Tiana's Bayou Adventure: Disneyland Watch & Discussion

LittleBuford

Well-Known Member
Which proves the point of how ridiculous the attraction theme is. A princess dressing up in an adventurer's outfit going to a salt mine looking for cooking ingredients.
The film doesn’t end with her living a life of luxury in some palace. She is shown as an active businesswoman running the lively restaurant she’d always dreamed of owning. Yes, she’s also a princess, but your framing is misleading and tendentious.
 
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celluloid

Well-Known Member
The people stating or liking comments that allude to those not having any high hopes for the attraction replacement based on company's recent reputation being too negative, are the same ones who felt Haunted Mansion and Wish were somehow profitable.
The same people can't imagine this ride will be mid at best.
Brand loyalists.
 

SplashJacket

Well-Known Member
The people stating or liking comments that allude to those not having any high hopes for the attraction replacement based on company's recent reputation being too negative, are the same ones who felt Haunted Mansion and Wish were somehow profitable.
The same people can't imagine this ride will be mid at best.
Brand loyalists.
I find it bizarre that anyone who hates Disney/prays on its downfall would be on a Disney forum at all.

That hatred might be more nuanced, you might like the “old Disney” and not the “new Disney” but regardless.
I’m not on a McDonalds forum spending my time talking about how much I hate McDonalds. I’m not preaching that since Mac Tonight ended, McDonalds has gone the drain. It’s silly and a waste of time. I would just move on with my life.

The same people can't imagine this ride will be mid at best.
Brand loyalists.
That’s just an objectively false statement.

Even if Disney has always been terrible, there’s absolutely nothing stopping this ride from being the best ride in the world. There’s also nothing stopping it from being the worst ride in the world.

Obviously, I would say they’re both exceeding unlikely scenarios, but technically, they’re still in the realm of possibility.

If you were saying you believe the ride will be trash, that’s a valid statement. If you believe it’ll be amazing, that’s also a valid statement. But mid at best is just impossible because we haven’t ridden or honestly know much about it.

With a 95% confidence interval, I’d predict it’s probably mid at worst (execution faults of animatronics and cohesion) and amazing at best.

Early on, when this was first announced, I fully expected and agreed that it would be aggressively mediocre, but as time passed and we learned about the quality and quantity of animatronics and increased funding, there’s literally zero reason to believe the ceiling is mediocre. Poor execution may make it mediocre, but that’s not the ceiling.

So complain about brand loyalists, which, you should expect on a Disney forum, but I’d honestly prefer brand loyalists to an unhinged cynic.
 
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Disney Irish

Premium Member
I find it bizarre that anyone who hates Disney/prays on its downfall would be on a Disney forum at all.

That hatred might be more nuanced, you might like the “old Disney” and not the “new Disney” but regardless.
I’m not on a McDonalds forum spending my time talking about how much I hate McDonalds. I’m not preaching that everything since the Mac Tonight ended, McDonalds has gone the drain. It’s silly and a waste of time. I would just move on with my life.


That’s just an objectively false statement.

Even if Disney has always been terrible, there’s absolutely nothing stopping this ride from being the best ride in the world. There’s also nothing stopping it from being the worst ride in the world.

Obviously, I would say they’re both exceeding unlikely scenarios, but technically, they’re still in the realm of possibility.

If you were saying you believe the ride will be trash, that’s a valid statement. If you believe it’ll be amazing, that’s also a valid statement. But mid at best is just impossible because we haven’t ridden or honestly know much about it.

With a 95% confidence interval, I’d predict it’s probably mid at worst (execution faults of animatronics and cohesion) and amazing at best.

Early on, when this was first announced, I fully expected and agreed that it would be aggressively mediocre, but as time passed and we learned about the quality and quantity of animatronics and increased funding, there’s literally zero reason to believe the ceiling is mediocre. Poor execution may make it mediocre, but that’s not the ceiling.

So complain about brand loyalists, which, you should expect on a Disney forum, but I’d honestly prefer brand loyalists to an unhinged cynic.
Man, I miss Mac Tonight. That was classic McD's, it never got better than that.
 

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
I find it bizarre that anyone who hates Disney/prays on its downfall would be on a Disney forum at all.
I think you’re mistaking disappointment for hatred.

The problem is we love Disney, we just don’t like what they’re doing right now.

Think of it like a sports team, if your team starts losing most their games you don’t stop loving them, you complain about the coach and the players and you talk about what you think they need to do to become a winning team again. That’s current Disney, we complain about Iger (the coach) and the team (the creatives) and some even hope they continue to lose because the inevitable outcome is the coach and players will be replaced with new people who will get back to winning.

If Iger and the creatives knock a couple out of the park the complaining will stop, just like when a team goes on a winning streak, if they keep failing the complaining will just get louder though.
 

