Universal Epic Universe (South Expansion Complex) - Now Open!

[Tom Morrow]

I mentioned this during the livestream, but the endless spew of corporate buzzwords and mandated approved points to make (amazing! Immersive! Storytelling! Next level! Etc) felt the hardest I’ve ever seen this stuff laid on and it was genuinely grating. Corporations should consider dialing this stuff down as it feels insincere even if they’re saying what they actually think.

For comparison… hate the man, but Ron DeSantis’s video reaction to the park felt genuine and more believe than anything uttered by anyone in the entire livestreams.

 

[BringMeTheHoriz]

I don't mean to be rude, but I feel like you're throwing up so much information that isn't relevant to a very simple point that it becomes hard to respond.

That simple point was just that the Mark Woodbury introduction to the opening night extravaganza struck a discordant note for how corporate it sounded. I don't think that would be an at all controversial observation if we were to imagine a similar message from Josh D'Amaro (who is the equivalent executive over at Disney). The fix is also very obvious and was mentioned by @Comped: Just start with Spielberg. So, you wonder why they didn't do that.

Honestly, it's such a minor point and I don't understand the back and forth. Of course I am not suggesting anything about what a hypothetical Disney opening ceremony for a park that doesn't exist would look like. As for Iger's opening day speeches in Shanghai, if anything it reinforces the point that it is better to keep the corporate side of things separate from the showmanship which you're hoping will connect emotionally with guests.

And, yes, WDW's 50th was bizarre. Perhaps the weirdest day in WDW history and the broader celebration was a flop. It doesn't have anything to do with my comment, though.

What happened on May 21 was meant for VIPs, media, and corporate executives from Comcast and UDX. In addition, your false dichotomy is also failing to address the fact that unlike Bob, Mark isn’t the highest man on the totem pole. Comcast were the ones who green lit this project, and it was/is a significant investment on Mark’s vision. There is no alternate universe (pun intended) where Mark DOESN’T get up and thank everyone who helped make it happen. Not only for this project but to keep Comcast interested in continuing to invest in all the future projects (even in the face of shifting macroeconomic tides).

Additionally, how you’re able to go as far off the trail as to fault Universal for not having a figure head as iconic as Walt in their history is beyond me. Walt ascended to become the enigma he was/is because he always put himself front and center, and because his fans have propped him up so strongly after his passing. Disney doesn’t miss an opportunity to shove Walt into the parks via a recorded quote or a statute. Even still, Bob Iger also puts himself front and center on literally everything he can (well, at least everything that goes well). I prefer my executives to stay in the background and make moves quietly, but it’s totally understandable that they want and deserve credit for executing this massive project on their post-Covid timeline. Also, don’t you think that adding Spielberg’s narration is UDX’s clear recognition that they didn’t want to go too deep on the corporate jargon? It serves as a clear balance and segway to the actual show.

All that said, I don’t expect to hear a Mark Woodbury voiceover on any continuing nighttime spectacular offerings. But who knows, maybe in 60 years time instead of a narrator talking about building a park in an old orange grove, there will be a narrator talking about raising this park from a toxic missile site, and then we’ll hear Mark’s voice echo across the cosmos once more.

 

[BrianLo]

The fix is also very obvious and was mentioned by @Comped: Just start with Spielberg. So, you wonder why they didn't do that.

Miyamoto was also there and would have been worth trotting out.

I know the company doesn’t want to be Disney… but it shows their corporate overlords flaws, is that it’s still a big ole utility corporation that bought a studio. There’s no Comcast Con. But, why isn’t that an eventual desire they have? I know we’ll be shortly explained to why it is a good thing that don’t have it.

They have such a powerful spectrum of licensed properties now that frankly have their own bigger fandoms than corporate Comcast. Particularly looking at Nintendo and Potter, which frankly rival some of Disney’s studio biggest arms as the best of the best; with a massive reservoir of their own fandoms.

 

[BrianLo]

https://www.thrill-data.com/epic-universe-tickets

I do find this quite fascinating and I won’t portend this means a thing, as I don’t really know their booking curves.

