What's Still On and What's Now Off

[HauntedPirate]

I want to add a snarky comment about the $47 billion spent on stock buybacks in the past decade and propping up the stock price for the benefit of Bobby and Willow’s retirement fund, but I won’t. Hindsight being 20/20 and all.

 

[HauntedMansionFLA]

That’s the least of their worries.

True. Paying 100,000 Disneyland and Disney World part and full time employees while bringing in $0 revenue to start.

 

[Dutch Inn '76]

No they didn't. You can social distance with construction, in many cases. They can't have a couple of painters in a bucket? Of course they can. Universal hasn't stopped. That's the difference. You could of course argue Disney just didn't want to deal with "only 10 people" thing but ....

And the fact is, Disney cuts. They do. When the going gets tough, they cut. Why can't some folks see this? I'm no Universal shill, believe me, but they are handling this 1000x better.

They ADDRESSED their projects. It's called TRANSPARENCY. Disney doesn't give us that.

LOL. I made this argument a few weeks ago. It's like high school debating...

The argument that was made against me was something regarding safety, and PR, and yadayadayada...

The bottom line is: Disney can't win, no matter what they do.

 

[Josh Hendy]

The thing about the bailouts is, they're not doing anything about the underlying problem (people and companies not producing and not earning). They're only helping people and companies avoid legal/technical bankruptcy and related procedures. Such as: eviction, loan default and foreclosure or repossession, and restructuring of debt and selloff of assets.

Consider a rent holiday as I believe some jurisdictions are giving every tenant. And also forbidding home foreclosure which amounts to a mortgage holiday. Now, commercial landlords can't make mortgage payments and THEY need a holiday. Banks will then have billions in non-performing loans which makes THEM technically insolvent. Banks have packaged, sliced and diced their loan portfolios (like in The Big Short), the repackaged debt has been re-sold, and nobody knows what anything is really worth any more.

Who, of their own free will and with their own cash, is going to hire employees that they might not be able to fire, lend money to people who might get a repayment holiday, buy bonds from companies who are insolvent, or from governments who are going to either default, or print their way out of it and destroy their currency?

Work, savings, collateral and sensible market values have no meaning any more because everyone is on a long holiday from the financial real world.

We don't know what's on and what's off because it's hard to see what motivation anyone has for spending their meager or non-existent savings, taking out big loans, or making large scale financial commitments of any kind.

 

[Ojo4]

Disney really needs to go ahead start the next round of mass layoffs. No reason to be paying these cast members when they get more money from unemployment than if they were working

 

[CastAStone]

The thing about the bailouts is, they're not doing anything about the underlying problem (people and companies not producing and not earning). They're only helping people and companies avoid legal/technical bankruptcy and related procedures. Such as: eviction, loan default and foreclosure or repossession, and restructuring of debt and selloff of assets.

Consider a rent holiday as I believe some jurisdictions are giving every tenant. And also forbidding home foreclosure which amounts to a mortgage holiday. Now, commercial landlords can't make mortgage payments and THEY need a holiday. Banks will then have billions in non-performing loans which makes THEM technically insolvent. Banks have packaged, sliced and diced their loan portfolios (like in The Big Short), the repackaged debt has been re-sold, and nobody knows what anything is really worth any more.

Who, of their own free will and with their own cash, is going to hire employees that they might not be able to fire, lend money to people who might get a repayment holiday, buy bonds from companies who are insolvent, or from governments who are going to either default, or print their way out of it and destroy their currency?

Work, savings, collateral and sensible market values have no meaning any more because everyone is on a long holiday from the financial real world.

We don't know what's on and what's off because it's hard to see what motivation anyone has for spending their meager or non-existent savings, taking out big loans, or making large scale financial commitments of any kind.

It’s incredibly unpopular to loan money at super low interest rates to businesses to pay bills and retain staff but it’s also clearly the right solution and it’s why the bill that just passed Congress with only 1 dissenting vote had roughly a half trillion dollars (which in practice is going to be more like 3 trillion dollars) to do just that. Everyone from the socialists to the tea party (except that one guy) voted for it. The details of how it will work are still sketchy but Fixing the problem at the source ensures we still have these businesses in 6 months or a year without the domino effects of things like rent suspension.

So I think we as a country are off to a good start.

 

[CastAStone]

Disney really needs to go ahead start the next round of mass layoffs. No reason to be paying these cast members when they get more money from unemployment than if they were working

Depending how the final terms of the bill that they passed this week were structured, Disney might make more money retaining them than firing them.

 

[NormC]

I live in Greece. What part are you from?
My daughter works at Wegmans. Great stores!

My sister in law lives in Greece and we have been to the Greece Ridge Wegmans several times. It is a great store.

