Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[BrianLo]

So out of almost 100,000 doses given in this group of 20 most had mild myocarditis that was treated with anti inflammatory meds?

Facetiously, the biggest side effect was some young men needed Advil.

 

[GoofGoof]

This is such an excellent description of how it works. Thank you. I will be stealing to use in conversation!

It’s also how I have described covid mitigations as well. Lots of people look at everything as linear and a yes or no like a light switch. I’ve been a supporter of the dial approach. Cases drop and things get better, dial back some mitigations, but if things then get worse again then dial them back up. Should have been the approach everywhere but some places flipped the switch and then refused to “go back“.

On vaccines there has been a similar attitude. We either hit X% vaccinated and we reach herd immunity or it’s a failure. The reality is that as we get more and more people vaccinated there’s a positive result that occurs gradually. So yes, if we are at 65% vaccinated that’s not nearly enough to stop all community spread, but it’s still better than if we were at 45% or zero vaccinated. The spread is still less. So going from 65% to 80% may not be enough for full herd immunity it will still make a big difference.

 

[JoeCamel]

It’s also how I have described covid mitigations as well. Lots of people look at everything as linear and a yes or no like a light switch. I’ve been a supporter of the dial approach. Cases drop and things get better, dial back some mitigations, but if things then get worse again then dial them back up. Should have been the approach everywhere but some places flipped the switch and then refused to “go back“.

On vaccines there has been a similar attitude. We either hit X% vaccinated and we reach herd immunity or it’s a failure. The reality is that as we get more and more people vaccinated there’s a positive result that occurs gradually. So yes, if we are at 65% vaccinated that’s not nearly enough to stop all community spread, but it’s still better than if we were at 45% or zero vaccinated. The spread is still less. So going from 65% to 80% may not be enough for full herd immunity it will still make a big difference.

The positive benefit is of course less dead people and maybe the health care community can go back to cancer and heart health to catch a break. Thousands less deaths since the vaccines began.

 

[Nubs70]

It’s also how I have described covid mitigations as well. Lots of people look at everything as linear and a yes or no like a light switch. I’ve been a supporter of the dial approach. Cases drop and things get better, dial back some mitigations, but if things then get worse again then dial them back up. Should have been the approach everywhere but some places flipped the switch and then refused to “go back“.

On vaccines there has been a similar attitude. We either hit X% vaccinated and we reach herd immunity or it’s a failure. The reality is that as we get more and more people vaccinated there’s a positive result that occurs gradually. So yes, if we are at 65% vaccinated that’s not nearly enough to stop all community spread, but it’s still better than if we were at 45% or zero vaccinated. The spread is still less. So going from 65% to 80% may not be enough for full herd immunity it will still make a big difference.

The anti vaxxers need to be rounded up and isolated until the pandemic passes..

 

[Disney Analyst]

Alberta has been in rough shape, but this thread. Gut wrenching. The sad reality our health heroes face, as do the families of those who die.

 

[Lilofan]

This is why I have to laugh at people who go on and on about possible side effects, meanwhile they have never questioned anything else they've taken, and often with drugs they take those for prolonged periods...

Meanwhile, our bodies in charge are following the science, and making recommendations as they need to. The system is working.

I don't laugh but feel sorry for the misguided ones who are more concerned about vaccine side effects as opposed to symptoms of Covid but these guys will see that parts of society will shut their offerings to them to enjoy and spend their money on, companies firing them for refusing to get vaccinated etc, anti vax will see increased costs in some areas because they are unvax etc.

 

[Nubs70]

Alberta has been in rough shape, but this thread. Gut wrenching. The sad reality our health heroes face, as do the families of those who die.

Covid or not, this is a conversation Dr's have thousands of times .

 

[DisneyCane]

Alberta has been in rough shape, but this thread. Gut wrenching. The sad reality our health heroes face, as do the families of those who die.

Covid or not, this is a conversation Dr's have thousands of times .

It's sad that COVID is leading to more of these conversations but this isn't something abnormal in general. Last year, I was given a similar prognosis for my dad when he was in the hospital completely unrelated to COVID. It wasn't somehow better to hear that there is really nothing that they could do just because it wasn't COVID. It was also a sudden, out of the blue issue like people who get severe COVID.

 

[correcaminos]

The anti vaxxers need to be rounded up and isolated until the pandemic passes..

There are times when I wish they'd stay home. In my circle, they are the ones who were bad about masks and staying home the first time.

Covid or not, this is a conversation Dr's have thousands of times .

Not untrue however I can tell you my loved ones see this as senseless for the vast majority of the covid deaths now, which makes it harder.

 

[DisneyFan32]

MSN

I hope this fall and winter will be much better this time,
also but this:

MSN

I don't know what November brings as the surge will be reduced thanks to vaccines as kids will be vaccinated but what about babies will get vaccinated soon?

 

[GoofGoof]

The anti vaxxers need to be rounded up and isolated until the pandemic passes..