J4546

Well-Known Member
In disneyland, I think theyve done pretty well lately with the Treehouse, Reimagined TT with MMRR, and smaller things like Harbour Galley expansion and HM Que stuff I think looks like it will be a nice upgrade....I think TBA will also be as well.

FL I like overall as well, though I dont live there and only visit every couple of years for a couple of days. last time I went I spent 3 day in Universal parks and 2 in Disney. 1 at AK and 1 at Epcot and it was right when GotG opened and it was great. AK is awesome, my fave FL park andAvatar land is such a great upgrade. Ill go back to FL later this year and spend 4 days 2 and Disney and 2 at Universal and go to Epcot again to experience Epcot without the walls and new communicore plaza/Jow and nighttime show as well as MK this time for Tron and TBA.
 
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PiratesMansion

Well-Known Member
I think you’re mistaking disappointment for hatred.

The problem is we love Disney, we just don’t like what they’re doing right now.

Think of it like a sports team, if your team starts losing most their games you don’t stop loving them, you complain about the coach and the players and you talk about what you think they need to do to become a winning team again. That’s current Disney, we complain about Iger (the coach) and the team (the creatives) and some even hope they continue to lose because the inevitable outcome is the coach and players will be replaced with new people who will get back to winning.

If Iger and the creatives knock a couple out of the park the complaining will stop, just like when a team goes on a winning streak, if they keep failing the complaining will just get louder though.
I have to be honest and say that while I can agree with this for some, it doesn't feel like disappointment for others.

For those people, it feels like something more. Perhaps Hatred. Perhaps Contempt. Definitely Fixation. A determination to see this project as the most objectionable thing Disney's ever done whether or not it's merited. A desire or need to see every detail no matter how innoculous or not matter how it's presented as confirmation for their views. Arguments framed by a thinly veiled false front of wanting to be "objective" or "open to this project in theory," but instead leaving a constant barrage of screeds against this choice or that.

And frankly, it's not at all hard to see those views come through, which is why I feel like it's funny that people who are not inherently scorched earth regarding this project are branded by some as head-in-the-sand brand loyalists even if those who are not flat out against the project have offered no shortage of criticism of other things Disney has done.

Iger and creatives could very well knock this out of the park and some will very well keep complaining, loudly and frequently. We know this to be true because Disney fans complain about literally everything whether justified or not, and let's be real, there are some on here and elsewhere that were/are so mad about this project, and/or so attached to Splash Mountain, that they will hate it even if imagineering DOES knock it out of the park, justified in turn by deep loyalty to Splash or Tony Baxter or whatever the justification turns out to be that week. I would love to believe that if the attraction is a masterpiece (which I will freely admit is not necessarily assured) the dwelling would stop, but experience tells me otherwise. It's far more likely we end up with an outcome where some will still be dwelling on this in twenty years no matter how well TBA turns out than one where people are unanimously bowled over by the transformation. Some have invested so much of themselves into hating every fiber of this project to ever see things that way.
 
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celluloid

Well-Known Member
So complain about brand loyalists, which, you should expect on a Disney forum, but I’d honestly prefer brand loyalists to an unhinged cynic.
Who complained that loyalists exist? Observation.
Now we are calling others Unhinged? The defensiveness is real.

Brand loyalist is a real thing. Unhinged is not such. Check yourself quick before that kind of thing gets reported.

Pointing out brand loyalty does not equal complaining, nor is expecting to be being disappointed in current efforts making someone an unhinged cynic. No one is complaining that people are loyal to the brand. It is a fact. It is also a fact that Disney's specific brand reputation is damaged.

Disney rethemes have historically not often been fantastic, and recent years, even less. It makes sense with the turn around that people are not exactly having high hopes compared to staging and care there before. It could be great. But the expectation of "mid" as the kids say makes sense.

There is nothing unhinged about that. Intelligent reasoning of expectation. You calling it unhinged is calling someone's opinion dumb, and insulting them as unstable.

Brand Loyalist is a term defined in business school as those who are loyal to the brand as the relevant choice for a long time. I made an observation that the same people who always see Disney's least successful as successful are the same who are claiming the highest hopes for this.
You could have used Disenchanted or any other term for someone not excited about current project, service or product.

Instead you used:

Unhinged: highly disturbed, unstable, or distraught.

Not really a scholarly definition you brought in there. Let's call it a mulligan so you are not reported for name calling.
 
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Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
I have to be honest and say that while I can agree with this for some, it doesn't feel like disappointment for others.

I’m sure that’s true but I think “some” is a very large percent of the complainers, I think most people here are huge Disney fans that are disappointed with recent things like G+, reservations, huge visible show buildings, questionable upkeep, lackluster movies, etc.