It does speak to the ceiling they’ll have and also that the early ticket sell out wasn’t this glamorous achievement. Boo to you and various MK ticketed events sell out at double the capacity. The attendance looks pretty soft even after the capacity limits release.l

 

[BringMeTheHoriz]

Miyamoto was also there and would have been worth trotting out.

I know the company doesn’t want to be Disney… but it shows their corporate overlords flaws, is that it’s still a big ole utility corporation that bought a studio. There’s no Comcast Con. But, why isn’t that an eventual desire they have? I know we’ll be shortly explained to why it is a good thing that don’t have it.

They have such a powerful spectrum of licensed properties now that frankly have their own bigger fandoms than corporate Comcast. Particularly looking at Nintendo and Potter, which frankly rival some of Disney’s studio biggest arms as the best of the best; with a massive reservoir of their own fandoms.

Owning properties is different than holding rights to properties. For Nintendo and HP, it’s the latter.

 

[BrianLo]

Owning properties is different than holding rights to properties. For Nintendo and HP, it’s the latter.

That was my commentary. They have to look outside themselves for fandoms and seem a bit resistant to building it themselves. With the one exception that HHN has some sub culture behind it.

 

[BringMeTheHoriz]

That was my commentary. They have to look outside themselves for fandoms and seem a bit resistant to building it themselves. With the one exception that HHN has some sub culture behind it.

Sorry I misread that!

 

[Agent H]

That was my commentary. They have to look outside themselves for fandoms and seem a bit resistant to building it themselves. With the one exception that HHN has some sub culture behind it.

I would argue Jurassic Park is one more exception.

 

[Jrb1979]

https://www.thrill-data.com/epic-universe-tickets

I do find this quite fascinating and I won’t portend this means a thing, as I don’t really know their booking curves.

It does speak to the ceiling they’ll have and also that the early ticket sell out wasn’t this glamorous achievement. Boo to you and various MK ticketed events sell out at double the capacity. The attendance looks pretty soft even after the capacity limits release.l

It's done on this way on purpose to slowly increase capacity til they know the attractions are running with little downtime. IMO it's a great idea.

I will last commentary like this and others is part where my disdain for what's happened to Disney. The Disney fandom is very snobby in that many look down at parks that aren't Disney.

 

[MrPromey]

I mentioned this during the livestream, but the endless spew of corporate buzzwords and mandated approved points to make (amazing! Immersive! Storytelling! Next level! Etc) felt the most hardest I’ve ever seen this stuff laid on and it was genuinely grating. Corporations should consider dialing this stuff down as it feels insincere even if they’re saying what they actually think.

For comparison… hate the man, but Ron DeSantis’s video reaction to the park felt genuine and more believe than anything uttered by anyone in the entire livestreams.

I think they just gave themselves too much time to fill. Back in the olden days when every other park opened in central Florida, this was done on broadcast TV. They got what? Two hours tops (with commercials) to do this kind of thing, right?

This went for - wasn't it close to four and a half hours?

How the heck do you fill that much time and actually keep it interesting?

I believe the luxury of Youtube being able to remove all constraints was their downfall. I think there was a good two hours of solid stuff within that stream and if they'd only done two hours and focused on that substance, it would have played a lot better.

I get it. People in the company are excited about opening this after over 25 years of planning and speculation and they want to make sure every point of pride is known and interview every single person they can and point out every single thing they can think of, using hosts who display exaggerated excitement over the most uninteresting things - like the general merch - but it feels like they basically lost sight of their audience when setting this up.

Instead of live-streaming what must have been a five hour event meant for the people in attendance, they should have recorded it, edited it overnight and then played it on the actual evening it opened.

 

[Tom Morrow]

Should it be concerning that almost every ride is a walk on and it’s the first Saturday of official opening AND it’s Memorial Day weekend?

I understand they capped the attendance low, but I get the feeling this is lower than even that.

 

[Moth]

They need to figure out a solution for the Toothless meet and greet, fast. The long waits, outside nature is going to be bad come July.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Should it be concerning that almost every ride is a walk on and it’s the first Saturday of official opening AND it’s Memorial Day weekend?

