Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Opens May 22 2025

[celluloid]

Sorry, which point exactly are you taking issue with?

I have no problem with excitement. It’s the hyperbole with things that are objectively not the case. This is a very strong and well designed evolution of the direction Universal has been taking their parks the last 15 years. I think it will be the nicest park Universal has, bar none. It’s also not Disney Sea or Disneyland. Are you disagreeing?

I am not disagreeing, and Disney Sea and Animal Kingdom are parks I think are best because I am a nerd for transportive.
But I also know not everything is for me all lf the time. Nor does it always sell when it is the only basket.
I also know that tastes change. Epic has still a great balance of transportive and thrill. It has a hub that harkens to abstract class and nostalgia as a dedication to parks themselves. Celestial Park in a vacuum is just that. Similarly has notes that harkens to romanticized amusements that is so pristine it never was. It's a park within a park dedicated to the beauty of what a park is. A kin to what Futureworld remake wanted to claim, but with mystical optimism romance vs future.
It is in many ways exactly this generation's Disneyland with how Main Street meant more to Americans at the time than it arguably does now as it becomes more generic.
And really, most people finding issue are doing so from hating in Celestial Park, which is the hub. The other lands are individually immersion.

Nope, it is not Disney Sea or EPCOT, but as said, Disney is not building those either.

My point was Uni knows what this park is and who it is for.

 

[WDWFREAK53]

California Screamin’ is a bad example bc people genuinely love the look of it and it’s 100% important to the land’s theming

Maybe at first when it was designed as a boardwalk pier in California...but now it's Incredibles.

 

[WDWFREAK53]

I think Veloci is a gorgeous looking ride but the “coaster in a raptor paddock” shtick is such an obvious cop-out that I find it actively annoying, lol. Then they try to tell you the raptors are racing alongside you — only to barely see a few static raptors for a split second.

The static raptors are the cop-out.
Basing a coaster in a raptor paddock, IMO, isn't a cop-out because that's what Jurassic World is. A theme park on an island with dinosaurs. I could definitely see that being an attraction at "Jurassic World."
Just like I could see the giant Pteradactyl/Pteradon birdcage with a flying or suspended coaster through it.

 

[WDWFREAK53]

The problem for the rest of the park is the it sticks out so prominently from outside the land:

View attachment 821467

Universal may not care and be happy to be seen as the park of big rollercoasters vs Disney. This tendency to place minimally themed coasters so front and centre in their parks, however, does very strongly undercut arguments they are surpassing Disney in the development of the theme park with projects like Epic Universe and still gives the impression as being a cut below if theming is what really interests you.

That's not to say Disney doesn't also frequently fall short, just that I find it hard to look at what Universal is doing and feel that I'm seeing the same kind of approach to theme park design that originally attracted me to Disney.

To me, I think this is part of the charm of IoA. World Showcase allows you to see the countries across the lagoon. In IoA, looking out over the lagoon and you see the beautiful lands all represented.
At night, Hulk has a beautiful green lighting package. Just hop on the Seuss Trolley when the sun goes down and look around because the park is beautiful.

That being said, I also think that placing a giant steel structure is hyper-themed areas detracts from the theming. I shouldn't need to suspend belief. When I'm on Kilimanjaro, I know there are boundaries for most of the animals...but it's not in the forefront of my mind while I'm riding the attraction.

Both companies (for the most part), balance this well.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Starfall's hook is it is meant to be at its best at night, when just the light on the trains would be visible. During the day the majority of it will be blocked by landscaping in CP anyways. Berk, if it's the same as China, will have one of the best stage shows in any theme park. And they'll have flying dragons outside too

Uni parks are almost never open long after dark. I somehow doubt that changes here so I’d expect fireworks, when they’re offered (they can’t even run projection shows nightly), about 45 min after sunset.

Good luck riding this at night outside of Christmas Week.

 

[UNCgolf]

I am not disagreeing, and Disney Sea and Animal Kingdom are parks I think are best because I am a nerd for transportive.
But I also know not everything is for me all lf the time. Nor does it always sell when it is the only basket.
I also know that tastes change. Epic has still a great balance of transportive and thrill. It has a hub that harkens to abstract class and nostalgia as a dedication to parks themselves. Celestial Park in a vacuum is just that. Similarly has notes that harkens to romanticized amusements that is so pristine it never was. It's a park within a park dedicated to the beauty of what a park is. A kin to what Futureworld remake wanted to claim, but with mystical optimism romance vs future.
It is in many ways exactly this generation's Disneyland with how Main Street meant more to Americans at the time than it arguably does now as it becomes more generic.
And really, most people finding issue are doing so from hating in Celestial Park, which is the hub. The other lands are individually immersion.