Disney overall is still amazing but the decisions over the last couple years have been far more miss than hit, skepticism as a defense mechanism makes sense at this point.
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
I’m sure that’s true but I think “some” is a very large percent of the complainers, I think most people here are huge Disney fans that are disappointed with recent things like G+, reservations, huge visible show buildings, questionable upkeep, lackluster movies, etc.

Disney overall is still amazing but the decisions over the last couple years have been far more miss than hit, skepticism as a defense mechanism makes sense at this point.

What we have seen lately is the customer has more often come to expect disappointment or a status quo that they are not happy with compared to their own previous standards.

In the entertainment world you are a product of and only as good as the last thing you did. For Disney right now to the general audience, that is not exactly impressing, delighting, or wow-ing very often. We here the brand loyalty hopes here, but the numbers and results show otherwise.
 

ParkPeeker

Well-Known Member
For Disney right now to the general audience, that is not exactly impressing, delighting, or wow-ing very often. We here the brand loyalty hopes here, but the numbers and results show otherwise.
talking theme parks and Disneyland, it's not that deep for the general audience. They're happy with the new attractions and still come out to the parks despite all the changes. Whereas Disney fans and Disney forum users more specifically seem a lot more negative or hurt about everything.
 

TragicMike

Well-Known Member
Is it set in the Bayou? I thought it was set inside a Salt Dome 3 hours away from New Orleans. And, funnily enough, Avery Island's Salt Dome isn't a mountain, it’s simply a large flat elevation change. View attachment 769970

There's no peaks really. So it must be set even further away.

The highest "mountain" in Louisiana is Driskill Mountain and that's only a 2-mile hike to the top. That's located about 5 hours north of New Orleans and isn't in the Bayou.

I was excited to bring my 5 year old niece to this ride but now I don’t know what I’ll do when she inevitably questions me on Louisiana geography.
 

Consumer

Well-Known Member
Honestly the changes mean very little to me at this point. Do I wish Tower of Terror, Splash Mountain, and everything else I like about Disneyland remained as it was? Of course. But, truthfully, I would still go to Disneyland even with these changes. The problem I have is the ridiculous price increase. The parks simply are not affordable anymore. I know this video is about WDW, but it really showcases the problem with the US parks at the moment. They're inaccessible and unaffordable. I'm far happier traveling the country, seeing the beauty of creation, and visiting history for less than it costs to go to Disney.
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
talking theme parks and Disneyland, it's not that deep for the general audience. They're happy with the new attractions and still come out to the parks despite all the changes. Whereas Disney fans and Disney forum users more specifically seem a lot more negative or hurt about everything.
The numbers all around say otherwise.

It is not about being hurt. It is about business and how healthy the climate is.
 

PiratesMansion

Well-Known Member
The numbers all around say otherwise.

It is not about being hurt. It is about business and how healthy the climate is.
What numbers are you referring to?

If you're talking attendance numbers vs what they were ~5-6 years ago, while that's true, it's not so black and white as to say "Disney making bad choices, therefore numbers worse." In reality, the entire industry is struggling. People like to pretend that it isn't because Universal continues to do impressive numbers and expand aggressively, but Universal is largely an anomoly and almost everyone else is hurting on some level. Go beyond Universal and Disney to some other park (something few on this forum seem to do with any regularity) and you'll see the same sorts of things people are criticizing Disney for: higher prices, worse service, fewer CMs, seemingly increased reliability issues, less entertainment, etc. People might even, in that situation, recognize that Disneyland still looks pretty good by comparison to many other places. People like to pretend that Disneyland isn't just a really good amusement park at the end of the day and is uniquely special because of nostalgia or Insert Qualifier Here, but at the end of the day, that's what it is, and that does mean that it is sometimes affected in a way that mirrors what's happening elsewhere in the industry.

If it's guest satisfaction scores, I imagine a lot of that is because of G+, which indeed should be better, though a lot of the problems could be solved with a higher pricepoint and/or a more functional app. It can be frustrating, but I don't think it's quite as bad as many here believe it to be. That's very much a situation that could be affected by me being a tourist who was buying MaxPass anyway, though, and I might well view that particular situation very differently if I was local.

If the numbers are in reference to something else, please elaborate.

Park Reservations are stupid and should go. I won't contest that (though selfishly I hope they'll at least remain in place for my upcoming Winter Break trip. Probably won't do much, granted, but I'll take anything that might give me the slightest illusion that Christmas week won't be complete and utter chaos).

I also won't contest the decline of Walt Disney World. That's a whole separate issue.

There have been negative changes, certainly. Undoubtedly, some have stopped visiting because of them. But it's hard for me to point my finger at Disney for being such a failure-or come to the conclusion that their lower numbers are obviously because of Insert Personal Grievance Here-when I know that almost everyone in the business (whether we're discussing movie studio or theme park industry business) is struggling to hit where they were pre-pandemic. And while there are definitely things that could and should be better, I don't believe the parks experience, at least at DLR, is as fundamentally broken as some on here claim it is. Disney simply is not in an unsalvageable position creatively or otherwise at this point, no matter how much some might want to push that narrative.
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
What numbers are you referring to?