Doesn't this happen with every new theme park?

People think it's going to be super busy which leads it to be ironically not busy?

 

[BrianLo]

It's done on this way on purpose to slowly increase capacity til they know the attractions are running with little downtime. IMO it's a great idea.

I will last commentary like this and others is part where my disdain for what's happened to Disney. The Disney fandom is very snobby in that many look down at parks that aren't Disney.

It’s not the next six weeks, but rather the ticket sell through once they open up to 22k. It’s pretty interesting they are able to scrape how many tickets remain for sale each day. The park isn’t going to get remotely close to its 7.5-8M capacity for quite a while, if that’s predictive.

Though, as I said, I don’t really know theme park booking curves and maybe they tend to be very close in.

Doesn't this happen with every new theme park?

People think it's going to be super busy which leads it to be ironically not busy?

Shanghai was pretty busy. Other than opening day, which started at noon and was definitely capacity limited. This seems to be a capacity limitation issue, I wonder if they’ll just open up more sales. There’s little point in it being “sold out” and running walk on lines.

On the flip side, maybe they are caught off guard that Ministry is suddenly working.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

On the subject of changes to the rides, some additions have been made to Monsters Unchained since the earlier preview days:

- Haptic feedback on the vehicles (now VERY pronounced and unmistakable)
- Heat effect when Dracula breaks free.
- Water splash effect when Wolfman is goring... something.
- Wooden dummies on the pre-show demonstration Kuka seats, along with wooden figures of the monsters around it. These wooden figures are the same ones Ygor is demonstrating with in the safety video.
- On-ride photo now working, I believe it is taken as Wolfman swipes at you.

- Rumors of the vehicles being programmed with different movements, but cannot confirm.

Now, if they could just change or face you away from that awful view of the giant curtain after the first Dracula... and maybe work on the lighting a bit more to only illuminate what you should see. At least do something about the curtain. You not only see the giant curtain light up, but it tilts you toward the track and you see theater lights below. It completely takes you out of it.

Been on it today twice and it does feel smoother than during the previews.

 

[celluloid]

I don't mean to be rude, but I feel like you're throwing up so much information that isn't relevant to a very simple point that it becomes hard to respond.

That simple point was just that the Mark Woodbury introduction to the opening night extravaganza struck a discordant note for how corporate it sounded. I don't think that would be an at all controversial observation if we were to imagine a similar message from Josh D'Amaro (who is the equivalent executive over at Disney). The fix is also very obvious and was mentioned by @Comped: Just start with Spielberg. So, you wonder why they didn't do that.

Honestly, it's such a minor point and I don't understand the back and forth. Of course I am not suggesting anything about what a hypothetical Disney opening ceremony for a park that doesn't exist would look like. As for Iger's opening day speeches in Shanghai, if anything it reinforces the point that it is better to keep the corporate side of things separate from the showmanship which you're hoping will connect emotionally with guests.

And, yes, WDW's 50th was bizarre. Perhaps the weirdest day in WDW history and the broader celebration was a flop. It doesn't have anything to do with my comment, though.

It kind of reads like you are creating a darned if they do, darned if they don't. They let the creative side of it introduce the firework and drone as a night time ribbon cutting.

Much like Spielberg with the film cutting strip and VIPs in 1990
Or Spielberg and the inflatables and Spidey from Chopper for early in 1999


This WAS a very Universal tradition kind of pre ceremony.
I think it is great that Universal is willing to be transparent and let the creative makers be a bit of a voice. Woodbury may not be well known name, but ultimately, people make the park happen. So it was kind of a nice dedication. And again, it was a red carpet kind of night that as a courtesy was broadcasted. It was not really an open to guests kind of deal.

They did a lot of that for that with the vignettes and Special moments the morning of showmanship, which if we want to talk about if that is enough, that is a different discussion altogether.

So it is not likely they did NOTHING creative for opening on the actual day.


If Joe Rhode got to introduce Animal Kingdom to a select night of guests before Animal Kingdom's opening day, no one would think much of it. Disney is just not typically that transparent. Mark Woodbury was completely in the lead for Epic's creation. He only moved to exec of Parks and Resorts just over 3 years ago.

