Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[correcaminos]

I live and work in America and am visiting my family in London for Christmas. I’m not speaking as someone who doesn’t understand the situation in the US or hasn’t experienced it firsthand. Still, I can’t claim that I’m doing anything more than guessing at this point.

No but what you are seeing there is not a reflection here. That was my point. What I was talking about in Feb of 2020 worrying about wide spread shut downs are not at all remotely happening here. Not feeling the same thing you are is all. In fact places I know are still moving forward with removing remote work after the new year.

I agree, I don't think we will return to 2020 restrictions here in the US.

I work at a hospital (non-clinical) and there are no plans to return to remote work. The public schools aren't returning to remote. The most Chicago has been discussing is asking businesses to start requiring patrons to be fully vaccinated (with proof) in order to enter. We already have indoor masking. I think possibly capacity limits were on the table again for restaurants (but hasn't gone anywhere), but no full-closures being discussed at all.

My husband's company is removing most remote access soon. I have seen a day of remote due to lack of transportation but nothing more yet. No talks in our school board as well.

 

[LittleBuford]

No but what you are seeing there is not a reflection here.

I know that. I’m saying that I believe what’s happening here—an exponential explosion of cases and the attendant effects and responses—will soon happen in the US as well. I hope I’m wrong.

 

[Touchdown]

I know that. I’m saying that I believe what’s happening here—an exponential explosion of cases and the attendant effects and responses—will soon happen in the US as well. I hope I’m wrong.

It’s already happening in the US, give it two weeks. That said until it get apocalyptic we won’t have shut downs. If early findings in Europe are right, the shutdowns will happen in 1 month.

 

[Lilofan]

It’s already happening in the US, give it two weeks. That said until it get apocalyptic we won’t have shut downs. If early findings in Europe are right, the shutdowns will happen in 1 month.

Biden will talk on Tuesday to the nation according to his team on what plans will be implemented if the numbers keep rising and stress again for the unvaccinated who are able to, to get vaccinated.

 

[Touchdown]

Biden will talk on Tuesday to the nation according to his team on what plans will be implemented if the numbers keep rising and stress again for the unvaccinated who are able to, to get vaccinated.

I know but the buzz is already no plans for shutdowns, because it would be political suicide. That speech will give political cover and paint opposition into a corner when (assuming the American public does nothing) things get really bad to make lockdowns in a month.

 

[Andrew C]

I can see mask mandates, vaccination ramp-ups, massive testing ramp up, and capacity limits for a period of time. European style health passes for restaurants, museums, arenas would be ideal but we know that won't happen here.

That didn’t help places like Canada as well as many other counties, so what are we doing? Why does the world keep wanting to implement the same failed strategy that his been in place since prior to vaccines that was supposed to buy us time until vaccines became available? With the worldwide vaccine rates, it hasn’t worked. And it won’t work. Why do we expect different results? Do we want to lock down one or twice a year for the next decade or longer.

why do countries like the US and Canada not have a test surplus to prevent shortages? Why do we not have free, quality in home tests readily available? Why aren’t the pills that have been developed by several companies to prevent hospitalization not being fast tracked? They should already be available.
It’s sad how much the world sucks at this. We have been warned since the beginning about mutations, yet the strategy the world continues to have in place just drags out the possibility of further ones. Makes no sense. It’s insane. Time to adjust what is priority.

 

[Lilofan]

I know but the buzz is already no plans for shutdowns, because it would be political suicide. That speech will give political cover and paint opposition into a corner when (assuming the American public does nothing) things get really bad to make lockdowns in a month.

My bet is people as some already are panicking, waking up to reality , scared about future lock downs and rolling up their sleeves to get the shots. Some I know who were anti vax , either have contacted covid, survived through the symptoms , nervous about future lock downs that costs some their jobs and businesses etc , turned the corner and got vaccinated. Fear and facts are big motivators.

 

[dreday3]

If it moves as fast and furious as they say, shutdowns aren't going to do a darn thing except close some businesses for good.

Push for more vaccinations and for businesses to check for vaccinations to allow entry. Masks indoors.

 

[jlhwdw]

Here's my question - if the timing wasn't what it is (six days before Christmas) would we be talking shutdowns this week in the US? Is the timing of Christmas going to make this worse because even the most vocal supporters for shutdowns know it's simply impractical to expect for the Christmas holiday? If it was like last time and the current date was in mid-March, would we be seeing businesses closing up shop again, Disney potentially announcing a month long US park closure, etc.?

