when you heard the clip, oh man, this is going to blow up? I know I did. You are telling me that he thinks cap doesn't represent one single nation. So I'm guessing, same as you, that if that's what is meant, he also thinks any person can look up to captain America. I don't think it's taking away anything from a personal standpoint, it's right in line with what we know. But it's a bit hard to say how he should rephrase it when you or I really don't actually know what he thinks. But the overall point is, maybe there's a better way to phrase it that does keep it his personal feelings. There's multiple ways to say things to get a feeling across. So just because he shifts how he says it, doesn't mean the meaning has to be different.

No, I actually thought I heard it before by others so didn't think it was going to be a big deal. But then I remembered where I heard it before when I read that Forbes article I posted, Chris Evans basically said the exact same thing when he was asked the same question when playing the role. And yet no one jumped all over him when he said it. Heck as provided example here, Cap himself said it at various times in the comics. So this is not like some foreign stance in relation to this character. And as pointed out even in the MCU Cap goes against "America", its the whole basis for Civil War.

So yeah all these people outraged need to get a bit of perspective here. They don't even understand the character in which they are outraged over.

 

[LittleBuford]

So do you think if he left off just the "and I don’t think the term ‘America’ should be one of those" we'd be having this conversation at all?

No, I don't. It's true that his words provided the agitators with a perfect vehicle, though I believe they would have found another, perhaps less effective, pretext to cast their aspersions anyway. You are right that media training would probably result in fewer incidents of this type, but I think it's the actors themselves who should decide whether to receive such training. I personally don't believe it would address the root of the problem.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

The fact that both actors said approximately the same thing in interviews is proof of PR training.

There is no issue here.

 

[Agent H]

The fact that both actors said approximately the same thing in interviews is proof of PR training.

There is no issue here.

What do you mean both actors? Did I miss something ?

 

[Disney Irish]

What do you mean both actors? Did I miss something ?

Chris Evans gave the same response when asked a similar question back in 2011. Which basically confirms that Mackie has a PR team that provided training on what to say.

 

[Agent H]

Chris Evans gave the same response when asked a similar question back in 2011. Which basically confirms that Mackie has a PR team that provided training on what to say.

That’s actually pretty sweet

 

[MagicMouseFan]

So which is it then, do people only care about the content itself or do they care about all the external things that come at them about said content? I've been told over and over and over that as long as the content is good it doesn't matter all the other external things said about the content, it'll find an audience. So is that not true? Or do people actually care about what is said about the content prior to seeing it more than people here want to admit?

That’s what we’re about to find out. Captain America was tracking before the recent comments to open at $95 million (source). If it stays that way, I’d say the comments had no effect

recent Disney openings have been much stronger:

• Inside Out 2 – $154.2M

• Deadpool & Wolverine – $211.4M

• Moana 2 – $221M (5-day Thanksgiving weekend)

Even within Marvel, this is on the lower end:

• Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3 – $118.4M

• Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania – $106.1M

• Thor: Love and Thunder – $144.1M

Cap is already tracking lower than most recent Marvel and Disney films. Given Disney’s strong box office run lately, they might even be lowballing expectations.

With the recent success of Disney and Marvel, plus the advantage of opening on Presidents’ Day weekend, this should at least hit or exceed $95 million.

 

[Chi84]

That’s what we’re about to find out. Captain America was tracking before the recent comments to open at $95 million (source). If it stays that way, I’d say the comments had no effect

recent Disney openings have been much stronger:

• Inside Out 2 – $154.2M

• Deadpool & Wolverine – $211.4M

• Moana 2 – $221M (5-day Thanksgiving weekend)

Even within Marvel, this is on the lower end:

• Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3 – $118.4M

• Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania – $106.1M

• Thor: Love and Thunder – $144.1M

Cap is already tracking lower than most recent Marvel and Disney films. Given Disney’s strong box office run lately, they might even be lowballing expectations.

With the recent success of Disney and Marvel, plus the advantage of opening on Presidents’ Day weekend, this should at least hit or exceed $95 million.

If it does better, will it be because the comments helped it?

 

[Disstevefan1]

If it does better, will it be because the comments helped it?

Just my opinion, if it does better it will be because its a good movie and folks like it.

 

[LittleBuford]

Just my opinion, if it does better it will be because its a good movie and folks like it.

I believe that was the point @Chi84 was getting at. When a film does poorly, people here scramble to attribute its failure to sociopolitical factors (a gay storyline, the views of one of its actors, etc.). When it does well, however, we’re told that all that audiences care about is the quality of the movie, with all sociopolitical considerations swept aside. This is not a consistent or fair framing.

 

[Disstevefan1]

If you believe the posters here, no Disney movie ever exceeded expectations. The goalpost just keeps moving like with Mufasa.

Mufasa broke even/made some money. That's good enough for me.

When movies lose money, its just bad business.

Disney does NOT run their theme parks business to lose money, only to make money while constantly cutting costs.

 

[LittleBuford]

Which movie was a flop?

Lightyear, Strange World, Wish.

Which movie exceeded expectations?

Elemental, Inside Out 2.

 

[Agent H]

Has sociopolitical factors ever hurt a brand?

Yes the marvel sucks narrative which is fueled by those social political factors has definitely spread out into the “ real world “ and combined with the lack of promotion because of the actors strike was partly responsible for the failure of the marvels

 

[LittleBuford]

The folks who scramble to attribute its failure to sociopolitical factors (a gay storyline, the views of one of its actors, etc.) are simply wrong.

Folks simply want to watch good movies, if the movie is good, it will sell tickets.

Look at that, we're in agreement!

(That said, I do think Disney's recent box-office slump was due in part to ideological factors, but less because of any specific film than because of a more general opposition to the company stirred up by certain prominent individuals and outlets.)

 

[LittleBuford]

maybe exceeding expectations wasn’t the right way to put it but my point is films like wicked and the Mario movie both of which definitely had “woke” elements are fine with them but because films like the marvels and light year either flopped or were significantly beaten by their competitors those are woke these people don’t even have the spines to stand up for their already disgusting opinions

Barbie is another excellent example of the point you're making.