WSJ: Even Disney Is Worried About The High Cost Of A Disney Vacation (gift link)

[hopemax]

Speaking of reliability issues... We took a mini-honeymoon to Disneyland in July 1998. We got there the evening of July 5th, 1998. Disneyland fans might know this date better... let's look at Wikipedia!

"On July 6, 1998, just a little over a month after its grand opening, Rocket Rods was closed for a refurbishment to address the issues. It was reported to remain closed for five weeks, but it ended up staying closed for three months before reopening in October 1998."

We did not get in line on July 5th, because we were there with another couple who got married the week before and they were "first timers" and we thought we had 4 more days to ride Rocket Rods So we took them on the train, HM, Pirates and Indy instead. I finally got to ride it; my one and only ride, in July 2000. After a 2 hour wait because it broke down. DH never got to ride it.

Our primary honeymoon was December 1998, another important milestone happened. We went to dinner with some friends from RADP (usenet) and the buzz was Test Track had finally soft opened that day. We rode it 2 days later.

Gringotts also had major operational difficulties when it first opened in 2014. Also, in Japan it seems like a lot of people stayed away from all the hassle of Fantasy Springs opening, but it was pretty crowded by the time we went in October.

 

[Dranth]

I understood that WDW would not get the whole 60 billion, but a part of it? Was I wrong?

Nope, as of now WDW is getting around 16 billion of that.

 

[Tha Realest]

Nope, as of now WDW is getting around 16 billion of that.

Was there some discussion that “Florida” was getting $16-17 billion, and it remained to be seen if that included DCL? Or is that $16 billion exclusive to WDW?

 

[HauntedPirate]

Speaking of reliability issues... We took a mini-honeymoon to Disneyland in July 1998. We got there the evening of July 5th, 1998. Disneyland fans might know this date better... let's look at Wikipedia!

"On July 6, 1998, just a little over a month after its grand opening, Rocket Rods was closed for a refurbishment to address the issues. It was reported to remain closed for five weeks, but it ended up staying closed for three months before reopening in October 1998."

We did not get in line on July 5th, because we were there with another couple who got married the week before and they were "first timers" and we thought we had 4 more days to ride Rocket Rods So we took them on the train, HM, Pirates and Indy instead. I finally got to ride it; my one and only ride, in July 2000. After a 2 hour wait because it broke down. DH never got to ride it.

Our primary honeymoon was December 1998, another important milestone happened. We went to dinner with some friends from RADP (usenet) and the buzz was Test Track had finally soft opened that day. We rode it 2 days later.

Gringotts also had major operational difficulties when it first opened in 2014. Also, in Japan it seems like a lot of people stayed away from all the hassle of Fantasy Springs opening, but it was pretty crowded by the time we went in October.

Whoa. Rec.arts.disney.parks. I feel old. Which, as I'm sure you know, we both are. (No, we don't know each other, but if you know RADP, you're old)

 

[Dranth]

Was there some discussion that “Florida” was getting $16-17 billion, and it remained to be seen if that included DCL? Or is that $16 billion exclusive to WDW?

If I remember correctly, it was 16 billion to WDW, but it was spread out over the years with more allocated towards the back half. We'll see what they end up doing but for now that is what we are getting.

If I am misremembering, I am sure someone will come along to correct it soon.

 

[HauntedPirate]

If I remember correctly, it was 16 billion to WDW, but it was spread out over the years with more allocated towards the back half. We'll see what they end up doing but for now that is what we are getting.

If I am misremembering, I am sure someone will come along to correct it soon.

I believe that is what Disney CFO Hugh Johnston did say, that a larger portion of that spending would come more towards the latter half of the next 10 years. And could extend into the decade beyond that?

 

[lazyboy97o]

Same reason Disney guests stay on site

They’d need to average 4 guests per room, 90% occupancy and have guests only visiting the three theme parks to just barely have enough hotel guests to be the majority of visitors on an average day.

 

[hopemax]

Whoa. Rec.arts.disney.parks. I feel old. Which, as I'm sure you know, we both are. (No, we don't know each other, but if you know RADP, you're old)

Unfortunately. I was 20 when I got home from a family trip to Disneyland and my boyfriend (now DH) said, "So I found this place on usenet called alt.disney.disneyland, you should look at it." And ADD led to RADP. I'm certainly not 20 anymore.

 

[Dranth]

I believe that is what Disney CFO Hugh Johnston did say, that a larger portion of that spending would come more towards the latter half of the next 10 years. And could extend into the decade beyond that?

Don't remember how much was in the back half except for it was more than the first half.

Someone who knows, correct me if I am wrong, but as of now the plan is still to spend it over 10 years but the deal they singed with CFTOD did leave room it to go beyond that 10 if needed.

 

[TheTourist]

Compounding all this isn’t just the increasing prices of everything- it’s that the baseline price of admission has gotten excessively more expensive, and the non-LL or non-premium experience (or baseline experience) has gotten demonstrably worse and much more unpleasant.

This is it in a nutshell. I am fortunate that my wife and I can afford a Disney vacation. We don't often go, but a year ago we did a stay at the Wilderness Lodge and park hopped to all 4 parks over 5 days. Paid for all the LL upsells. Didn't buget our food or drink (!!) spending. In other words, we were perfect marks for Disney.

