News Zootopia and Moana Blue Sky concepts for Disney's Animal Kingdom

[BlakeW39]

I find the experience of Indy to be superior, that’s for sure. But there’s also a case that they’re fundamentally different enough to make a direct comparison unfair. Jeremy Thompson, on his outstanding blog “Roller Coaster Philosophy,” has a thought-provoking analysis of Dinosaur that suggests it has its own strengths: https://www.rollercoasterphilosophy.com/2012/animal-kingdom/ (Dinosaur review is near the end).

The first time I rode Dinosaur (well, CTX), in 1998, it was before having been on Indy—and I was blown away. And I thought the “race against time” aspect created by the dialogue between Seeker and the computer really created a feeling of “stakes” (as Thompson notes). Also, to me, the lack of music actually adds believability, i.e., makes it easier to suspend disbelief. Obviously, though, I wish they’d had the budget for more background scenery…

@BlakeW39 “Dinoland was really never that immersive. Do you know where dinosaur fossils are found? Out in the badlands, rock formations in the desert. Yet Dinoland has almost no rockwork, no placemaking to make someone feel as if they have been transported out to where they find fossils buried under layers of rock. Outside the Boneyard (and Dinorama, which I guess you could say is 'themed' to a cheap carnival— lol at that), Dinoland USA is mostly just unthemed Florida swampland. Yes it has a deep backstory thanks to Joe Rohde, but it's not a quality theme park land, nor is it really immersive in any meaningful way.”

Yeah, I was explicitly excluding Dino-Rama, and I also noted that more rockwork (e.g., with “fossils”) would go a long way.

However, the “dispute” over whether it’s “immersive” might be semantic here. It’s not aesthetically or emotionally compelling, but it seems literally “immersive” in that the details of the buildings are realistic/accurate. Again, though, even with this definition of “immersive,” that just means it “immerses” us in something that’s not compelling (a tiny little town in the middle of nowhere where fossils were discovered… ok). So I think we’re really on the same page here.

well, I was saying Dinoland wasn't immersive because it doesn't transport you to a new place, because as I said most of it is just unthemed Florida swampland. But I suppose you're right that the word 'immersive' may not be the best adjective to describe that. Now CTX/Dino, originally, was a good attraction, I'm not sure how anyone can think otherwise. Today, no, but in the past it was very good imo. I suppose to each their own.

either way, I think retheming the attraction, or the area as a whole to either Moana or Zootopia is a mistake. Even though I don't particularly like Dinoland, I'd still take it over yet another Iger movie land to be frank. Merchandisey cartoon lands imo are not the best direction for DAK to go in. A different version of a dinosaur themed land would be a greatly superior choice imho by a lot.

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

The first time I rode Dinosaur (well, CTX), in 1998, it was before having been on Indy—and I was blown away. And I thought the “race against time” aspect created by the dialogue between Seeker and the computer really created a feeling of “stakes” (as Thompson notes). Also, to me, the lack of music actually adds believability, i.e., makes it easier to suspend disbelief. Obviously, though, I wish they’d had the budget for more background scenery…

I haven't ridden since 2017, but I still love it for all of the reasons you stated. I know the animatronics need work, and the lighting is weird, and all of the different beeves people have with it, but it's still one of my favorite experiences. I sincerely hope it's still there by the time I get back.

 

[Incomudro]

I haven't ridden since 2017, but I still love it for all of the reasons you stated. I know the animatronics need work, and the lighting is weird, and all of the different beeves people have with it, but it's still one of my favorite experiences. I sincerely hope it's still there by the time I get back.

Yeah, I keep chiming in - I love the ride.
Absolutely love the ride system, I think it's one of the best in any of the parks.
I've also loved dinosaurs since I was a kid, so... There's that.

 

[BlakeW39]

Yeah, I keep chiming in - I love the ride.
Absolutely love the ride system, I think it's one of the best in any of the parks.
I've also loved dinosaurs since I was a kid, so... There's that.

Same, I've loved dinosaurs (and animals) since I was very young and that makes DAK a perfect park for my interests. Replacing the only representation for dinosaurs at DAK with just some random cartoon characters is dumb and ill-conceived.

 

[BlakeW39]

I haven't ridden since 2017, but I still love it for all of the reasons you stated. I know the animatronics need work, and the lighting is weird, and all of the different beeves people have with it, but it's still one of my favorite experiences. I sincerely hope it's still there by the time I get back.

I will say, back in the day it was one of the most underrated experiences on property. Like it was genuinely excellent.

 

[MrPromey]

....

Why can't we get a revitalized, immersive Dinoland? Similar to how DCA was redone to actually romanticize California and Hollywood (before Iger ruined it with Pixar Pier, etc.). Sigh.

Because the original came and went and because this movie bombed at the box office?

Unless they decide to come out with a new movie about dinosaurs, I don't see it happening.

