Toy Story Land expansion announced for Disney's Hollywood Studios

[ToTBellHop]

I’d say it’s better than Justice League already

They’d have to remove Goofy’s Chiropractor School to surpass Six Flags.

 

[Poseidon Quest]

I’d say it’s better than Justice League already

Having been on both, if SF managed to actually upkeep their Justice League rides, I think I would actually prefer them over Webslingers. Webslingers is actually experiencing the same upkeep issues though. When I go to California every few months, I notice that the ride continues to become less responsive over time. I went back in February and couldn't get it to shoot webs higher than about the mid-way point on screen.

 

[UNCgolf]

They weren't attempting to fool anyone. Some of those sound stages were actual sound stages for actual productions. Others were themed to pretend to be a sound stage so that they could run an attraction pretending to put on a production in which they either taught the audience about film-making or got them involved. There was no attempt to 'fool anyone.'

But once DHS was no longer actively in involved in film-making -- and attractions *about* film-making were not that attractive to guests (compared to rides) -- DHS switched from being a theme park based on a studio-tour about making movies, to a theme park in which you 'entered the film.'

But, there were still huge sound stages throughout the park. So, they kept the public-facing areas (with the exception of SWL and TSL) as themed to LA/Hollywood, which in real life has sound stages.

Totally works for me.

When WDW built TSL and SWL, they didn't add big box sound studios. In fact, they decorated the sound studio housing TSMM to hide it.

Exactly.

I said it above, but the original design of DHS is wonderful. You're in Los Angeles (or the LA metro area, if we want to be technical), and then you transition into a studio backlot -- one which looks exactly like LA area studio backlots. You move from "Los Angeles" into a studio, just like in real life.

It's fine to dislike it, but it's wrong to say it wasn't a specific intention executed successfully.

Also, I'm not commenting on DCA vs. DHS as a whole. I actually preferred the late 1990s or early 2000s version of DHS to current DHS anyways.

 

[No Name]

Sometimes, photos speak a lot louder than words.
View attachment 705789
View attachment 705790

 

[No Name]

I don’t really understand how un-themed warehouses is an opinion. HWS just had more of them and they’re more unavoidable within the park while DCA’s are towards the ends. That’s an objective fact.

Did either of us say anything about unthemed warehouses? What you chose to circle as “really bad areas” is not terrible but definitely very opinionated. For example, I see no circle around Pixar Pier!

 

[Movielover]

I don’t really understand how un-themed warehouses is an opinion. HWS just had more of them and they’re more unavoidable within the park while DCA’s are towards the ends. That’s an objective fact.

Those "un-themed warehouses" in DHS were designed as real soundstages, and the entire studio area was designed to mimic the look and style of the Walt Disney Studios in California since it was serving as an East Coast satellite studio.

This is a un-themed warehouse:

These are purposely built soundstages and production facilities to aid in the creation of and the showcasing of actual movie production that pays respect to the original studios back in California:

If you can't see the difference than I'm sorry.

 

[UNCgolf]

What the "intention was" is irrelevant. It always meant HWS looked worse than immersive parks like EPCOT Center even when they were designed to be visited instead of transportive.

I can understand having that opinion if you never visited Disney-MGM in the early years, but it worked perfectly then (and it was a better park IMO). I don't think it's accurate to describe anything in your photos as un-themed during that era.

If your argument is they should have gone back in and changed the theming of those buildings once they gave up on the original incarnation, I can understand that (even if it's kind of unrealistic), but to suggest the park was poorly built from the start is wrong. Just as one example, you included a photo of the Backlot Express -- even now I don't think there's an argument that it's un-themed, but it's certainly lost much of the original theming (especially on the interior).

It didn't have enough to do, but what was there was mostly excellent, including the theming.

 

[UNCgolf]

Okay, then semantics is the issue for you.

Chester and Hester's Dino-Rama carnival, to me, looks equally bad as all those soundstage areas at HWS.
View attachment 706188

Walt Disney Studios likewise looks cheap, feels cheap, and was cheap. There's a reason why two of these photos don't exist anymore. The park is universally considered the worst Disney park in the world by a large margin:
View attachment 706189
View attachment 706190
View attachment 706191

They are both cheap themes to implement. A carnival is cheap in real life as are soundstages (which objectively are warehouses designed for films/tv). They look cheap and they are cheap.