 

[Lilofan]

Here's my question - if the timing wasn't what it is (six days before Christmas) would we be talking shutdowns this week in the US? Is the timing of Christmas going to make this worse because even the most vocal supporters for shutdowns know it's simply impractical to expect for the Christmas holiday? If it was like last time and the current date was in mid-March, would we be seeing businesses closing up shop again, Disney potentially announcing a month long US park closure, etc.?

I can't see shutdowns in the next several days. Not only are a number of people flying but a number may already on the road driving to their destination. If that is the case of a shutdown there may be no room at the inn for some to stay and or eat.

 

[Lilofan]

To be clear, I’m not talking about government restrictions; I know the US far too well to think that those would happen on any but the local level. I’m talking about private businesses and universities deciding to temporarily close or, if practicable, go remote.

If locations stop operation , the sad reality is that operational staff are not all needed and layoffs may happen.

 

[Andrew C]

If it moves as fast and furious as they say, shutdowns aren't going to do a darn thing except close some businesses for good.

Push for more vaccinations and for businesses to check for vaccinations to allow entry. Masks indoors.

That still won’t bring us closer to the end of the pandemic. What is the end game here? That 95% or more of the worlds population will magically get vaccinated? It’s clear at this point that pretty much all developed nations put all of their eggs into the vaccine basket when some of that should have been diverted to at home treatments to keep people out of hospital. With the exception of a few companies, this was largely ignored. And is still slow walked today.

 

[correcaminos]

I know that. I’m saying that I believe what’s happening here—an exponential explosion of cases and the attendant effects and responses—will soon happen in the US as well. I hope I’m wrong.

You are still missing my point. It has been exploding here for quite some time in my state. They simply do not care.

Here's my question - if the timing wasn't what it is (six days before Christmas) would we be talking shutdowns this week in the US? Is the timing of Christmas going to make this worse because even the most vocal supporters for shutdowns know it's simply impractical to expect for the Christmas holiday? If it was like last time and the current date was in mid-March, would we be seeing businesses closing up shop again, Disney potentially announcing a month long US park closure, etc.?

Have you seen what has happened in Florida? People really stopped caring. Look at some of the posters here. They prove that some couldn't care less about numbers. And it's our leaders not caring either. So if WDW didn't shut down for insane numbers with Delta, why now?

 

[JoeCamel]

That still won’t bring us closer to the end of the pandemic. What is the end game here? That 95% or more of the worlds population will magically get vaccinated? It’s clear at this point that pretty much all developed nations put all of their eggs into the vaccine basket when some of that should have been diverted to at home treatments to keep people out of hospital. With the exception of a few companies, this was largely ignored. And is still slow walked today.

What at home treatments are being slow walked?

 

[LittleBuford]

You are still missing my point. It has been exploding here for quite some time in my state. They simply do not care.

Numbers in the US aren't yet what they are in parts of Europe. Cases are at an all-time high here in the UK. This graph illustrates what I mean far better than I'm able to convey in words:

Free to read: Coronavirus tracked: has the epidemic peaked near you?

Find any country or US state in the live-updating and customisable version of the FT’s Covid-19 trajectory graphs

ig.ft.com

Things have changed here very quickly indeed in the two weeks since I arrived. All I'm saying is that the same may happen imminently in the US. I'm not trying to be pessimistic, merely sharing my sense of the situation.

 

[mmascari]

That still won’t bring us closer to the end of the pandemic. What is the end game here? That 95% or more of the worlds population will magically get vaccinated? It’s clear at this point that pretty much all developed nations put all of their eggs into the vaccine basket when some of that should have been diverted to at home treatments to keep people out of hospital. With the exception of a few companies, this was largely ignored. And is still slow walked today.

There has been all kinds of work done on treatments. It just doesn’t get the same press as vaccination. It also hasn’t been as successful. Between probable quack solutions, real ones, initial treatment and treatment changes as people progress. The treatment options don’t end this either.

Somewhere I saw a story about using lasers in the nasal cavity to kill the virus. No sharks, so it couldn’t have been that serious. Must not have worked out either. (Not some political story, an actual company trying something, or at least proposing.) On the other hand, we seem to have several treatments with some success, at least when used in specific timeframes and circumstances.