 

[celluloid]

It’s not the next six weeks, but rather the ticket sell through once they open up to 22k. It’s pretty interesting they are able to scrape how many tickets remain for sale each day. The park isn’t going to get remotely close to its 7.5-8M capacity for quite a while, if that’s predictive.

Though, as I said, I don’t really know theme park booking curves and maybe they tend to be very close in.



Shanghai was pretty busy. Other than opening day, which started at noon and was definitely capacity limited. This seems to be a capacity limitation issue, I wonder if they’ll just open up more sales. There’s little point in it being “sold out” and running walk on lines.

On the flip side, maybe they are caught off guard that Ministry is suddenly working.

The sales are in higher numbers as the days continue. In the next weeks people will be jealous of what these first attendees got. The park has opened as the most tested theme park of all time and things are going fairly well for now as tweaks continue.

Shanghai of course was busy because it was one of the largest populations anywhere no matter what time of year. Memorial Day kick off here had many preview days before it where the vloggers and hype have already occured.

Also every person there is paying full or near full price admission and having a great GSAT, which is great for the company.

No TMs or APs allowed to enter gratis is what you are seeing the result of. Everything to plan on that front anyway.

 

[celluloid]

That was my commentary. They have to look outside themselves for fandoms and seem a bit resistant to building it themselves. With the one exception that HHN has some sub culture behind it.

I mean 3/5ths (and arguably Illumination holds interest in Mario's success but I won't count that) is Universal owned when it comes to EPIC.

Not too far off of DHS when you consider that up until recently MGM/DHS was about the same situation. Disney had yet to own Star Wars, RnR had an artist they no longer owned the catelogue for, Great Movie Ride was filled with others including generic horror scene and CBS with TW Zone, all while playing the Superman and Potter themes from WB in park's music loop. The rides created did not suffer though. (we could go back even further to where Pixar and Muppets were partnerships)

All this being said, it is not a competition in park specific of who owns what completely, but how well things are done and sell, and Uni is fine giving 40 cents for every Butterbeer to WB or 7 bucks for every band to Nintendo.

Walt was not above partnerships himself either. He tried for a lot that would not sell and of course some are famous ones like deals with PL Travers.

 

[flynnibus]

Doesn't this happen with every new theme park?

People think it's going to be super busy which leads it to be ironically not busy?

The ticketing is also highly constrained in this stupid limited park visiting and mandatory add-on model.

You're not going to get normies to jump through all those hoops without a huge drag on their conversion success.

I think it is much like Disneyland with SWGE - they put up so many constraints and hurdles that they didn't just tame the demand.. they outright nerfed it.

I mean it's better to run light than to blow up and fall over completely... but they need to make the park more accessible to the gen pop to see big add-ons and pull through IMO.

 

[BringMeTheHoriz]

The sales are in higher numbers as the days continue. In the next weeks people will be jealous of what these first attendees got. The park has opened as the most tested theme park of all time and things are going fairly well for now as tweaks continue.

Shanghai of course was busy because it was one of the largest populations anywhere no matter what time of year. Memorial Day kick off here had many preview days before it where the vloggers and hype have already occured.

Also every person there is paying full or near full price admission and having a great GSAT, which is great for the company.

No TMs or APs allowed to enter gratis is what you are seeing the result of. Everything to plan on that front anyway.

Excellent reminder that everyone in there is currently paying full freight. $180 x 13,000 =$2,340,000.00. Multiply that by 30 days and that’s $70M before you get into food and merchandise. Obviously there’s massive costs with running a park but clearly Universal has made the decision to ensure that for the full price guests are paying they are in turn provided a great experience. Something to be said for a company not trying to max out capacity right out of the gate when they easily could.

I do agree that Ministry working with the adjustments has caught them off guard. But with it seemingly working more reliably they must feel confident in adding more tickets day of without it having a negative impact on GSAT.

Overall I think what we’re seeing is Universal trying to control how this park is launched and so far everything is going how they want it to.