Tiana's Bayou Adventure: Disneyland Watch & Discussion

[Nirya]

Wow how things change. I had significant studying and testing on this era. I didnt graduate too long ago either (in the grand scheme of things).

Thanks for sharing your professional expertise. Sounds like now it really is just glossed over.

If you want a fun (read: terrifying) story, I had a class in college with a really respected history professor. Like, dude went to Oxford, taught at Yale, and worked for the International Criminal Court building cases against war criminals. On the last day of this class (a study of Middle Eastern History), we had a discussion where he told us that when he studied US History at Oxford they did not cover Reconstruction at all, and asked us for any and all recommendations of historical coverage of the period. It was really eye-opening on how little the period gets covered.

 

[Brer Panther]

I don't want to push the "Show ignored content" button... could somebody please explain to me what's going on in this thread?

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

That's all I see too!

 

[Roger_the_pianist]

If you want a fun (read: terrifying) story, I had a class in college with a really respected history professor. Like, dude went to Oxford, taught at Yale, and worked for the International Criminal Court building cases against war criminals. On the last day of this class (a study of Middle Eastern History), we had a discussion where he told us that when he studied US History at Oxford they did not cover Reconstruction at all, and asked us for any and all recommendations of historical coverage of the period. It was really eye-opening on how little the period gets covered.

Wow. But I certainly believe that. I made a point (probably a few pages back) that history curriculum seems to split between 8 and 11 grade right at the Reconstruction, so thanks for elaborating.

What if someone raised their hand and said "Walt Disney made a movie about Reconstruction! But it's banned."

 

[Californian Elitist]

If you want a fun (read: terrifying) story, I had a class in college with a really respected history professor. Like, dude went to Oxford, taught at Yale, and worked for the International Criminal Court building cases against war criminals. On the last day of this class (a study of Middle Eastern History), we had a discussion where he told us that when he studied US History at Oxford they did not cover Reconstruction at all, and asked us for any and all recommendations of historical coverage of the period. It was really eye-opening on how little the period gets covered.

The majority of my Reconstruction education occurred in college, both as an undergrad and grad student. Same for the Civil War. There just isn’t enough time to fully cover topics in K-12 and spend weeks and months learning about one thing.

 

[BasiltheBatLord]

Can you give an example of another piece of media more problematic than Song of the South? Particularly one geared to children?

I don't know, Triumph of the Will? Momotaro's Divine Sea Warriors? Anything to ever come out of the Hitler Youth? That's kind of a softball question.

a film that tries to rewrite history and depict basically the opposite of what society was dealing with at the time it was set and the time it was released.

I don't think they were "trying" to do anything but make a good movie based on the source material (whether they did or not is of course up for debate), there wasn't some grand white supremacist conspiracy at play here among the animators and film executives of Burbank, California. But feel free to believe whatever you like as I'm sure you will do anyway.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

I couldn't help but click Show Ignored Content with the quoted swill in that post.

"Can you give an example of another piece of media more problematic than Song of the South?"

This is where we're at, folks. I think we're coming in for a landing on George Lucas' time here. Song of the South is now worse than Birth of a Nation!

 

[mickEblu]

If Song of the South ever comes out of the Disney *vault* it would need much more than the Disney+ disclaimer as in Dumbo, Aristocats, Peter Pan, Swiss Fam.

It would also need more than the prologue we got with Gone With the Wind.

It's likely never going to be released. A well prepared documentary is about the most I could imagine.

There's so much more to unpack with that film than in the shorts like Mickey's Mellerdrammer, the WW2 propaganda, or the Censored 11.

Song of the South goes leaps and bounds beyond cartoonist stereotypes. It glazes over history in a way that no other media has approached.

Literal musical numbers about how everything is "satisfactual"

Then to have a thrill ride in multiple parks celebrate that, bins of plushies, commerative pins...call me *woke* but I'd rather be woke on an issue than asleep.