Vaccination is still the only way out, even if that means another new vaccine to deal with a new variant. That we are unable to do it is a policy problem, not a technical one.


I doubt we lockdown even a little again, not for COVID anyway. The lockdown steps were a brute force tool. They work to buy time until a better tool is available. We have a better tool now, there’s no reason to buy time. We’ve chosen this path as a group. At least enough members of the group have to drag the rest with them.

 

[correcaminos]

Numbers in the US aren't yet what they are in parts of Europe. Cases are at an all-time high here in the UK. This graph illustrates what I mean far better than I'm able to convey in words:

Free to read: Coronavirus tracked: has the epidemic peaked near you?

Find any country or US state in the live-updating and customisable version of the FT’s Covid-19 trajectory graphs

ig.ft.com

Things have changed here very quickly indeed in the two weeks since I arrived. All I'm saying is that the same may happen imminently in the US. I'm not trying to be pessimistic, merely sharing my sense of the situation.

Look I don't know how to tell you, parts of my area are REALLY bad. If you don't want to believe me fine, but some parts have significantly passed what it was last winter. Believe what you want but my reality is that people just don't care. So please respect that you don't know what my state is like. The numbers per 100k are astounding in many areas here and just as bad as UK (one county is at 165 per 100k with enough floating around or above 100). And yet no masks, no caring. Some places will never care. I'm lucky that my cases are half of that around 50 per 100k but we have some insane numbers. I get you want to claim people just aren't seeing it yet and that we'll jump off and be more careful, but I hate to break it to you - people are jerks and simply won't care.

 

[Heppenheimer]

That still won’t bring us closer to the end of the pandemic. What is the end game here? That 95% or more of the worlds population will magically get vaccinated? It’s clear at this point that pretty much all developed nations put all of their eggs into the vaccine basket when some of that should have been diverted to at home treatments to keep people out of hospital. With the exception of a few companies, this was largely ignored. And is still slow walked today.

We had the monoclonal antibody treatments approved and in use before the vaccines came on line, and we'll soon have two oral antiviral treatments available for a pathogen that nobody knew about a little over two years ago, so clearly, no, the developed world did not "put all their eggs in the vaccine basket". Despite what some internet commenters might say, the fight against this disease (or any disease) was never an all-or-nothing investment in one strategy. The treatments complement the prevention strategies, but primary prevention is still the most important first step.

The treatments, BTW, must be given in a very time-sensitive window to maximize their efficacy. Considering that the monoclonal antibody infusion requires time and skilled nursing to administer (two resources in short supply at present), we won't be able to infuse our way out of the pandemic.

And now there's reports of our current monoclonal treatments not working against omicron...

 

[Andrew C]

What at home treatments are being slow walked?

Merck submitted their drug for FDA approval in October. Pfizer submitted one of their anti viral drugs in November. Neither have been approved by the FDA. The EU isn’t even going to consider the Merck drug until next year. As soon as they were submitted to the FDA, the advisory panel and the FDA itself should have gotten into a room and been able to either approve or deny within a week. If they need to work all hours of the day to cover all necessary steps, so be it. There is no sense of urgency. Really, they should have treated this type of drug development as operation warp speed 2.

are these pills even in the hands of pharmacies across the country, ready to give out with a doctor subscription immediately? If not, why not?

 

[LittleBuford]

Look I don't know how to tell you, parts of my area are REALLY bad. If you don't want to believe me fine, but some parts have significantly passed what it was last winter. Believe what you want but my reality is that people just don't care. So please respect that you don't know what my state is like. The numbers per 100k are astounding in many areas here and just as bad as UK. And yet no masks, no caring. Some places will never care. I'm lucky that my cases are half of that around 50 per 100k but we have some insane numbers. I get you want to claim people just aren't seeing it yet and that we'll jump off and be more careful, but I hate to break it to you - people are jerks and simply won't care.

I'm not sure why I'm having such trouble conveying my point, which isn't at all what you seem to think it is. I'm not doubting anyone's experience of their own location. I'm saying that the explosion of Omicron-caused cases seen here in the UK and elsewhere in Europe simply hasn't happened yet in the US. That's just a statement of fact, not a matter of opinion. I'm not expecting anyone to agree with my assessment of what will (or might) happen once Omicron truly does take hold in the US, but I don't think I'm saying anything controversial by simply pointing out that variant has thus far had more of an effect on this side of the Atlantic than in the US.