Who knows, maybe Rex and Trixie can get their own spinoff the way Buzz did - the movie about the dinosaurs they're based on that Andy loved?

 

[MrPromey]

They also could have just left GMR as is, even if it wasn't overly popular, because the park needs the capacity. MMRR as a new build would have been a much bigger help to the park.

... and MMRR would have had a much smaller footprint in a new build (like DL) since it would have been going into something built for it rather than being stuck in a gigantic show building built for a much larger ride, now leaving a ton of space unused and wasted.

GMR was in desperate need of updating* - not a replacing.


*not just adding movies to the end reel but a new story line with or without interaction elements and serious re-working of some of the show scenes. From almost day one, Tarzan felt ripe for replacing; Alien, while intially very cool was well past it's sell by date as a "non-classic" movie (at the time it opened) by the time it closed, etc. There is a lot they could have done to "fix" this ride over the years if they were interested in really investing in it but I'm sure they were happy to replace it with something that likely has considerably lower maintenance costs.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

... and MMRR would have had a much smaller footprint in a new build (like DL) since it would have been going into something built for it rather than being stuck in a gigantic show building built for a much larger ride, now leaving a ton of space unused and wasted.

While I’ve personally advocated that MMRR should’ve been a new build in Animation Courtyard, I don’t think there is a substantial amount of unused space in the show building.

 

[MrPromey]

While I’ve personally advocated that MMRR should’ve been a new build in Animation Courtyard, I don’t think there is a substantial amount of unused space in the show building.

According to marni1971, the layout for the new ride left substantial chunks of unused space in the building.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

According to marni1971 the layout for the new ride left substantial chunks of unused space in the building.

I remember he discussed empty space but I didn’t recall it being anything massive

 

[MrPromey]

I remember he discussed empty space but I didn’t recall it being anything massive

He or someone else posted a mock-showing how the new attraction fit and while it wasn't enough room for a whole other ride, I'd speculated at the time if they had plans to use some of that space for retail with a new forward face somewhere) or office space or like warehouse/storage or what and he said the plan was just to leave it empty.

Maybe my use of the word "ton" was a bit of an exageration but it definetly seemed like a non-trival amount to basically just wall off and forget about, especially in a park somewhat starved for space.

 

[BlakeW39]

... and MMRR would have had a much smaller footprint in a new build (like DL) since it would have been going into something built for it rather than being stuck in a gigantic show building built for a much larger ride, now leaving a ton of space unused and wasted.

GMR was in desperate need of updating* - not a replacing.


*not just adding movies to the end reel but a new story line with or without interaction elements and serious re-working of some of the show scenes. From almost day one, Tarzan felt ripe for replacing; Alien, while intially very cool was well past it's sell by date as a "non-classic" movie (at the time it opened) by the time it closed, etc. There is a lot they could have done to "fix" this ride over the years if they were interested in really investing in it but I'm sure they were happy to replace it with something that likely has considerably lower maintenance costs.

GMR being replaced by MMRR was definitely one of the dumbest ideas WDI's ever executed. Compared to GMR, MMRR has lower capacity, fits the park less, is shorter, and to top it all off seems to be cumulatively regarded as mediocre. What a wonderful way to waste, what, oh a couple hundred million dollars or so. Jesus, it's just baffling. Even if GMR had low guest scores, this wasn't the solution....like at all.

As an aside, I think TWDC's current refusal to maintain ride effects, show elements, AAs, etc. is absolutely disgusting. The amount of money they make and they still choose to actively reduce quality simply because they're big babies and don't want to spend money to actually keep attractions working properly. It's genuinely pathetic

 

[MrPromey]

GMR being replaced by MMRR was definitely one of the dumbest ideas WDI's ever executed. Compared to GMR, MMRR has lower capacity, fits the park less, is shorter, and to top it all off seems to be cumulatively regarded as mediocre. What a wonderful way to waste, what, oh a couple hundred million dollars or so. Jesus, it's just baffling. Even if GMR had low guest scores, this wasn't the solution....like at all.

As an aside, I think TWDC's current refusal to maintain ride effects, show elements, etc. is absolutely disgusting. The amount of money they make and they still choose to actively reduce quality simply because they're big babies and don't want to spend money to actually keep attractions working properly. It's genuinely pathetic

Well, what do you want?!

They can't just keep charging more to increase those profits, silly!

They have to strip things that cost money, too!

They owe it to the shareholders or whatever.*


*At least, that's what the people who like to justify it all claim, despite that kind of thing really having nothing to do with how shareholders make money from Disney's stock. I mean, as a shareholder, I'm still waiting for my cut of those Figment popcorn buckets! I've been told not to hold my breath.

