News WDW Resorts to add fees for parking

21stamps

Well-Known Member
Do you work for Disney marketing?
Ha ha no.. but I did 9nights at Poly and the following week in Key West Florida- so being the same ‘vacation’ I definitely noticed the price difference between the 2 when it came to entertainment, Disney came out WAY ahead. In food as well, I had purchased the DDP during that trip.
The only area that didn’t come out ahead was accommodations.. but I had a theme park view room at Poly, stayed at the Casa Marina in Key West- factoring in resort fee and parking and paid parking every time we left- the difference wasn’t even as stark as it looked initially.

This past year I chose 2 nights at WDW ASSports.. 1 Park day combined with MVMCP that night.. partly because it was cheaper than what I would have spent in SoFla during that time.. and because, well, I wanted to surprise my kid with a quick Disney stop.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
I agree.

My parents (and I suspect yours) were wary about any form of credit. With the exception of a house, if you couldn't pay cash, you didn't buy it. Not raised with the frugality of the Great Depression and WWII, we've become much more willing to make purchases on credit.

Still, Disney's price increases can't continue to outpace income forever. After more than a decade of this, something is gonna give during the next recession.

I did some checking.

The non-Disney resorts I stayed in various parts of the World in the 1980s, 1990s, and 2000s cost the same or less than what I paid back then.

Really, it's sporting events and concerts that have gotten a lot more expensive.

And universities.

And Universal. ;)

I totally agree, but interestingly, the cruise industry is getting a ton of similar-to-Disney-complaints about prices rising. So are amusement parks.. it’s all related even though some people think that Disney is it’s own bubble, it’s not. It’s still within the out-pacing inflation costs of that kind of ‘family entertainment’ today.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
What would be the point of this exercise? We are comparing Disney to Disney. When are you going to get that through your head? No one here cares what King's Island costs you. No one.

This is a narrow and wrong way to look at it. Do you seriously not think that Disney looks at all of the parks? Cedar Point raised their gate price to $72 this year.. no fast passes included.. but you can purchase Fast Lane for an additional $120pp.
Do you think a Disney ticket should be priced the same as Cedar Point? Of course not, or at least hopefully you don’t think they should be similarly priced.
 

njDizFan

Well-Known Member
One other interesting point about 1983...

Combined attendance at the Magic Kingdom and EPCOT was 22.7 million in 1983.

According to TEA, combined attendance at these two parks was 32.1 million in 2016.

The parks were a lot less crowded in 1983! :D
Not to mention they had close or even more capacity in 1983, those Omnimovers could churn out huge numbers.
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
This is a narrow and wrong way to look at it. Do you seriously not think that Disney looks at all of the parks? Cedar Point raised their gate price to $72 this year.. no fast passes included.. but you can purchase Fast Lane for an additional $120pp.
Do you think a Disney ticket should be priced the same as Cedar Point? Of course not, or at least hopefully you don’t think they should be similarly priced.
I literally could not be more clear about this. This is a WDW forum. No one cares about cedar point.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
I literally could not be more clear about this. This is a WDW forum. No one cares about cedar point.

Disney doesn’t exist in a vacuum. If someone questions why prices are raising at a higher rate than inflation.. yet refuses to look anywhere outside of Disney.. then what are you talking about? Inflation shouldn’t matter either.. Disney is its own universe.:hilarious:
 

HauntedPirate

Park nostalgist
Premium Member
This is a narrow and wrong way to look at it. Do you seriously not think that Disney looks at all of the parks? Cedar Point raised their gate price to $72 this year.. no fast passes included.. but you can purchase Fast Lane for an additional $120pp.
Do you think a Disney ticket should be priced the same as Cedar Point? Of course not, or at least hopefully you don’t think they should be similarly priced.

If you believe a particular insider who had a really good track record mentioned this a long while back - No, actually, Disney doesn't care about other theme parks, their pricing, or what they are doing. It's called "blue ocean strategy", and some higher-ups at TWDC believe in it around theme parks.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
If you believe a particular insider who had a really good track record mentioned this a long while back - No, actually, Disney doesn't care about other theme parks, their pricing, or what they are doing. It's called "blue ocean strategy", and some higher-ups at TWDC believe in it around theme parks.