Nope, it is not Disney Sea or EPCOT, but as said, Disney is not building those either.

My point was Uni knows what this park is and who it is for.

Celestial Park actually looks like it might be the most interesting section of the park to me (from a visual standpoint; not attractions), other than maybe Monsters (haven't seen enough of that).

The Nintendo land is okay, and HP Paris will be fine but it's not going to come close to Diagon Alley. Berk looks very uninteresting. Celestial Park just looks beautiful.

 

[TalkToEthan]

The static raptors are the cop-out.

Yes, the raptor statues hurt the experience more than help—— better to eliminate them altogether or if not redesign to turn a head or move up and down slightly on their back legs…something, anything other than a statue

 

[MisterPenguin]

Yes, the raptor statues hurt the experience more than help—— better to eliminate them altogether or if not redesign to turn a head or move up and down slightly on their back legs…something, anything other than a statue

Have they tried strobe lights?

 

[WDWFREAK53]

Have they tried strobe lights?

No help, Islands isn't open late enough for lights to be effective.

 

[Andrew25]

My hope is that Universal does a complete 180 on how they operate their parks next year, especially when it comes to park hours. On average, we've lost about an hour (half hour each park) a day of park operations since 2015.

It's kind of insane with the remarkable attendance and revenue increases we see YoY, Universal keeps lowering park hours

 

[WDWFREAK53]

My hope is that Universal does a complete 180 on how they operate their parks next year, especially when it comes to park hours. On average, we've lost about an hour (half hour each park) a day of park operations since 2015.

It's kind of insane with the remarkable attendance and revenue increases we see YoY, Universal keeps lowering park hours

But turnstile numbers are one thing...what's the attendance like in the park near closing?
Without a "nighttime spectacular" to keep guests in later, there really is no draw other than "I want to ride this rollercoaster at night!"

Hopefully since Epic really won't have limitations on pyro due to their neighbors, it will allow them to stay open later longer and maybe that will spill over to the existing parks.

 

[UNCgolf]

But turnstile numbers are one thing...what's the attendance like in the park near closing?
Without a "nighttime spectacular" to keep guests in later, there really is no draw other than "I want to ride this rollercoaster at night!"

Hopefully since Epic really won't have limitations on pyro due to their neighbors, it will allow them to stay open later longer and maybe that will spill over to the existing parks.

Well, there are also a lot of people who would just rather be there later at night than early in the morning. I'm almost never at a park when it opens -- but I'd happily stay at a park until 10-11 at night, or possibly even later.

I don't think attendance near closing necessarily tells you much, because people are more likely to go ahead and leave when they know the park is closing soon, plus almost no one is going to enter the park. If it's 8 PM and the park doesn't close until 11, there are people who would head to the park then after dinner/dessert/whatever because they'd still have 2-3 hours. If the park is closing at 9, there's no point.

 

[WDWFREAK53]

Well, there are also a lot of people who would just rather be there later at night than early in the morning. I'm almost never at a park when it opens -- but I'd happily stay at a park until 10-11 at night, or possibly even later.

I don't think attendance near closing necessarily tells you much, because people are more likely to go ahead and leave when they know the park is closing soon, plus almost no one is going to enter the park. If it's 8 PM and the park doesn't close until 11, there are people who would head to the park then after dinner/dessert/whatever because they'd still have 2-3 hours. If the park is closing at 9, there's no point.

I'm basing it on families with kids. Most families stick around for the fireworks and bolt. Without fireworks or some big nighttime show I'd imagine most would leave before they do when they're waiting for the fireworks.

Even opening the park later...say at 11 and keeping it open 2 hours later, I'd still imagine that those families wouldn't stay until park closing without some sort of "draw" at night.

 

[jrhwdw]

I'm basing it on families with kids. Most families stick around for the fireworks and bolt. Without fireworks or some big nighttime show I'd imagine most would leave before they do when they're waiting for the fireworks.