They are not good themes for that reason and should be changed to something better. Buena Vista Street and Hollywood Boulevard are both great examples.

Why then do people take issue with the end of Hollywoodland? According to you, it's themed, right? I'd argue it's a cheap, bad theme and needs to blown off the face of the Earth as it's easily the sore spot of DCA:
View attachment 706187
View attachment 706186

Again, my entire point can be summed it as Hollywood Studios has more of these cheaply themed areas than California Adventure does.

I significantly edited my post, so I'm not sure this response is applicable anymore -- you seem to solely be talking about the park as it exists now.

Regardless, I'm not comparing it to DCA. I'm saying Disney-MGM, as originally built, was close to a masterpiece from a theming standpoint. Everything was well themed and worked together as a transportive experience. It did not look or feel cheap in any way (and wasn't remotely comparable to Walt Disney Studios Park in Paris). The current version of the park has lost much of that for various reasons; it doesn't work anywhere near as well as an overall themed experience even if it has a better attraction lineup.

 

[SplashJacket]

Those "un-themed warehouses" in DHS were designed as real soundstages, and the entire studio area was designed to mimic the look and style of the Walt Disney Studios in California since it was serving as an East Coast satellite studio.

This is a un-themed warehouse:
View attachment 706183

These are purposely built soundstages and production facilities to aid in the creation of and the showcasing of actual movie production that pays respect to the original studios back in California:
View attachment 706184

If you can't see the difference than I'm sorry.

I can understand having that opinion if you never visited Disney-MGM in the early years, but it worked perfectly then (and it was a better park IMO). I don't think it's accurate to describe anything in your photos as un-themed during that era.

If your argument is they should have gone back in and changed the theming of those buildings once they gave up on the original incarnation, I can understand that (even if it's kind of unrealistic), but to suggest the park was poorly built from the start is wrong. Just as one example, you included a photo of the Backlot Express -- even now I don't think there's an argument that it's un-themed, but it's certainly lost much of the original theming (especially on the interior).

It didn't have enough to do, but what was there was mostly excellent, including the theming.

What Hollywood Studios was decades ago is not what Hollywood Studios is now. It’s a theme park and nothing else. Having the park be a relic of something cool is not an excuse for it’s current state.

Communicore/Innoventions may have been great once upon a time, but it hasn’t been in decades.

Hollywood Studios is not a studio. Hollywood Studios does not feel like a studio. Hollywood Studios is not a romanticized studio. There’s nothing authentic about the “sound stages” or their presentation. Currently, every inch of Hollywood Studios with a sound stage is a stain on the park.

The old HS is completely dead. If they weren’t cheap, they would’ve replaced it long ago, yet here we are.

 

[No Name]

There aren't unthemed warehouses at DCA except for the northern end of Pixar Pier (around Goofy's Sky School) and the Eastern-end of Hollywoodland (around Monsters Inc. & Guardians).

I am consistent in criticizing both parks where they have them. I am merely arguing DCA has fewer of them, therefore, I think it's a prettier park given the objective evidence. Your opinion can be different and if you find beauty in them fine, but what annoys me is how people somehow justify HWS' and trash on DCA's un-themed areas. They are about the same acreage if you include guest-facing areas, and HWS just has more of them.

Legit everything I circled at HWS is unthemed warehouses. It would be different if someone was okay with this at HWS and DCA, but there seems to be picking and choosing.

Directly off the hub:
View attachment 706159
View attachment 706164
View attachment 706172

Directly on either side at what is otherwise a beautiful park centerpiece are unthemed show buildings in a concrete wasteland of a hub:
View attachment 706171
View attachment 706180
And the lack of theming goes on all the way from the side of MMRR to the end of Grand Avenue:
View attachment 706155
View attachment 706157

Echo Lake in general is overrated, but it has legitimately unthemed or borderline unthemed areas:
View attachment 706161View attachment 706154

Rock n' Rollercoaster's courtyard is good (albeit clashes with the rest of Sunset Boulevard), but I like it a lot. The new flex event space that's now Lightning McQueen's Racing Academy looks pathetically bad:
View attachment 706163

DCA legitimately only has the END of Hollywoodland and the TOP of Pixar Pier where there are completely unthemed spaces like these, and they are on the outer ends of the park.