Theme parks and amusement parks are rising in price.. adding “paid options”- some of which are almost necessary these days, because that industry is booming right now... because there is a great demand for those parks- they’re crowded, and they know they can keep raising prices while keeping the crowds.

I don’t believe that Disney doesn’t look at the industry in general.. they were one of the last to the party when it comes to “customizing” your vacation with extras. They just magically thought of that idea one day?
 

draybook

Well-Known Member
The example I use most often is room prices at the Polynesian and the Contemporary:

View attachment 272789

Adjusted for inflation, that $29/night rate (tax included) for the Contemporary and Polynesian comes out to $174/night today.

Even the $44/night rate for the most expensive room converts to $263/night in 2017.

For the average family in 1971, these were not cheap prices. Heck, for the average family today, $174/$263 is not cheap. @Goofyernmost is right that WDW was never a "cheap" vacation. What he misses is that, relative to today, it was.

The prices of old pale in comparison to today's actual prices. Today, the least expensive room at the Polynesian averages $645/night. There's a world of difference between $174 and $645 per night.

Remember, there were double-digit price increases in each year from 1984 to 1988. Then prices remained relatively consistent with household income until 2000. It's only been since 2001 that price increases have outpaced income gains by roughly a two-to-one margin. Heck, I was booking rooms at the Contemporary in the low $200s in the early-to-mid 2000s. Today, the Contemporary's least expensive room averages $530/night.

The early 2000s saw some great deals, which helped offset price increases. For example, "Buy Four, Get Three Free" which offered a 7-day ticket and 7 nights in an onsite hotel for the price of 4. 2005 saw the introduction of the a al carte Magic Your Way ticket, which created an entry-level option for Guests sensitive to cost.

However, since 2005, price increases have been relentless while today's "discounts" are being offered on prices that have far outpaced income or inflation. Today's "discounted" hotel room is more expensive than rack rates of only 5-10 years ago.

I agree that a visit to WDW is a luxury item. This doesn't invalidate an analysis of price trends and their impact on consumers.

We are seeing resistance on ticket prices at sporting events. Many "sold" seats are going to corporations. (Watch a New York Yankees home game and observe how many prime seats are empty on weeknights.) Disney does not have the luxury of having corporations buying millions of tickets. Disney needs to respect consumer sentiment.

We happen to be in an economic boom, with consumer confidence at its highest levels since before 9/11. Historically, it's times such as these that consumers spend more freely, including on their vacations. Like all booms, this one will end.

Adding a separate charge for onsite parking (something that Disney was already charging for; it was just was built into the price of the hotel room) is not going to endear Disney to its customers.


Man, this was a perfect post.

And to add onto that, we have fallen away from staying on-site, even for Free Dining. I just priced our trip down there from 9/2-9/16. Granted, our party is now 3 adults and 3 children, but the cheapest room/package I could find was $5,454 for a family suite at All-Star Music. That's with a 2 day park hopper, as FD requires. Over 5k for a fricking "value" room and we'd have to pay a little extra to move up to the regular plan, so it'd probably be closer to 6k. Now, as I cruise on over to one of those vacation home rental sites, I've found a few 3 and 4 bedroom houses with 2+ bathrooms, private pool, washer/dryer, etc for an average of $85 per night. The main one I'm looking at is a total of $1,463 for the entire trip. We already have APs, so we're good on getting in and parking is covered. So we're talking about a savings of about $4,500. Sure, we'll drop some of that on ADRs out of pocket, but we'll still save over $3,500 by not tossing it away on a cramped room. And let's be honest, the EMHs have been getting down to slim picking, so those two "perks" are not worth that extra $4k+.

