Tomorrowland Speedway - Big Tree Removed

[Phonedave]

They really can't complain when disney removes trees that they built 40 years ago, they aren't nature or old growth.

Not that I am complaining about THIS particular removal, but those are hardly criteria for determining is a tree should be removed or not.

-dave

 

[flavious27]

Not that I am complaining about THIS particular removal, but those are hardly criteria for determining is a tree should be removed or not.

-dave

Well it isn't intended to be the criteria for disney to remove a tree, but rather the criteria for an outside group to complain. I don't see a reason that disney would need to remove a tree from MK unless they just have to.

 

[autigger]

After three decades of growth, it had become a shady and park-like oasis but then ... most of the sizable trees in the Hub were removed. The area became (and remains) a hot, sun-scorched, tree-less plaza with open visual intrusions from Liberty Square through Tomorrowland to the Contemporary (and looming Bay Lake Tower).

When Disney removes the big, mature shade trees from its parks & property, it diminishes the environment - not in a broad ecological sense, but more in an aesthetic, place-making & design sense... at least until newly-planted ones grow up (if they are allowed to), but then we are talking a 20-40 year wait to re-establish that beatific presence.

I agree 100%. The hub is unbearable in the summer. The "celebrate" parade was unwatchable last July and those trees would have made a major difference.

 

[Phonedave]

Well it isn't intended to be the criteria for disney to remove a tree, but rather the criteria for an outside group to complain. I don't see a reason that disney would need to remove a tree from MK unless they just have to.

Trees are removed for all sorts of reasons. Many of them are not valid.

I happen to be an appointed Shade Tree Commissioner (NJ Urban Forestry CORE Certified, all that crapola. That an $1.50 will get you a cup of coffee)

I also happen to be a strong proponent of individual rights.

So while I will tell you that the tree on municipal property in front of your house is NOT comming down, despite how many leaves it drops, and if it comes down I will slap a fine on your rear - I will also not presume to tell someone what they can and cannot do with their personal property. I will offer recommendations, but they are free to throw them in the trash.

So there are definate reason to remove a tree. And there are many reasons to keep them. However, if Disney feels it is necessary to remove trees on their property, I am not going to bemoan their decision. Of course from design purposes it may be a poor choice, but it is their choice to make.

But just because a tree was not naturally seeded, or is 'only' 40 years old is not a criteria to decide if somone should complain about it. As soon as I stick 2" caliper tree in a municipal right of way, it is staying there. ( I also happen to be the planting co-ordinator )

-dave

 

[flavious27]

Trees are removed for all sorts of reasons. Many of them are not valid.

I happen to be an appointed Shade Tree Commissioner (NJ Urban Forestry CORE Certified, all that crapola. That an $1.50 will get you a cup of coffee)

I also happen to be a strong proponent of individual rights.

So while I will tell you that the tree on municipal property in front of your house is NOT comming down, despite how many leaves it drops, and if it comes down I will slap a fine on your rear - I will also not presume to tell someone what they can and cannot do with their personal property. I will offer recommendations, but they are free to throw them in the trash.

So there are definate reason to remove a tree. And there are many reasons to keep them. However, if Disney feels it is necessary to remove trees on their property, I am not going to bemoan their decision. Of course from design purposes it may be a poor choice, but it is their choice to make.

But just because a tree was not naturally seeded, or is 'only' 40 years old is not a criteria to decide if somone should complain about it. As soon as I stick 2" caliper tree in a municipal right of way, it is staying there. ( I also happen to be the planting co-ordinator )

-dave

I generally agree, we as disney fans do not want to see anything disrupted that doesn't have to be. The hub is a perfect example that will be brought up until they replant tress there and every after then because the trees aren't right.

But yes, disney can do what they want in their parks because it is their property. And my statement is for the Sierra Club groups that will protest the destruction of trees; the trees in the parks aren't native nor are they old growth which are two criteria that they and other groups use for their protests.