I'm not criticizing Avenger's Campus, Toy Story Land, etc. as they DO have a theme, cheaper than they should have been but still themed, but my point is, it's embarrassing for a company to charge up to $180 a day for a park that looks like this, and frankly, it's just a bad point of view if someone genuinely believes HWS is a better-looking park.

I also think HWS has beautiful areas: Galaxy's Edge, Sunset Boulevard, and Hollywood Boulevard, but DCA has more with Buena Vista Street, Grizzly Peak, Cars land, Paradise Park, and the southern end of Pixar Pier (from the entrance to Toy Story Midway Mania!).

I mean, an actual working film studio, Universal Studios Hollywood, manages to theme pretty much everywhere except the tiny Lower Lot. Why are people excusing HWS yet acting like DCA somehow has worse theming throughout when it just objectively doesn't?

For the map I circled originally, Click Here.

If you were talking about unthemed warehouse buildings, it would’ve helped to mention that when you drew those circles.

You said “really bad areas.” Personally I don’t love those buildings in DHS either, but they fit the studio concept, are mostly consistent in style, and are not really ugly. Sure, there may be more areas in DHS that have flat walls, but I’d say there are more areas in DCA that fall flat in execution. And your opinion, like mine, is by no means objective.

 

[UNCgolf]

Yes, because they were actually being used as such back then, so it made sense. I'd argue it was too much of the park's focus, USH has a better split today and thus feels fleshed out and not a half-day park, but regardless.

See my comment about the studio areas of Universal Studios Hollywood making sense as soundstages whereas the actual park-dedicated space outside the Tram Tour SHOULD be themed to something that's NOT cheap to implement (ex. Potter). Just because it's a film studio doesn't mean you should just enter a soundstage for Forbidden Journey. That's cheap, I'm sorry we just disagree there, and until Toy Story Mania became a part of Toy Story Land that happened at HWS. But if you are going onto a film studio area and see animators draw or during a studio tram tour? Yeah, that makes sense.

The soundstages were never beautiful areas but as a park's theme it did work so long as it was balanced with good areas too, just like USH does today, but it hasn't worked in almost 20 years, and MGM was never an elite park, so comparing HWS today to DCA today, DCA is a better themed and more beautiful park. Though to be fair, DCA today would also be more beautiful than MGM opening day as well, but perhaps not as thematically consistent as MGM was.

DCA is most definitely also a better park than MGM was then overall. MGM was ALWAYS designed to be a half-day park, I mean it had 3 rides on opening day. USH has what's presently a vastly superior tram tour than MGM ever did and it has a similar quality ride line-up to HWS today.

I guarantee someone will try to be quick-witted with some aspect of my post that distracts from my main point so I'm not going to continue to respond, but the bottom line is, I think DCA is a better-looking park than HWS given the amount of cheaply themed areas HWS has over DCA.

However, today, if you take issue with Hollywoodland, then I'm sorry, you need to take issue with HWS' plethora of awfully themed areas because there are significantly more Hollywoodland-style areas at HWS than DCA has.

I don't really disagree with any of this as it pertains to the current version of DHS (I think Toy Story Land is probably the worst thing at WDW). I'm only pushing back on insinuations that the original version of the park was bad/poorly themed. It was a half-day park (as you said) but it was a great half-day. The current version is still half-day (at least for me) but is disjointed and nowhere near as fun as the original version (especially once Tower of Terror was open); it just has a bigger attraction lineup. They basically replaced cohesive theming and unique experiences with attractions, and I preferred the former (especially since I don't even like most of the new attractions). That said, the change was kind of forced once the working studio plan collapsed.

I don't know if I'd agree that current DCA is a better overall park than Disney-MGM was post-Tower of Terror, but I also think they're kind of hard to compare, a bit like Animal Kingdom is currently hard to compare to other parks. I don't think that's applicable to DHS now, though.