 

[MrPromey]

GMR being replaced by MMRR was definitely one of the dumbest ideas WDI's ever executed. Compared to GMR, MMRR has lower capacity, fits the park less, is shorter, and to top it all off seems to be cumulatively regarded as mediocre. What a wonderful way to waste, what, oh a couple hundred million dollars or so. Jesus, it's just baffling. Even if GMR had low guest scores, this wasn't the solution....like at all.

As an aside, I think TWDC's current refusal to maintain ride effects, show elements, AAs, etc. is absolutely disgusting. The amount of money they make and they still choose to actively reduce quality simply because they're big babies and don't want to spend money to actually keep attractions working properly. It's genuinely pathetic

Anyway, what's done is done. It would be great to see them do the "right thing" by not making yet another bad decision. They could always put Zootopia in the area where MMRR should have gone. That entire space starting with the courtyard and encompasing everything in it, then going back to the space behind it, is ripe for something new.

... and I say that as a parent who's had to sit (on the floor) or stand through a few different versions of how they use the Disney Jr. space, all of which have been pretty lame/cheap ways to try peddling their Tv cartoons.

 

[BlakeW39]

Well, what do you want?!

They can't just keep charging more to increase those profits, silly!

They have to strip things that cost money, too!

They owe it to the shareholders or whatever.*


*At least, that's what the people who like to justify it all claim, despite that kind of thing really having nothing to do with how shareholders make money from Disney's stock. I mean, as a shareholder, I'm still waiting for my cut of those Figment popcorn buckets! I've been told I'll be waiting a while.

Lol ah yes, the 'Wall Street excuse,' which I have heard exactly 889777989 times.

The WDC has no problem looking out for their long term interests in other divisions, such as streaming, which obviously hurt the value of their stock. It's just the parks they treat like crap. How many people have blander memories from WDW due to rides not firing on all cylinders or with broken effects? Everest goes from a world class E-ticket to a rollercoaster on a mountain, hmm they got bigger rollercoasters at Universal. Let's go there instead. Smh.

 

[BlakeW39]

Anyway, what's done is done. It would be great to see them do the "right thing" by not making yet another bad decision. They could always put Zootopia in the area where MMRR should have gone. That entire space starting with the courtyard and encompasing everything in it, is ripe for something new.

... and I say that as a parent who's had to sit (on the floor) or stand through a few different versions of how they use the Disney Jr., all of which have been pretty lame ways to try peddling their Tv cartoons.

In my opinion there's no great place for Zootopia in WDW, you could put it in DHS but only because that park is essentially themeless now. I really think there's no reason to try and force the IP into any of the parks, it just doesn't work that well, and it isn't even that popular anyways.

 

[Brer Panther]

I'd gladly take Zootopia in Hollywood Studios over Animal Kingdom. That park needs a lot more capacity as is.

 

[Advisable Joseph]

I'd gladly take Zootopia in Hollywood Studios over Animal Kingdom. That park needs a lot more capacity as is.

Again, is that even an option? From what your insiders have been saying, it seems Disney will be building in Animal Kingdom and Magic Kingdom.

 

[neo999955]

GMR being replaced by MMRR was definitely one of the dumbest ideas WDI's ever executed. Compared to GMR, MMRR has lower capacity, fits the park less, is shorter, and to top it all off seems to be cumulatively regarded as mediocre. What a wonderful way to waste, what, oh a couple hundred million dollars or so. Jesus, it's just baffling. Even if GMR had low guest scores, this wasn't the solution....like at all.

As an aside, I think TWDC's current refusal to maintain ride effects, show elements, AAs, etc. is absolutely disgusting. The amount of money they make and they still choose to actively reduce quality simply because they're big babies and don't want to spend money to actually keep attractions working properly. It's genuinely pathetic

Just saying that me and my family really love MMRR. I think it’s an absolute joy and find new details each ride. I get why people don’t like it / it’s park / its replacement / etc. but lots of people do like it. One of my best friends finally rode it recently (he goes to Disney a lot pre-Covid) and he LOVED it.

I think it’s a really nice Mickey ride and am happy we have it. I doubt it’s universally considered mediocre - at least outside of here.

 

[BlakeW39]

I'd gladly take Zootopia in Hollywood Studios over Animal Kingdom. That park needs a lot more capacity as is.

right, but there are other options for DHS as well.

Just saying that me and my family really love MMRR. I think it’s an absolute joy and find new details each ride. I get why people don’t like it / it’s park / its replacement / etc. but lots of people do like it. One of my best friends finally rode it recently (he goes to Disney a lot pre-Covid) and he LOVED it.

I think it’s a really nice Mickey ride and am happy we have it. I doubt it’s universally considered mediocre - at least outside of here.

I'm glad you enjoyed it— I suppose I was being hyperbolic, I suppose some people probably do enjoy it, much like some enjoyed the GMR.

And I wouldn't have minded in in Animation Courtyard, although I do still think it's just, "eh, pretty fun." Replacing GMR as the centerpiece of the park was a huge mistake IMO though