I think that tdo through the years hasn't taken into consideration the impact of most of their decisions, which is about as loaded of a statement as you can make. It is shocking to see the look of the park when it opened 40 years ago and how everything didn't have that grown in look. It is kinda of how parts of great adventure look; some of the park looks barren and others have the look that the park and buildings have been in place for decades. It is also how the main streets of different jersey towns look now vs historic pictures.

 

[Slowjack]

Now that the trees are gone, there is no more stage by stage reveal: from the moment you get past Main St. Station, the castle has a zoomed-in effect, making it more in-your-face, kitschy, plastic-y and toy-like in its unobstructed enormity.

Thanks for the pics--it's interesting, as someone who goes no more than once a year, how I can often tell something is very different about an area or view but can't always figure out what.

(As an aside--because "enormity" originally meant "great wickedness," I would pick another word unless you really dislike the castle that much ).

I think it's interesting that Disney has stated they are deliberately letting trees in the AK grow tall, even to dwarf the buildings, as a style motif. I wonder if they will really keep to that as the years go by.

This also reminds me how much I miss the parkland atmosphere (trees and water) in the fountain plaza of Future World.

 

[ThisKneeGuy]

^ Yes, sir.

Some visual samples from the old, arboreal MK:

Then came the men with axes (figuratively).

Note how before the trees were removed they partially obscured the castle, making it look more distant, mysterious, romantic, real. Now that the trees are gone, there is no more stage by stage reveal: from the moment you get past Main St. Station, the castle has a zoomed-in effect, making it more in-your-face, kitschy, plastic-y and toy-like in its unobstructed enormity.

Wow, what a great post! The MK with all of the trees does look a lot more romantic and "real". When were all of those trees at the end of Main St. removed? Put them back!!

And as far as the tree removed to make room for the diverted track at Tomorrowland Speedway, how about sparing the trees and removing the Speedway altogether? I've always thought that ride was awful, even when I was a kid. Especially after experiencing what a real go-kart feels like in Wisconsin Dells...

 

[jt04]

Wow, what a great post! The MK with all of the trees does look a lot more romantic and "real". When were all of those trees at the end of Main St. removed? Put them back!!

And as far as the tree removed to make room for the diverted track at Tomorrowland Speedway, how about sparing the trees and removing the Speedway altogether? I've always thought that ride was awful, even when I was a kid. Especially after experiencing what a real go-kart feels like in Wisconsin Dells...

I think they should remove the speedway AND all the trees on the speedway footprint. That way they could build a much needed E ticket.

As for the tree removed that started this thread, well that is one sorry excuse for a tree. I looks more like an overgrown bush. It will end up in the same landfill as toontown. Appropriate.

 

[Kev1417]

I swear when it comes to Disney doing things they are screwed if they do and screwed if they don't on this forum. If they would have kept the trees around main street and the hub people would be complaining how they can't see the fireworks, there are too many balloons/streamers caught in the trees that take away from their beauty, or there are too many leaves on the ground or that keep falling on them when they are sitting on the benches having a snack.

Now, on the other end, people now complain there is no shade, it doesn't look pretty anymore, etc. Nothing is ever going to be perfect in some people's eye. Just be happy there is a Disney! I know this is a forum to discuss Disney, but sometimes is just seems like a forum for people to complain because they are never happy or more likely is that never want Disney to change from what they remember as a child.

 

[degunter]

Clarification

Since I started this, I just wanted to say I was not complaining at all about the removal of the tree, I was just surprised that I had not heard anything about it. I meant it to be a sarcastic comment in that it seems like Disney is constantly being attacked for every little thing they do... and I do not think that is right.

I really like the Speedway... not because of any pleasure I get out of it personally, but when I can ride it with my nieces or nephews and see how much they love it. And I do have memories of riding in those cars as a kid and more so the fun times I have had in the past, what seemed like actually ageing a year or two while waiting in the line... but looking back they are all great memories. I wish there was a way to completely replace the speedway with something longer and more like Disneyland's Autopia... with the real cars and off road section and different tracks... fun times.