What Hollywood Studios was decades ago is not what Hollywood Studios is now. It’s a theme park and nothing else. Having the park be a relic of something cool is not an excuse for it’s current state.

Communicore/Innoventions may have been great once upon a time, but it hasn’t been in decades.

Hollywood Studios is not a studio. Hollywood Studios does not feel like a studio. Hollywood Studios is not a romanticized studio. There’s nothing authentic about the “sound stages” or their presentation. Currently, every inch of Hollywood Studios with a sound stage is a stain on the park.

The old HS is completely dead. If they weren’t cheap, they would’ve replaced it long ago, yet here we are.

See above. I'm not arguing DHS vs. DCA, or even anything about current DHS at all (basically all of the old Hollywood/LA theming still works well but the rest of what's left from the early years doesn't really make sense).

 

[J4546]

what do you all think the 3 worst parks are in the US/Paris?

Im thinking DHS and DSP and CA.

 

[No Name]

Has DCA ever contained a giant picture of play-by-play announcer Joe Tessitore and color commentator Rob Riggle, of Holey Moley fame, wearing their spectacular yellow jackets? I didn’t think so!

I don't know why it isn't just inherent knowledge that soundstages look bad, and that soundstages that aren't presently actually working soundstages have no place in theme parks.

Not knowledge, opinion.

 

[UNCgolf]

what do you all think the 3 worst parks are in the US/Paris?

Im thinking DHS and DSP and CA.

Sounds right to me, although EPCOT probably has an argument to make the list. The former Future World is still a huge mess.

My love for what's left from original EPCOT would keep me from putting it on a list like that, but for the general public, the attraction lineup at DHS is probably better.

 

[No Name]

The bottom line is, these cheaply-themed areas are more numerous at HWS than at DCA. That's my point.

Circle this bad boy.

Not really worth discussing more, because you’re convinced your opinion is objectively true and dismissing others’ as nostalgia.

 

[J4546]

I dont get the hate for the Pixar pier other than theming. I agree that I liked it better as paradise pier and with no incredibles theming on the coaster, but the area itself I think is pretty great. Theres 10 rides and a great (imo) nighttime show. I love the victorian era midway ambience and games, multiple good places to eat both sit down and quick serve as well as multiple shops. Some nice views walking around the water as well, seeing the coaster launch and whatnot

Incredicoaster
Ferris Wheel
TSMM
Little Mermaid
Goofy Sky School
Emotional Whirlwind
Merry go Round
Zeppelins
Jellyfish
Swings

 

[No Name]

So if it’s a number game, DCA still is WAY ahead of California Adventure.

I’d say they’re exactly the same.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

Swap around a few of these (it's not an exact science), but I'm trying to describe my thought-process. Even if you move around some I don't think HWS could top DCA in terms of aesthetics/good theming.
Awful Areas areas that have no place in a modern theme park...
DCA

• The eastern end of Hollywoodland disaster
• The northern end of Pixar Pier that stretches from Inside Out Emotional Whirlwind to the end of Paradise Park (most obnoxiously around Goofy's Sky School)

HWS

• The hub disaster
• Animation Courtyard disaster
• Mickey Avenue disaster
• Pixar Place
• Commissary Lane the way it ruins the sightline of the Chinese Theater once you get in the hub is criminal
• Lightning Mcqueen's Racing Academy area was built well after the studios purpose died
• Backlot Express
• Star Tours exposed show building the AT-AT is cool, but putting it in front of a box is not, and it's randomly placed

Okay Areas
DCA

• Avengers Campus it should have been more but what we have isn't awful, it's just okay
• West side of Hollywoodland

HWS

• Toy Story Land I don't hate it like some people but it's definitely weaker than Avengers Campus and awful versus Pixar Pier.
• Echo Lake around Indiana Jones Epic Stunt Spectacular

Good Areas
DCA

• Paradise Park
• Walkway from the end of Buena Vista Street to Paradise Park (that passes by Avengers Campus and Cars Land)
• Pixar Pier's southern end from its entrance to just past Toy Story Midway Mania though the Pixar Pal-A-Round area isn't bad; it's not as good). Personally I'd consider the southern area great, but for the sake of trying to be more objective I put it under good.