Disney is making this choice easier and easier. Honestly, I'm waiting for them to drop free parking from the APs. That will probably be the final straw.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
16,275+ posts in less than two years on a Disney World fan forum would suggest some level of obsession to me. ;)

Probably.. but half of those posts are on the political boards.. so it may just mean that I’m looking for a distraction.lol. In all seriousness though, as said earlier, the trip reports and trip planning sections are a great resource. It’s nice to see other people’s vacations and maybe find something new that you’d like to try on your next trips.
 

njDizFan

Well-Known Member
This is a narrow and wrong way to look at it. Do you seriously not think that Disney looks at all of the parks? Cedar Point raised their gate price to $72 this year.. no fast passes included.. but you can purchase Fast Lane for an additional $120pp.
Do you think a Disney ticket should be priced the same as Cedar Point? Of course not, or at least hopefully you don’t think they should be similarly priced.
I think you keep moving the goal posts of your argument. Is Disney less affordable then it was in years past? Yes. Is Disney more expensive then other theme/amusement park experiences? Yes. You keep saying that we needs to compare Disney to other entertainment experiences but again you are stating you cannot compare the amenities of Disney to other theme parks. And in some sense you are correct, you should not compare Disney to anything but itself. I'm not spending 7 days at Six Flags, I'm not buying 21 meals at Cedar Point. Disney is a destination, resort, theme park unlike any others (except Universal).

Let me give you an orange to tangerine comparison. I can go to Williamsburg on a 7 day flex pass for about $150 PP. Included is 7 days unlimited to Busch Gardens, Water Country, Colonial Williamsburg and the Historic triangle. Food is cheaper(though not as diverse). Parking is free and I can get a little education in while I am there. Is it an overall better experience than Disney, probably not, but it is a much better value.

You concede things are out of whack because millennials put more emphasis on the experience and it is our fault because we keep paying. My once a year family is down to about once every 4 years because the value proposition and if (more like when) there is a sharp downturn in the economy things could be in trouble down in the swamps. There is no argument that Disney prices have vastly outpaced income and has outpaced the rest of the theme park market. I just bristle at the argument, "we need to suck it up and open our wallets or just not go". As fans we are concerned for the future of he company and for my personally the ability to afford future trips.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
I think you keep moving the goal posts of your argument. Is Disney less affordable then it was in years past? Yes. Is Disney more expensive then other theme/amusement park experiences? Yes. You keep saying that we needs to compare Disney to other entertainment experiences but again you are stating you cannot compare the amenities of Disney to other theme parks. And in some sense you are correct, you should not compare Disney to anything but itself. I'm not spending 7 days at Six Flags, I'm not buying 21 meals at Cedar Point. Disney is a destination, resort, theme park unlike any others (except Universal).

Let me give you an orange to tangerine comparison. I can go to Williamsburg on a 7 day flex pass for about $150 PP. Included is 7 days unlimited to Busch Gardens, Water Country, Colonial Williamsburg and the Historic triangle. Food is cheaper(though not as diverse). Parking is free and I can get a little education in while I am there. Is it an overall better experience than Disney, probably not, but it is a much better value.

You concede things are out of whack because millennials put more emphasis on the experience and it is our fault because we keep paying. My once a year family is down to about once every 4 years because the value proposition and if (more like when) there is a sharp downturn in the economy things could be in trouble down in the swamps. There is no argument that Disney prices have vastly outpaced income and has outpaced the rest of the theme park market. I just bristle at the argument, "we need to suck it up and open our wallets or just not go". As fans we are concerned for the future of he company and for my personally the ability to afford future trips.

There is no comparison to Disney when it comes to theme, there is comparison when you look at pricing in the family entertainment (and almost all entertainment) industry. I’m staying at a Cedar Point hotel in June, 3 nights.. it’s @ $400 per night, much smaller than Disney rooms .. my dining options are TGIFridays and similar.. qs food is more at CP, and I’m talking overpriced Chik fil a etc, costs more than Disney QS, but not half as good.. I won’t have all kinds of “included activities” at different CP hotels, or even mine, and I won’t have free mini golf coupons etc..oh, and my Fast Lane passes are an additional $800orso dollars, admission not included in that figure. That is what parks are becoming, because the amusement park industry is in demand right now.. especially Disney most of all.

You have to realize that demand and pricing are completely related.. one determines the other. No one is forcing you to stay 7 days at Disney, that’s your choice, and you’re not the only one choosing it, which is why prices will continue to rise.