Yeah, nobody actually said that or wants that. The vast majority of people who aren’t vaccinated claim to not be anti vaxx anyway. They get quite triggered if you use that term. People can think and do whatever they want on vaccinations (nobody is being forced to be vaccinated) but there are consequences to those actions. In this case it’s becoming harder and harder to work certain places and do certain public activities. Everyone has a choice.

 

[lewisc]

A possibility is that some might be briefly admitted for observation, if they are symptomatic and high risk. High risk cardiac patients get admitted all the time based on symotoms and medical history alone for "rule out" , which usually takes about 24-48 hours. Same with likely transient ischemic attacks.

Insurance companies generally put down somewhat strict admission and length of stay criteria, depending on the diagnosis. If the admission doesn't meet the criteria, then the hospital often eats the cost. I haven't worked as a hospitalist since before the pandemic, so I don't know how well defined the criteria for COVID are, but it is possible that if the standards are still evolving, their might be a little more leeway for a hospital to admit a patient under "out of an abundance of caution" standards. Most of these patients would probably get discharged fairly quickly.

Insurance companies, for many diagnosis/procedures, pay a flat amount. Patient stays in the hospital too long and the hospital loses money. Fewer days the hospital makes more money.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Yeah, nobody actually said that or wants that. The vast majority of people who aren’t vaccinated claim to not be anti vaxx anyway. They get quite triggered if you use that term. People can think and do whatever they want on vaccinations (nobody is being forced to be vaccinated) but there are consequences to those actions. In this case it’s becoming harder and harder to work certain places and do certain public activities. Everyone has a choice.

Of course people did say that about “the vulnerable”. Amazing how that was okay for them to suggest.

 

[The Mom]

Insurance companies, for many diagnosis/procedures, pay a flat amount. Patient stays in the hospital too long and the hospital loses money. Fewer days the hospital makes more money.

If the patient stays in too long the insurance company also loses money, so they (insurance companies) use a one size fits all standard for length of stay, choosing the best possible outcome as the standard.

 

[correcaminos]

Of course people did say that about “the vulnerable”. Amazing how that was okay for them to suggest.

They did... and still do. This is why sometimes I lose patience and wish they'd all stay home. Many who are against this, as I mentioned in my circle, are the ones who never distanced or masked or whatever. They have yet to feel their share of the burden. It's rested largely with others. At this point I'd never round them up, but my guilt in making their life harder diminishes every day.

 

[GoofGoof]

Of course people did say that about “the vulnerable”. Amazing how that was okay for them to suggest.

Yeah, ironic isn’t it. A year ago a group of people were all for locking the vulnerable away to let them do what we want. Now the same people aren’t feeling too good about being the ones who can’t do stuff. Shoe on the other foot.

 

[Heppenheimer]

Covid or not, this is a conversation Dr's have thousands of times .

This usually doesn't happen on a daily basis in hospital settings, and especially where the loved ones can't be there. More often than not, someone with a terminal illness goes on hospice, and they die somewhere comfortable. That isn't possible with COVID, hence all the people dying in ICUs.

For an anecdotal before/after COVID example... when I worked as a hospitalist (pre-COVID), I probably filled out less than 3 death certificates per month. On a bad month, maybe 5. I'm still in contact with my old colleagues, and during the worst COVID surges, they were declaring multiple deaths (at the same hospital where I worked) on a daily basis.

Not only does COVID-19 kill far too many, but it even denies them the chance of a relatively peaceful hospice death.

 

[Heppenheimer]

If the patient stays in too long the insurance company also loses money, so they (insurance companies) use a one size fits all standard for length of stay, choosing the best possible outcome as the standard.

I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing. The longer the patient stays in the hospital, the higher the chances of hospital-based complications, like nosocomial infections, DVTs, falls, etc. I've seen it play out enough times to be convinced that insurance length of stay considerations aren't only about cold hard cash, they actually apply a necessary pressure to prevent complications.

 

[Lilofan]

The positive benefit is of course less dead people and maybe the health care community can go back to cancer and heart health to catch a break. Thousands less deaths since the vaccines began.

Someone brainstormed an idea before the recent NFL Panthers / Saints game for football fans in downtown Charlotte to see. A fake funeral home was advertised on the side of a van stating " Don't Get Vaccinated ". I support this mindset to raise awareness to the anti vax. Meckelenburg County, NC stands at 58% of residents fully vaccinated.

 

[DisneyCane]

I don't think this is necessarily a bad thing. The longer the patient stays in the hospital, the higher the chances of hospital-based complications, like nosocomial infections, DVTs, falls, etc. I've seen it play out enough times to be convinced that insurance length of stay considerations aren't only about cold hard cash, they actually apply a necessary pressure to prevent complications.

While my father-in-law was undergoing cancer treatment and associated surgeries, every time he was in the hospital it seemed like his desire was to stay as long as possible. I guess he felt safer being there. My wife was always getting on him to go home as soon as he was medically able because of the risks associated with extended hospital stays. He finally started listening.

Bottom line is that you should always try to spend as little time in the hospital as possible. Anything that can be treated as an outpatient should be.