History is going to be taught differently in every classroom across the country. Even with standardized curriculum you are going to have personal bias of a teacher showing. A

I had a high school biology teacher breeze through evolution then talk about 7 days of creation.

8th grade is often colonialism to the Civil War, Junior year of high school is Civil War to current, without much time spent on Reconstruction. I think most Americans don't have a good concept of what was going on in the post Civil War era. I lived in Atlanta for a year and would often joke that the city is STILL under Reconstruction (because of cranes and building projects everywhere) but in reality it is still very much socially under Reconstruction.

If Song of the South and the second act of Gone With the Wind are our best understandings of Reconstruction, that's very skewed.

As it relates to Splash Mountain, it IS BASED ON Song of the South. Any argument that it is not is absurd. Someone on this forum literally posted the guide map description which at WDW mentioned Song of the South but didn't mention the film at DL.

So Splash Mountain is the skewed Reconstruction era attraction.

So you’ve never been on Splash Mountain right?

 

[Roger_the_pianist]

Yeah, I have. Please don't say it's not based on Song of the South.

 

[mickEblu]

Yeah, I have. Please don't say it's not based on Song of the South.

If it’s so problematic, why were you riding it?

 

[1HAPPYGHOSTHOST]

What does any of this have to do with a log flume ride with singing chickens and not one black or white person on the ride?

 

[Californian Elitist]

I couldn't help but click Show Ignored Content with the quoted swill in that post.

"Can you give an example of another piece of media more problematic than Song of the South?"

This is where we're at, folks. I think we're coming in for a landing on George Lucas' time here. Song of the South is now worse than Birth of a Nation!

Birth of a Nation isn’t geared towards children.

 

[Roger_the_pianist]

Birth of a Nation wasn't a Disney sing along nor does it have a theme park ride based on it.

But of course I agree, Birth of the Nation is a problematic movie, but I haven't seen it.

 

[Roger_the_pianist]

If neither the stories by Joel Chandler Harris nor Song of the South ever existed, would Splash Mountain still be problematic?

Splash Mountain would not exist in this scenario.

 

[Californian Elitist]

If neither the stories by Joel Chandler Harris nor Song of the South ever existed, would Splash Mountain still be problematic?

Had Disney used any other film, let’s say Winnie the Pooh or The Rescuers or any of the other critter films they have, I very much doubt this thread would exist. Not sure what they were thinking in the 80s when they decided to use SotS as inspiration.

 

[Mac Tonight]

For one thing, they were thinking with 1980's sensibilities... not 2021's. That's not an "excuse" or a "cop out", just a statement of fact.
They also didn't live with social media and all it's accompanying "outrage" culture.

"Hey, here are some fun cartoon characters that have sat dormant for over 40 years, and they'd be fun to have in a log flume attraction... surely this won't people off in 40 years..." - Tony Baxter

 

[MassScott84]

For one thing, they were thinking with 1980's sensibilities... not 2021's. That's not an "excuse" or a "cop out", just a statement of fact.
They also didn't live with social media and all it's accompanying "outrage" culture.

"Hey, here are some fun cartoon characters that have sat dormant for over 40 years, and they'd be fun to have in a log flume attraction... surely this won't **** people off in 40 years..." - Tony Baxter

Except by that point SOTS was already considered problematic at least by TWDC. Certainly enough to never release it on home video.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

I hate this place that's it

 

[Mac Tonight]

Except by that point SOTS was already considered problematic at least by TWDC. Certainly enough to never release it on home video.

I'm sure the source material was considered problematic... but they clearly felt that they had distinguished Splash from SOTS enough so as to not raise a fuss. After all, how silly of them to clone an attraction in 2 other parks if they truly felt it was so controversial.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Except by that point SOTS was already considered problematic at least by TWDC. Certainly enough to never release it on home video.

Exactly. There were issues prior to the 80s. The film was immediately boycotted after its release.