I’ll add, I don’t know what “goal posts” you’re talking about.. is Disney more expensive than years past? Yes, as stated in my previous posts. However- are most (in demand) parks much more expensive than years past? Yep. Are Disney World tickets still a good value of entertainment comparatively? Yes.
 
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21stamps

Well-Known Member
I think you keep moving the goal posts of your argument. Is Disney less affordable then it was in years past? Yes. Is Disney more expensive then other theme/amusement park experiences? Yes. You keep saying that we needs to compare Disney to other entertainment experiences but again you are stating you cannot compare the amenities of Disney to other theme parks. And in some sense you are correct, you should not compare Disney to anything but itself. I'm not spending 7 days at Six Flags, I'm not buying 21 meals at Cedar Point. Disney is a destination, resort, theme park unlike any others (except Universal).

Let me give you an orange to tangerine comparison. I can go to Williamsburg on a 7 day flex pass for about $150 PP. Included is 7 days unlimited to Busch Gardens, Water Country, Colonial Williamsburg and the Historic triangle. Food is cheaper(though not as diverse). Parking is free and I can get a little education in while I am there. Is it an overall better experience than Disney, probably not, but it is a much better value.

You concede things are out of whack because millennials put more emphasis on the experience and it is our fault because we keep paying. My once a year family is down to about once every 4 years because the value proposition and if (more like when) there is a sharp downturn in the economy things could be in trouble down in the swamps. There is no argument that Disney prices have vastly outpaced income and has outpaced the rest of the theme park market. I just bristle at the argument, "we need to suck it up and open our wallets or just not go". As fans we are concerned for the future of he company and for my personally the ability to afford future trips.

I was curious about prices for the same date at Disney as my Cedar point trip. So I just looked it up. For the exact same dates at Disney I can stay at Beach club, animal kingdom, wilderness Lodge, or boardwalk- all for just over $400, just at $400, or in the Beach Club’s case- under $400 ($385). With that reservation would come several included activities, transportation, and a much nicer pool/pool slides, as well as better dining options.

I’m not looking at some random park in VA.. I’m comparing the “top” theme park to the “top” amusement park. So when looking at Disney pricing and saying “OMG it’s so crazy!!”.. look around, and you might see that Yep- it’s crazy!.,but so is pretty much any other top rated destination.
 

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
As fans we are concerned for the future of he company and for my personally the ability to afford future trips.

Yes. This.

The option shouldn’t be, keep your mouth shut and pay. Or. Don’t visit at all and Disney goes the way of Action Park.
I was curious about prices for the same date at Disney as my Cedar point trip. So I just looked it up. For the exact same dates at Disney I can stay at Beach club, animal kingdom, wilderness Lodge, or boardwalk- all for just over $400, just at $400, or in the Beach Club’s case- under $400 ($385). With that reservation would come several included activities, transportation, and a much nicer pool/pool slides, as well as better dining options.

I’m not looking at some random park in VA.. I’m comparing the “top” theme park to the “top” amusement park. So when looking at Disney pricing and saying “OMG it’s so crazy!!”.. look around, and you might see that Yep- it’s crazy!.,but so is pretty much any other top rated destination.
Listen. We know. You’ve posted some variation of this exact post about 5000x. Let me just try and convey this to you one more time. No one here cares about Cedar Point. Stop posting about Cedar Point.
 

21stamps

Well-Known Member
Listen. We know. You’ve posted some variation of this exact post about 5000x. Let me just try and convey this to you one more time. No one here cares about Cedar Point. Stop posting about Cedar Point.

Ok. So stop pretending that Disney prices or unheard of or out of line with the industry.. when it can easily be disproven. Their high prices are what they are because everything in that realm is high now...especially when compared to 30 years ago.
Like I said, it doesn’t really exist in a bubble.
 

Nubs70

Well-Known Member
This is a narrow and wrong way to look at it. Do you seriously not think that Disney looks at all of the parks? Cedar Point raised their gate price to $72 this year.. no fast passes included.. but you can purchase Fast Lane for an additional $120pp.
Do you think a Disney ticket should be priced the same as Cedar Point? Of course not, or at least hopefully you don’t think they should be similarly priced.
If you are a diehard coaster fan, yes
 

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