Yet, the experience just didn't feel worth it. Although I love the theming of the WL, the room wasn't worth the price. And having an extra hand in my pocket the whole time - even though I allowed it to happen - felt cheap. Like Jenny Nicholson said in her Starcruiser video: it's that Spirit airlines effect.

Plus, it made me notice every flaw in the parks.

One huge problem is poor ride maintenance. It's unacceptable for the amount of money the parks generate. I get a ride or two having issues, but what we experienced was far beyond the tolerances of even a decade ago. Bad show, torn up queues, etc.

Then there's the fact that you have two underbuilt parks in HS - thematically a mess of a park - and AK. That's my favorite park because it's so well themed, and I like walking the trails. But it's woefully underbuilt. Retheming Dinosaur and adding the Encanto land is just going to bring it back to the same ride count it used to have. They really need to do more.

Fortunately, I have a choice in how to spend my vacation dollars.

Nostalgia is a potent drug (my first visit to WDW was in 1973 when I was a toddler,) but we aren't planning on going back for the forseeable future. Too many other places to see. I imagine we won't visit again until some time in the 2030s, but unless Disney demonstrably improves the guest experience (or, as I'd argue, reverts it back to the elevated experience you used to pay through the nose for) we'll likely adjust our spending so the Mouse gets less of our money.

 

[Tha Realest]

Whoa. Rec.arts.disney.parks. I feel old. Which, as I'm sure you know, we both are. (No, we don't know each other, but if you know RADP, you're old)

This is a fun game. What “dates” you as Disney parks fan?

For me, I was an on stage participant in the Monster Sound Show, my family eked out a handful of trips by using the same multi-day park hopper passes over many years, and I did Disney races that predated runDisney.

 

[Jrb1979]

They’d need to average 4 guests per room, 90% occupancy and have guests only visiting the three theme parks to just barely have enough hotel guests to be the majority of visitors on an average day.

That wasn't my point. My point is that for a new theme park, it's not drawing visitors to the Orlando area as hoped. Universal hotels should have little availability most of summer and Disney shouldn't have the lowest rates since COVID.

 

[HauntedPirate]

This is a fun game. What “dates” you as Disney parks fan?

For me, I was an on stage participant in the Monster Sound Show, my family eked out a handful of trips by using the same multi-day park hopper passes over many years, and I did Disney races that predated runDisney.

My first two visits were when there was only Magic Kingdom. And I believe our third visit included a 2-month-old EPCOT Center.

Yeah, I'm old.

 

[Dranth]

This is a fun game. What “dates” you as Disney parks fan?

For me, I was an on stage participant in the Monster Sound Show, my family eked out a handful of trips by using the same multi-day park hopper passes over many years, and I did Disney races that predated runDisney.

I miss those shows.

That and the Murder She Wrote one at Universal always cracked me up.

 

[Laketravis]

My first two visits were when there was only Magic Kingdom. And I believe our third visit included a 2-month-old EPCOT Center.

Yeah, I'm old.

Same. First visit 1972 when it was just the Poly, Contemporary, and MK. Not even Space Mountain yet. But it was so cool.

To put the "billions invested over the next 10 years" in perspective, it cost $6B to build Epic Universe. I think nut for nut Disney's build costs are higher so it will be interesting to see how much those billions bring to WDW.

Or how little.

 

[lazyboy97o]

That wasn't my point. My point is that for a new theme park, it's not drawing visitors to the Orlando area as hoped. Universal hotels should have little availability most of summer and Disney shouldn't have the lowest rates since COVID.

There is not a definite causal link between the two. A number of new and renovated hotels have been opening recently or will be in the near future. Evermore alone is more hotel capacity than Epic Universe can handle. There is a good bit of room for hotel competition without park visitation being a disaster.

 

[Jrb1979]

There is not a definite causal link between the two. A number of new and renovated hotels have been opening recently or will be in the near future. Evermore alone is more hotel capacity than Epic Universe can handle. There is a good bit of room for hotel competition without park visitation being a disaster.

I didn't say Epic's park visitation is going to be a disaster. I'm implying that Epic's attendance isn't likely to be as high as originally thought.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

This is a fun game. What “dates” you as Disney parks fan?

For me, I was an on stage participant in the Monster Sound Show, my family eked out a handful of trips by using the same multi-day park hopper passes over many years, and I did Disney races that predated runDisney.

My sister and I got picked to do the green screen giant bee effect at MGM

Been going since earlier than that but that is a specific thing that stands out that dates me

 

[Nubs70]

Yet it's a product who's demand is based on a required level of FOMO.

The LL business model is built on the operative word - Fear.

WDW is coercing guests to pay more out fear their experience will be less. Just raise the ticket price to a single cost and guarantee the guest will have a great experience.

 

[surfsupdon]

During economic downturns (9/11, recession, covid) Disney shuttered Resorts and decreased park hours.
Post covid, they still are keeping lots of rooms out of inventory for refurb, and have shuttered an entire water park while keeping only one open at a time. Hours are still shorter than the glory days.
How long until we see (or think) Disney operates three theme parks a day on a rotational basis???

Of course I am joking, but I can imagine the idea was floated at some point to keep revenue up. Who knows.