 

[MisterPenguin]

And just think of how long it’s going to take to make a profit when you add up the expense of buying FOX, starting and launching Disney+

The purchase of Fox 20th Century was mostly to give D+ a fighting chance for global reach and to enhance their DTC (direct to customer: Hulu, D+, hotstar) libraries. The D+ enterprise was estimated to start being profitable in 2022. However, it has had a better than expected launch, so, it might start turning a profit sooner.

The expense of buying Fox and dumping start-up capital into D+ was mostly covered by taking on debt. Apart from paying back that debt over time, Disney was making a huge profit each year and was paying down that debt.

So, in the end, 20th Century and D+ aren't keeping Disney from being profitable.

 

[HauntedMansionFLA]

Disney really needs to go ahead start the next round of mass layoffs. No reason to be paying these cast members when they get more money from unemployment than if they were working

Do they start with seasonal cast members, offer CM’s close to retirement a sweetheart deal to retire, stop the Disney Aspire program, eliminate main gates for cast members and don’t start the college program back up?????

 

[Kman101]

LOL. I made this argument a few weeks ago. It's like high school debating...

The argument that was made against me was something regarding safety, and PR, and yadayadayada...

The bottom line is: Disney can't win, no matter what they do.

LOL. I know. It's one of the reasons I've steered clear of the boards for a while. I needed a mental break. Folks simply believe everything they're told. Many of us just ... know better. lol. Oh well.

And yep, they can't win no matter what they do. Folks got an announcement and now "omg indefinitely". Well. Yeah. They literally can't promise you an opening date. I understand the castmember's frustrations (wish Disney was more transparent with them, more than us, personally) but I think many people need to just take a step back and breathe.

Anyway ... lol

 

[Kman101]

The purchase of Fox 20th Century was mostly to give D+ a fighting chance for global reach and to enhance their DTC (direct to customer: Hulu, D+, hotstar) libraries. The D+ enterprise was estimated to start being profitable in 2022. However, it has had a better than expected launch, so, it might start turning a profit sooner.

The expense of buying Fox and dumping start-up capital into D+ was mostly covered by taking on debt. Apart from paying back that debt over time, Disney was making a huge profit each year and was paying down that debt.

So, in the end, 20th Century and D+ aren't keeping Disney from being profitable.

THIS (it's always amusing when folks may not like what they purchased and use it to say that's why they're in trouble ... lol)

 

[Kman101]

IM not one to even get in these discussions but Disney doesn’t really owe anyone anything right now when it comes to discussing future projects. When the parks reopen and things are moving again, sure, but them halting construction and being quiet seems like something any business would do. Universal is also way more quiet about future projects meaning there is plenty of future investments they can mothball because they just haven’t talked about them and nobody will be aware. I have nothing against the OP but this is all uncharted territory for the theme parks. Similar to 9/11 and 2008 in some ways but nothing like this. Nobody even knows how long the parks are going to be closed at this point. When we Are months down the road and previously announced projects have not started, then we can raise some flags but it just seems way to early.

I never said they "owed" us anything. Just that it would be nice. There's a difference. And pointed out the competitor is doing that. The reality is, they cut. You know it, I know it, we all know it. You did see the projects Universal addressed, correct?

Trust me. I'm fully aware they can't promise a date. I don't think they should. I've said as much just now before I saw your post. I have a lot of the same feelings you do and a lot of folks are jumping to worst case and you're right in that they shouldn't, basically. And I personally don't think everything they said will be abandoned will be. This IS new territory. But we know what they do when the going gets tough. Meanwhile, Universal commits to it and promises investment won't stop. I mean .... that's not for us that's for the CASTMEMBERS. These companies owe us NOTHING. It would just be nice though. Folks are looking to be reassured right now when our lives are in crisis. I get it.

EDIT: Wasn't trying to be harsh at all. I get what you're saying and do mostly agree!

 

[Kman101]

No they didn't. You can social distance with construction, in many cases. They can't have a couple of painters in a bucket? Of course they can. Universal hasn't stopped. That's the difference. You could of course argue Disney just didn't want to deal with "only 10 people" thing but ....

And the fact is, Disney cuts. They do. When the going gets tough, they cut. Why can't some folks see this? I'm no Universal shill, believe me, but they are handling this 1000x better.

They ADDRESSED their projects. It's called TRANSPARENCY. Disney doesn't give us that.

Quoting myself because ... It's amusing folks have a problem that I applaud Universal for their transparency when they didn't have to say a word. Not saying Disney owes us anything. They owe their castmembers answers and reassurances and they're doing a poor job at it. Transparency is not hard. It's not required but folks simply want to be reassured right now. It is what it is

 

[SilentWindODoom]

Remember, Disney is a Conglomerate. It is not just parks and resorts. But they will have to rely on every thing else to bring in income. I also pretty certain Disney will get a good percentage of the bailout money.