HWS

• Grand Avenue
• Echo Lake not including from Indy to Star Tours which is way weaker, though I think Echo Lake as a whole is overrated, and I would take Pixar Pier infinitely over it.

Great Areas
DCA

• Cars Land
• Grizzly Peak
• Buena Vista Street
• Pacific Wharf

HWS

• Galaxy's Edge Cars Land is slightly smaller, though not by much, but I think its leagues better designed than SWGE. Remember, this list is only factoring in aesthetics, not rides.
• Hollywood Boulevard
• Sunset Boulevard

You see, my problem with HWS is that it feels like it's half the park that is not visually pleasing (because it is) that looks cheap and many of the those weak areas are centrally located. DCA and HWS are also about the same size in terms of guest facing acreage, so it isn't due to size either. DCA, whether you want to believe it or not, has more pretty places in the park and the 2 areas that are really bad are at the ends of the park, tucked away from the main walkways. My point is, with all of this, isn't that DCA is perfect, but WDW fans have some weird obsession with claiming supremacy when one of their parks is plagued with ugly areas versus other Disney parks. You see it all the time with Universal as well. Just aesthetically DCA wins, but HWS is pretty much equal when it comes to its ride line-up (besides the massive queues they get), so it's not that the park is awful, but that visually it has a ways to improve.

Someone could like Six Flags more than Tokyo DisneySea. That's their opinion and they can enjoy whatever they want I have zero problem with that and would not judge, but aesthetically, if they think Six Flags looks better, I'm sorry, opinions can be bad, and I would judge them for that. If someone thinks Magic Kingdom has a better ride line-up than Disneyland Park that's just an insanely awful opinion as well, but I'm sure you could find someone that thinks that (even though DL has double the rides with many that are better than its counterpart).

The gap isn't as huge between DCA and HWS, so I am not saying people that think HWS are crazy, but it is there in terms of aesthetics, and as soon as you try to call out that HWS is literally littered with guest-visible cheap (yes, objectively cheap to produce, that's why it was replicated to WDS and DCA which were cheap disasters of parks on opening day) show buildings destroying immersion throughout the park, man, all logic is thrown out the window on this forum.

And no, just because it is supposed to be themed to something does not mean that theme is good. Like I've said before, Chester & Hester's road-side carnival tourist trap is a bad theme and it's irrelevant how well it nails the idea of it. The same applies to HWS' garbage areas, as they were cheap when the park was built as MGM Studios, but today, they completely lack the context it used to have to justify it in today's HWS, which it did because it was like visiting a working film studio. The only park that can get away with that today is Universal Studios Hollywood, but it somehow manages to have less of that exposed show building bleeding into the non-studio areas of the park than HWS, so why does HWS get a pass? 100% of it should be rethemed at HWS if you have a problem with the one area at DCA that has that the same cheap theme: Hollywoodland.

Again, this ranking is nowhere near an exact science, so don't take this as me saying it's a fact and deflect the conversation at hand, but take this as just as more of an idea of the sheer quantity of ugly areas at HWS that as the sum of its faults makes me laugh when people say DCA is uglier than HWS. It's just detached from reality.

I think if you put these Awful Areas category in a vacuum, the quantity of ugly/cheaply themed areas at HWS outnumbers DCA by significant margin. Would you have Commissary Lane up high? I just don't get your thought process so long as you're not applying the same metrics to one park as the other. If you are then you're biased in favor of HWS over DCA, thus my nostalgia blinding people comment.

• Map of very bad areas that have no place in a modern theme park.
• Hollywood Studios' ugly areas.
• A photo comparison of what are some of the ugliest areas in Disney theme parks including DCA's Hollywoodland.
• More photos.

Bruh, enough.

Not only are you off-topic, but your dissertations aren’t convincing anybody. Preferring DHS over DCA is a valid opinion.

If you don’t mind, some of us would like to discuss the latest addition to Toy Story Land, which this thread is actually about.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Did they ever complete this Toy Story Land?

 

[The Mom]

Could posters please stay on topic which is about one specific land, not the park as a whole? Thank you.