Even opening the park later...say at 11 and keeping it open 2 hours later, I'd still imagine that those families wouldn't stay until park closing without some sort of "draw" at night.

Prob doesn't help that USF isn't doing CineSational on non HHN Nights......

 

[DarkMetroid567]

My hope is that Universal does a complete 180 on how they operate their parks next year, especially when it comes to park hours. On average, we've lost about an hour (half hour each park) a day of park operations since 2015.

It's kind of insane with the remarkable attendance and revenue increases we see YoY, Universal keeps lowering park hours

It would be antithetical to how most corporations run. If they can’t keep hours late now, how would they find the labor needed for extended hours at an entirely new park? It just ain’t happening.

 

[UNCgolf]

I'm basing it on families with kids. Most families stick around for the fireworks and bolt. Without fireworks or some big nighttime show I'd imagine most would leave before they do when they're waiting for the fireworks.

Even opening the park later...say at 11 and keeping it open 2 hours later, I'd still imagine that those families wouldn't stay until park closing without some sort of "draw" at night.

Maybe not, but they used to keep the parks open later and they stayed pretty busy.

I think because families with small kids, while a major part of Disney's audience, aren't 90% of attendance (plus, some families with smaller kids will stay up late for the parks). There are more than enough people to keep the parks busy later at night if Disney was willing to do it.

 

[Andrew25]

But turnstile numbers are one thing...what's the attendance like in the park near closing?
Without a "nighttime spectacular" to keep guests in later, there really is no draw other than "I want to ride this rollercoaster at night!"

Hopefully since Epic really won't have limitations on pyro due to their neighbors, it will allow them to stay open later longer and maybe that will spill over to the existing parks.

Universal is more than capable with their current attendance levels to operate their parks to 9PM on a nightly basis. They might not have enough to draw folks to 10 or 11PM consistently like MK, but they pull enough to not have the parks close at 7PM.

It would be antithetical to how most corporations run. If they can’t keep hours late now, how would they find the labor needed for extended hours at an entirely new park? It just ain’t happening.

I agree with you, I don't expect them to change their business model and its unfortunate. I think Universal deserve far more flack as to how they operate their parks vs Disney. Their constant construction hides their horrendous operations.

I think Epic Universe will be staffed very well... the other parks are going to suffer.

 

[jrhwdw]

Maybe not, but they used to keep the parks open later and they stayed pretty busy.

I think because families with small kids, while a major part of Disney's audience, aren't 90% of attendance or anything like that. There are more than enough people to keep the parks busy later at night if Disney was willing to do it.

Let’s hope old school MK Nights return next year!

 

[Sir_Cliff]

Well, there are also a lot of people who would just rather be there later at night than early in the morning. I'm almost never at a park when it opens -- but I'd happily stay at a park until 10-11 at night, or possibly even later.

I don't think attendance near closing necessarily tells you much, because people are more likely to go ahead and leave when they know the park is closing soon, plus almost no one is going to enter the park. If it's 8 PM and the park doesn't close until 11, there are people who would head to the park then after dinner/dessert/whatever because they'd still have 2-3 hours. If the park is closing at 9, there's no point.

Glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. The idea of early morning starts to have a chance on getting on the most popular attractions is part of what really turns me off about a WDW vacation at the moment.

Since Disneyland Paris started staying open later to run fireworks every night, that park really hits the sweet spot in terms of opening hours for me. This week, for example, Disneyland is open 9:30am to 10pm and WDSP 9:30am to 9pm every day. The weird thing over there is how much money they leave on the table by closing restaurants and other stores in the evening such that you really have to put some effort into finding somewhere for a sit-down meal or just go to Disney Village.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. The idea of early morning starts to have a chance on getting on the most popular attractions is part of what really turns me off about a WDW vacation at the moment.

Since Disneyland Paris started staying open later to run fireworks every night, that park really hits the sweet spot in terms of opening hours for me. This week, for example, Disneyland is open 9:30am to 10pm and WDSP 9:30am to 9pm every day. The weird thing over there is how much money they leave on the table by closing restaurants and other stores in the evening such that you really have to put some effort into finding somewhere for a sit-down meal or just go to Disney Village.

DLP be like:

"We have ice cream on Main Street from 2:30pm-4:45pm every third Sunday and on Bank holidays..."