Disney is not going to be bankrupt because they can't open WDW by September. That is the most ridiculous statement made so far.

They're in an unenviable situation where pretty much every division of their business is hit. The parks are closed. The cruise line can't sail. I'm an avid ESPN watcher and have seen them flounder firsthand. They closed their stores. Their films can't hit the theatres. Television is chugging along, but it's going to be a lean fall with shows shuttering production now. Disney+ offered deals and grabbed a large base quickly and I don't know if there's going to be a large enough jump to make up for the loss at the box office. At past hard times, they generally have other divisions to prop them up. The parks made bank when the films were faltering. Right now, just about everything is down.

Meanwhile ... Universal says projects will stay on track. SMH. They're handling this 10000x better.

I really don't think they abandon that many projects forever. Halting them for a year or two? Sure. I'd buy that. What happens to Epcot? lol. Some of this makes sense and some of it doesn't.

Universal has not stopped their construction.

Disney chose to stop theirs.

Do... do we look at their decision to have construction workers not work through the crisis to be a bad thing? Construction is "essential" employment, but using that guideline to get things done for your theme park sounds like taking advantage of a loophole.

I want the parks to be back. I want the vloggers I watch to be back in them rather than scared at home or giving up. I want work to go double time without guests there. I want everything to get done and more.

But I also want the company to be more than any other corporation.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Do... do we look at their decision to have construction workers not work through the crisis to be a bad thing? Construction is "essential" employment, but using that guideline to get things done for your theme park sounds like taking advantage of a loophole.

So what about the ongoing construction at Disneyland Paris, Hong Kong Disneyland and Tokyo Disney Resort?

Disney in the USA halting construction has been the exception, not the rule, when it comes to how the parks are treated during this time.

 

[SilentWindODoom]

So what about the ongoing construction at Disneyland Paris, Hong Kong Disneyland and Tokyo Disney Resort?

Disney in the USA halting construction has been the exception, not the rule, when it comes to how the parks are treated during this time.

Is the stuff in Japanese stuff a Disney decision or an OLC decision?

I was unaware they were working on projects around the world. But I also don't know the number of cases in the immediate area and how well they're following direction that would allow certain things to go on without spreading unlike the idiots worsening outbreaks in Orlando and South California.

 

[Chef Mickey]

They're in an unenviable situation where pretty much every division of their business is hit. The parks are closed. The cruise line can't sail. I'm an avid ESPN watcher and have seen them flounder firsthand. They closed their stores. Their films can't hit the theatres. Television is chugging along, but it's going to be a lean fall with shows shuttering production now. Disney+ offered deals and grabbed a large base quickly and I don't know if there's going to be a large enough jump to make up for the loss at the box office. At past hard times, they generally have other divisions to prop them up. The parks made bank when the films were faltering. Right now, just about everything is down.




Do... do we look at their decision to have construction workers not work through the crisis to be a bad thing? Construction is "essential" employment, but using that guideline to get things done for your theme park sounds like taking advantage of a loophole.

I want the parks to be back. I want the vloggers I watch to be back in them rather than scared at home or giving up. I want work to go double time without guests there. I want everything to get done and more.

But I also want the company to be more than any other corporation.

I think everyone understands their business is pretty much limited to online merchandising and whatever scraps they can get from TV and Disney+.

The question was whether or not that means facing bankruptcy by September, which I said was ridiculous.

The fact the businesses aren't working is terrible for Disney, but their operating costs are also going to drop just as significantly with any sort of longer term shut down. Other fixed costs like debt service and other ongoing operating expenses will continue and will cost the company billions. My point was, Disney can weather several billion dollars in losses and has assets and ability to tap credit markets should things worsen. It's going to take a hell of a lot longer than September for that to be reality.

 

[TrojanUSC]

Disney+ offered deals and grabbed a large base quickly and I don't know if there's going to be a large enough jump to make up for the loss at the box office.

The sort of scuttlebutt in the industry is that while D+ debuted strong, its lack of real new adult-skewing content has made new subscribers slow to a crawl and with COVID-19, they won't be able to add some for quite some time.

 

[Josh Hendy]

The sort of scuttlebutt in the industry is that while D+ debuted strong, its lack of real new adult-skewing content has made new subscribers slow to a crawl and with COVID-19, they won't be able to add some for quite some time.

We got D+ and binge watched a few favorites plus movies that some of us had missed, such as Lady and the Tramp do-over, Frog Princess and Aladdin II. But we haven't watched anything for a couple of weeks. I can see us cancelling the subscription from lack of use. I wonder if other subscribers will follow that pattern.