Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Opens May 22 2025

[mickEblu]

It is important that unrealistic expectations not be set. I think Epic will be HIGHLY successful.

I do not think it is possible for UOR to increase gate clicks by 50% year one. No other resort ever has and that includes not just crap second gates (Epcot, DisneySEA). It will take some time, the other parks will shed attendance to Epic more than length of stays and new guests will counter-balance.

I agree that the Potter and Monsters headliners need to be great. I’m looking at this ride roster and attraction count (12?) and I just feel like this parks effect on Disney World is being blown way out of proportion. At most I see people subtracting one day from their Disney World vacation to add to their USH vacation. So mayyyyybe AK sees a small hit? I don’t see many people skipping Disney World entirely. I also see the possibility of people keeping the same Disney World days but just skipping USO and only doing Epic/ IOA.

In reality though people have seven days for a vacation. How many people do both Disney World and Universal on the same trip?

 

[BrianLo]

I agree that the Potter and Monsters headliners need to be great. I’m looking at this ride roster and attraction count (12?) and I just feel like this parks effect on Disney World is being blown way out of proportion. At most I see people subtracting one day from their Disney World vacation to add to their USH vacation. So mayyyyybe AK sees a small hit? I don’t see many people skipping Disney World entirely. I also see the possibility of people keeping the same Disney World days but just skipping USO and only doing Epic/ IOA.

In reality though people have seven days for a vacation. How many people do both Disney World and Universal on the same trip?

Then of course the trouble is how its sustained it will be if oodles of money is dumped back into DAK... it seems far away, but we're talking things popping up in that resort possibly the following year. The lethargic beast that is Disney seems to be awakening.

DAK was the second most popular park of all 6 in 2019. People gloss over that. The weak link is and will continue to be USF. Depending on how ticketing goes down, the new side adventure is Epic at the behest of IOA/USF. APs will be the worst for that (if they aren't blocked); all their non HHN visits to USF are being dropped.


Neither operator seems that keyed into Royal Caribbean that is also co-launching almost 4 million passenger days on Utopia/Star of the Seas next year out of Port Canaveral.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Then of course the trouble is how its sustained it will be if oodles of money is dumped back into DAK... it seems far away, but we're talking things popping up in that resort possibly the following year. The lethargic beast that is Disney seems to be awakening.

DAK was the second most popular park of all 6 in 2019. People gloss over that. The weak link is and will continue to be USF. Depending on how ticketing goes down, the new side adventure is Epic at the behest of IOA/USF. APs will be the worst for that (if they aren't blocked); all their non HHN visits to USF are being dropped.


Neither operator seems that keyed into Royal Caribbean that is also co-launching almost 4 million passenger days on Utopia/Star of the Seas next year out of Port Canaveral.

To the last point, Disney should be worried. I’m happy Magic will be in PC next summer because I won’t do Wish again (and, by extension, Treasure). Oasis-class is much better and Icon is getting great reviews, by-and-large. Star is a great match for PC.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

The biggest advantage Epic has over the other two parks, is that it'll be the nicest to look at and visit.

Even if the ride line-up doesn't live up to the hype, it appears to be a more interesting place to be, eat, shop and walk around. Certainly more than the boxy, flat USF. The others don't have something like Celestial Park.

 

[TalkToEthan]

indeed!

Grounds and facades will be(I predict) second best in the world……Disney Sea will still be #1

 

[BrianLo]

To the last point, Disney should be worried. I’m happy Magic will be in PC next summer because I won’t do Wish again (and, by extension, Treasure). Oasis-class is much better and Icon is getting great reviews, by-and-large. Star is a great match for PC.

This is still my number one theory about why the parks are soft in general these days. Royal In particular has shifted their demographic, more than half their guests are millennials. The cruise industry (outside of the very niche DCL previously) has invaded the Universal and Disney core demographic, all without them realizing it.

Anaheim didn’t have the raging return of cruising to compete against.

 

[BrianLo]

The biggest advantage Epic has over the other two parks, is that it'll be the nicest to look at and visit.

Even if the ride line-up doesn't live up to the hype, it appears to be a more interesting place to be, eat, shop and walk around. Certainly more than the boxy, flat USF. The others don't have something like Celestial Park.

Agreed. I’m starting to re-weight IOA these days. It depends on how much one values the attraction roster as the be all, end all.

Entertainment, atmosphere, dining and a night spectacular all matter tremendously to me now. Epic has it in spades seemingly and the original two parks increasingly don’t.