 

[WDW-Fan4Life]

The tree is gone and that's that. They did a great job preserving what they could. If they would have leveled the entire "Green" area and put a Radiator Springs fountain in the middle then that is a different story.

Older Pic's-People probably complained enough about not having a good view of the firework shows with all the trees in their way. Now with less trees people want more of them and bigger ones too. What a cycle.

 

[Enchantâmes]

Wow... this has to be the most pointless thread I have read in a while. And I just rhymed...

 

[bjlc57]

Thank God...

Hey.. some one finally posted what the front of the Magic Kingdom USED TO LOOK LIKE..

and I contend that there was even one tree that was bigger then shown in this photo.. and ITS GONE..


but in a sense , you had to cut back to give the sight lines to the Castle. especially on main street and the open area from Main street to the Castle.

looking at what main street was like, reminded me of the early 1950's and 60's where trees lined your "down town in small town America"...

but Dutch elm desease killed a ton of these tree lined streets.. across the country..

but finally, I am vindicated. THERE WERE BIG TREES before you walked into Magic KINGDOM..

100 year old trees I would bet.. if not older..

 

[wm49rs]

Hey.. some one finally posted what the front of the Magic Kingdom USED TO LOOK LIKE..

and I contend that there was even one tree that was bigger then shown in this photo.. and ITS GONE..


but in a sense , you had to cut back to give the sight lines to the Castle. especially on main street and the open area from Main street to the Castle.

looking at what main street was like, reminded me of the early 1950's and 60's where trees lined your "down town in small town America"...

but Dutch elm desease killed a ton of these tree lined streets.. across the country..

but finally, I am vindicated. THERE WERE BIG TREES before you walked into Magic KINGDOM..

100 year old trees I would bet.. if not older..

Vindicated? I don't think anyone disputed there were trees in there. In fact, there was another thread on the subject no too long ago....:shrug:

 

[rsoxguy]

All of the talk on this forum about unions and now, trees, takes me back to the music of my youth.

There is unrest in the forest,
There is trouble with the trees,
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their please.

The trouble with the maples,
(And they're quite convinced they're right)
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light.
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made.
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade.

There is trouble in the forest,
And the creatures all have fled,
As the maples scream "Oppression!"
And the oaks just shake their heads

So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights.
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."
Now there's no more oak oppression,
For they passed a noble law,
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw.

 

[WDW1974]

Wow... this has to be the most pointless thread I have read in a while. And I just rhymed...

There's a thread with I dunno how many posts about a fifth theme park that will never happen (likely the 654th posted here, or on other Disney fan sites, in the past year) ... and another about a fast food taco stand that is open maybe three months a year and yet you find a thread about removing a MASSIVE amount of trees in a subtropical climate with extreme heat/sun/humidity to be pointless?

Oh yeah, I won't make it through the weekend ...:wave:

 

[jt04]

All of the talk on this forum about unions and now, trees, takes me back to the music of my youth.

There is unrest in the forest,
There is trouble with the trees,
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their please.

The trouble with the maples,
(And they're quite convinced they're right)
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light.
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made.
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade.

There is trouble in the forest,
And the creatures all have fled,
As the maples scream "Oppression!"
And the oaks just shake their heads

So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights.
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."
Now there's no more oak oppression,
For they passed a noble law,
And the trees are all kept equal
By hatchet, axe, and saw.

So is this why the price of maple syrup is so inflated? :shrug:

 

[jmuboy]

On a Speedway related note, both times FL has expanded (first in 88 when they added Birthdayland and now with the Storybook Circus) the Sppedway has shrunk. The Speedway has lost probably 24-30% of its length over time. Look at over head pics from opening day to current (once the current work is complete).

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