If you're talking attendance numbers vs what they were ~5-6 years ago, while that's true, it's not so black and white as to say "Disney making bad choices, therefore numbers worse." In reality, the entire industry is struggling. People like to pretend that it isn't because Universal continues to do impressive numbers and expand aggressively, but Universal is largely an anomoly and almost everyone else is hurting on some level. Go beyond Universal and Disney to some other park (something few on this forum seem to do with any regularity) and you'll see the same sorts of things people are criticizing Disney for: higher prices, worse service, fewer CMs, seemingly increased reliability issues, less entertainment, etc. People might even, in that situation, recognize that Disneyland still looks pretty good by comparison to many other places. People like to pretend that Disneyland isn't just a really good amusement park at the end of the day and is uniquely special because of nostalgia or Insert Qualifier Here, but at the end of the day, that's what it is, and that does mean that it is sometimes affected in a way that mirrors what's happening elsewhere in the industry.

If it's guest satisfaction scores, I imagine a lot of that is because of G+, which indeed should be better, though a lot of the problems could be solved with a higher pricepoint and/or a more functional app. It can be frustrating, but I don't think it's quite as bad as many here believe it to be. That's very much a situation that could be affected by me being a tourist who was buying MaxPass anyway, though, and I might well view that particular situation very differently if I was local.

If the numbers are in reference to something else, please elaborate.

Park Reservations are stupid and should go. I won't contest that (though selfishly I hope they'll at least remain in place for my upcoming Winter Break trip. Probably won't do much, granted, but I'll take anything that might give me the slightest illusion that Christmas week won't be complete and utter chaos).

I also won't contest the decline of Walt Disney World. That's a whole separate issue.

There have been negative changes, certainly. Undoubtedly, some have stopped visiting because of them. But it's hard for me to point my finger at Disney for being such a failure-or come to the conclusion that their lower numbers are obviously because of Insert Personal Grievance Here-when I know that almost everyone in the business (whether we're discussing movie studio or theme park industry business) is struggling to hit where they were pre-pandemic. And while there are definitely things that could and should be better, I don't believe the parks experience, at least at DLR, is as fundamentally broken as some on here claim it is. Disney simply is not in an unsalvageable position creatively or otherwise at this point, no matter how much some might want to push that narrative.

Notice how you can have a variety of number results, they are all down and yet even after Galaxy's Edge, Marvel attractions on both coasts and new offerings in since pandemic they just can't get the needle moved.
It's not just Florida. Universal Hollywood had larger growth in their 2021 to 2022 year than reports for DL had, and that is post DL's premier of Avengers Campus and a year before Mario at Universal, so imagine it now.
Saying it is the entire industry is kind of like it's the entire box office thing. Plenty of studios are getting healthier numbers, as are attractions in the industry. Disney has shown people have not kept back to them the same way.
If what they did for Marvel and Star Wars did not do that. I don't think a rethemed of Splash to Tiana will move the needle much.
 

PiratesMansion

Well-Known Member
Notice how you can have a variety of number results, they are all down and yet even after Galaxy's Edge, Marvel attractions on both coasts and new offerings in since pandemic they just can't get the needle moved.
It's not just Florida. Universal Hollywood had larger growth in their 2021 to 2022 year than reports for DL had, and that is post DL's premier of Avengers Campus and a year before Mario at Universal, so imagine it now.
Saying it is the entire industry is kind of like it's the entire box office thing. Plenty of studios are getting healthier numbers, as are attractions in the industry. Disney has shown people have not kept back to them the same way.
If what they did for Marvel and Star Wars did not do that. I don't think a rethemed of Splash to Tiana will move the needle much.
And nothing here really seems to disprove my basic argument.

Which studios are consistently doing better? Where's the source that proves this beyond just some vague notion? There have been a handful of box office smashes, sure, but there aren't really entire studios doing much better than Disney. Pretty much every movie company isn't where it was five years ago. Warners is openly struggling, Paramount is all but dead, but sure, the real problem is Disney's box office.

And as I said, sure, Universal's doing great. Trouble is, no one else really is. So that doesn't really disprove the notion that the theme park industry's in a slump. Disney's numbers and overall experience is still better than anyone else at the moment. Doesn't mean they're doing everything right, but again, try going to a non-Disney, non-Universal park some time, and you'll see a lot of the same problems Disney has, but worse. Six Flags and Cedar Fair aren't merging and independent parks aren't closing or ceasing to operate rides just for funzies.

I don't recall anyone ever saying that a rethemed attraction will move the needle in some sort of record-smashing way on either coast.
 
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