 

[JoeCamel]

Agreed. I’m starting to re-weight IOA these days. It depends on how much one values the attraction roster as the be all, end all.

Entertainment, atmosphere, dining and a night spectacular all matter tremendously to me now. Epic has it in spades seemingly and the original two parks increasingly don’t.

A new 13 float parade and lagoon show don't fill that slot?

 

[BrianLo]

A new 13 float parade and lagoon show don't fill that slot?

I completely missed that. Consider yourself re-re evaluated IOA.

Edit- wait I’m confused, where and what are we taking about? Is it USF?

Edit again- yes I see what you are talking about now. I didn’t know that was announced. My post was poorly worded as a result, but it still stands. Epic looks like it has it all. IOA has great attractions and pretty good atmosphere. USF has pretty good entertainment all things considered (lipstick on a pig-but I look forward to it). Citywalk has the dining.

 

[JoeCamel]

I completely missed that. Consider yourself re-re evaluated IOA.

Edit- wait I’m confused, where and what are we taking about? Is it USF?

Edit again- yes I see what you are talking about now. I didn’t know that was announced. My post was poorly worded as a result, but it still stands. Epic looks like it has it all. IOA has great attractions and pretty good atmosphere. USF has pretty good entertainment all things considered (lipstick on a pig-but I look forward to it). Citywalk has the dining.

In sad entertainment news the cab driver near the entrance is cut.....

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Agreed. I’m starting to re-weight IOA these days. It depends on how much one values the attraction roster as the be all, end all.

Entertainment, atmosphere, dining and a night spectacular all matter tremendously to me now. Epic has it in spades seemingly and the original two parks increasingly don’t.

IoA severe lack of entertainment and empty theaters is its biggest flaw.

Beyond adding variety to the experience, high capacity shows help to disperse crowds.

Weird how Universal Orlando doesn't have an equivalent to Waterworld (their longest running show) anymore.

 

[Weather_Lady]

I agree that the Potter and Monsters headliners need to be great. I’m looking at this ride roster and attraction count (12?) and I just feel like this parks effect on Disney World is being blown way out of proportion. At most I see people subtracting one day from their Disney World vacation to add to their USH vacation. So mayyyyybe AK sees a small hit? I don’t see many people skipping Disney World entirely. I also see the possibility of people keeping the same Disney World days but just skipping USO and only doing Epic/ IOA.

In reality though people have seven days for a vacation. How many people do both Disney World and Universal on the same trip?

Maybe my family isn't representative of the greater population (particularly since both my kids are now teens), but we've done multiple Disney-only, Universal-only, and Disney-Universal-split vacations. The net effect of Epic Universe on us is expected to be: (1) we'll be less likely to split a Universal stay with Disney, since we can fill more days with just Universal; and (2) fewer Disney-only vacations, period, since it has fewer things that are new and certainly not a whole park's worth, and has made changes like G+ and intolerable standby lines, both of which we can entirely avoid at Universal with a premier hotel stay (of course, whether the lines will be intolerable at EU and whether there will be a way to avoid them remains to be seen, so I'm just going by past experience).

It is entirely possible that you're right, and that people are over-estimating the impact of EU's opening on Disney, but I think I can say anecdotally that for my family, at least, the impact will tip the scales toward Universal and away from Disney for future vacations for a good long time.

 

[sonoma15]

IoA severe lack of entertainment and empty theaters is its biggest flaw.

Beyond adding variety to the experience, high capacity shows help to disperse crowds.

Weird how Universal Orlando doesn't have an equivalent to Waterworld (their longest running show) anymore.

Our equivalent I guess is Bourne, though it's really not the same as Waterworld. I always thought it was kinda weird that every other Universal park in the world has the show and not Orlando.

 

[cheezbat]

Universal WANTS Epic to pull crowds away from Universal Studios. This will make it easier to take a number of attractions offline and build new ones while not massively inflating wait times on the existing attractions. As I’ve said before, there are major plans for an overhaul of things at the Studios park after Epic Universe opens.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Maybe my family isn't representative of the greater population (particularly since both my kids are now teens), but we've done multiple Disney-only, Universal-only, and Disney-Universal-split vacations. The net effect of Epic Universe on us is expected to be: (1) we'll be less likely to split a Universal stay with Disney, since we can fill more days with just Universal; and (2) fewer Disney-only vacations, period, since it has fewer things that are new and certainly not a whole park's worth, and has made changes like G+ and intolerable standby lines, both of which we can entirely avoid at Universal with a premier hotel stay (of course, whether the lines will be intolerable at EU and whether there will be a way to avoid them remains to be seen, so I'm just going by past experience).

It is entirely possible that you're right, and that people are over-estimating the impact of EU's opening on Disney, but I think I can say anecdotally that for my family, at least, the impact will tip the scales toward Universal and away from Disney for future vacations for a good long time.

For some time now, my Orlando trips have been Universal focused with a day each at SeaWorld and/or Magic Kingdom.

Doing that Magic Kingdom day scratches that Disney itch without having to pay Disney prices for hotel and admission over multiple days. If it's a MNSSHP night, then I don't have to worry about park reservations or Genie+ either.

Last year I got a 2-day hopper, because I had gift cards to cover most of the cost, but that's not always the case for me.

Epic Universe will make visiting any non-Universal park even less attractive for me too. It being closer to OCCC and SeaWorld is a big plus as well.

 

[BrianLo]

For some time now, my Orlando trips have been Universal focused with a day each at SeaWorld and/or Magic Kingdom.

Doing that Magic Kingdom day scratches that Disney itch without having to pay Disney prices for hotel and admission over multiple days. If it's a MNSSHP night, then I don't have to worry about park reservations or Genie+ either.

Last year I got a 2-day hopper, because I had gift cards to cover most of the cost, but that's not always the case for me.

Epic Universe will make visiting any non-Universal park even less attractive for me too. It being closer to OCCC and SeaWorld is a big plus as well.

I think I’m the polar opposite and I think that’s because I was a Universal Kid and you were a MK kid. I’ve fallen less In love with Universal as the decade progressed. They've eroded their prices faster than Disney (because they have played catch up to Disney). My last dedicated Universal trip was 2014 and I have / will skip it twice now, more recently. I also burnt myself out as all the resorts get very same-y.

The original resort hasn’t aged correctly. The whole resort maybe peaked a decade ago, outside of maybe Volcano Bay. With two-three notable exceptions, Disney has had a better 2016-2024. In my opinion.

I’m ready to be won back, though. I don’t think Super Nintendo world does it, I might be too close and fond of the source material to like MK. But Celestial park and HTTYD so far seem right.

 

[THEMEPARKPIONEER]

Looking at this new Super Mario section I realized allot of this IP they’re using in Epic Universe is more classic than the IP Disney’s putting on their attractions these days. Disney should wise up and try to team up with SEGA.

 

[ToTBellHop]

I think I’m the polar opposite and I think that’s because I was a Universal Kid and you were a MK kid. I’ve fallen less In love with Universal as the decade progressed. They've eroded their prices faster than Disney (because they have played catch up to Disney). My last dedicated Universal trip was 2014 and I have / will skip it twice now, more recently. I also burnt myself out as all the resorts get very same-y.

The original resort hasn’t aged correctly. The whole resort maybe peaked a decade ago, outside of maybe Volcano Bay. With two-three notable exceptions, Disney has had a better 2016-2024. In my opinion.

I’m ready to be won back, though. I don’t think Super Nintendo world does it, I might be too close and fond of the source material to like MK. But Celestial park and HTTYD so far seem right.

Very curious to see what a package at a premier hotel costs after EU opens. Prices have increased DRAMATICALLY over the last few years, as you say, and faster than Disney’s. For me, it’s still worth it because I can relax with the unlimited Express Passes but it’s been a substantial increase.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Y'all know that Uni will charge as much as WDW if they think they can get away with it, right?

 

[BrianLo]

Very curious to see what a package at a premier hotel costs after EU opens. Prices have increased DRAMATICALLY over the last few years, as you say, and faster than Disney’s. For me, it’s still worth it because I can relax with the unlimited Express Passes but it’s been a substantial increase.

Y'all know that Uni will charge as much as WDW if they think they can get away with it, right?

Exactly and this is the final nail in the coffin.

No more buy 2 - get 2 free. If Epic is successful enough, there may barely even be deals on the 4th day, let alone three.

Now, it’s totally worth more money, they built a whole new park after all. But the calculus that Universal is about to stop being a deal is not really being accounted for. If it’s the same price as Disney… do people actually pick it over Disney?

I say yes to Epic but TBD on the rest of the resort. I’ll do a dedicated trip next year for Uni and then maybe only tack on an Epic day moving forward until IOA/USF build a draw.