The League of Dreamers: Team Odyssey - Fantasyland

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Spike-in-Berlin, I really like your approach to this. I too want to go with something recognisable as a classic Magic Kingdom park (castle, hub, lands etc.) but with a bold new direction in some areas. Now I'm assuming that this park would be built outside the US (having a location really impacts how we design it). Perhaps we could assume its the Shanghai park we're designing?

For the attractions which are definably Disney, and which we really should include, I would list;

Disneyland Railroad
Jungle Cruise
Pirates of the Caribbean
Haunted Mansion
Big Thunder Mountain
Carousel
Dumbo the Flying Elephant
Peter Pan's Flight
"it's a small world"
Space Mountain

I think Star Tours (2.0) and the Indiana Jones Adventure are also good additions. My main suggestion though concerns Big Thunder Mountain - I actually think we shouldn't include a Frontierland in our park, as I don't think it has the same ressonance anymore - especially outside America where the history angle is lost.

I also don't think the traditional Main Street USA would work. Now it could be updated to the 1920s version we all know about (not very original considering the Disneyland Paris Imagineers designed much of it), or 1950s (but I think another team is doing that), or we could go for something more unique - but I realise people might be apprehensive about moving too far from the classic model.

Other thoughts; perhaps an Aladdin Castle leading to Adventureland at the northern most point rather than Fantasyland (which would be moved to the west)? Not too fond of this myself but thought I'd throw it out there.

I think the best way to do this is just to get as many ideas suggested and then pick and choose from those. Lets not hear one idea then definately decide we're going to do it just yet.

I agree about most you wrote but we shouldn't forget, that we are only allowed to include, how many, 15 or so clones in the entire park. There are some icons which are an essential element of the layout, e.g. I cannot imagine a disneyland-style park without a railroad around the berm, so that is a must. But do we really need another Peter Pans Flight (I love it, but that is not the point)? Or Dumbos Elephants? And IASW is not very popular in DLP, I consider it a dated attraction actually. Be honest, if you could chose between IASW and any "Disney Mountain" what would you chose? If we clone I think we should clone rides that are breathtaking peaks of imagineering that even WDW doesn't feature, especially Indiana Jones Adventure from DL, which would mend perfectly well with a Jungle Cruise and Journey to the Center of the Earth from TDS.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

And some basics for all of us. We are planning a maximum of 35 attractions and if I got it right we are allowed to include only 15 clones. Leaves us with nothing less than up to 20 new attractions to design. Quite a task and although I would consider a never built but planned attraction like Fire Mountain (That one MUST be a part of our Adventureland) not a clone, I think we cannot fill up the park with 20 never-built attractions, we need new ideas for attractions.

So what is an attraction? I wouldn't count M+Gs as attractions, neither do I count any shop or themed restaurant.
Attractions are shows (static), rides (normally but not necessarily mobile), walkthroughs, exhibitions and playgrounds.

Shows can be of three kinds:

Movies, perhaps with 4D enhancement: Philharmagic, ITTBAB etc.

Stage Shows with live actors: FotLK, LMS, etc.

Shows with AA: Enchanted Tiki Room, Hall of Presidents, SGE, former Cranium Command which was a very interesting mixture of both, movie and AA show.

And then there are rides. We have two kinds of rides, simulated and real ones.

Simulated rides are any flight simulators like Star Tours or former Body Wars, Mission Space centrifuges and such special simulations as the former Mission to Mars. Big plus: No large ride building necessary normally.

Real rides are finally those which involve a real movement of the guests in any way.
Car rides like TL speedway.
Dark rides with either omnimovers (HM) or boats (PotC). A nice twist of the dark rides are suspended rides like Peter Pans Flight which give you more liberties concerning the track layout.
Log Flume Rides like SpM
Raft rides like Kali River Rapids
Outdoor boat rides like Jungle Cruise but also 20KLutS which was boat ride, not a submarine ride as the subs never submerged.
Rollercoasters like BTMR, EE and SM.
EMV-Rides like Dinosaur
Train rides like the WDW-Railroad.
Traditional amusement park rides like Carrousel, Dumbo or Mad Tea Party.

Walkthroughs. HM and PotC both were originally planned as walkthroughs but became rides. Walkthroughs are Swiss Family Treehouse or Aladdins Enchanted Passage in DLP (really boring btw) but they are very rare.

Exhibitions: There were quite some exhibitions that were interesting, Disney Story etc. but they are only playing a very small role in a traditional Disneypark. It's a little different in EPCOT of course.

Playgrounds: For kids only normally but quite popular, like Poohs Playground or this excavation playground in Dinoland USA.


There are or were some special rides that combine several elements (Horizons, Maelstrom) or are very difficult to define (Twister in USF e.g. ) but that's about it I believe. So we have to chose from this huge variety our 20 new attractions and/or do a brainstorming about additional new ride ideas.

 

[MouseketeerCole]

Then how about this; let's be extreme strict about allowing ourselves clones unless we reimagine them to a significant degree - perhaps with only one or two exceptions (Railroad and Carousel)? I definately support populating this with original attractions as the majority - and not resorting to never built attractions either.

I think the first stage is to;

1. Brainstorm possible lands
2. Choose the land line-up
3. Brainstorm attractions for those lands

I agree with being very current about this. Let's not include things for tradition unless they can justify their inclusion now (although I disagree with IASW not being popular at DLP - it just has a very large capacity so it never gets queues, same with Pirates at Disneyland California).

I also know what you're saying about Meet & Greets not being attractions, but I think the Next-Gen Meet & Greets which will be showing up in the Florida FLE are so much expanded that they do deserve attraction status.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Then how about this; let's be extreme strict about allowing ourselves clones unless we reimagine them to a significant degree - perhaps with only one or two exceptions (Railroad and Carousel)? I definately support populating this with original attractions as the majority - and not resorting to never built attractions either.

I think the first stage is to;

1. Brainstorm possible lands
2. Choose the land line-up
3. Brainstorm attractions for those lands

I agree with being very current about this. Let's not include things for tradition unless they can justify their inclusion now (although I disagree with IASW not being popular at DLP - it just has a very large capacity so it never gets queues, same with Pirates at Disneyland California).

I also know what you're saying about Meet & Greets not being attractions, but I think the Next-Gen Meet & Greets which will be showing up in the Florida FLE are so much expanded that they do deserve attraction status.

Let me first say this Cole, your site is nothing less than terrific! Thanks a lot for all the informations, I bookmarked it at once.

I would really like to do a brainstorming about how many and what kind of lands we want, as this is a interesting question (do we need a Liberty Square? Do we build again a Tomorrowland although we know about the problems, coming with this theming?) but if I got it right, the lands are named to us by the competitions administrator and then we design them. I don't know if we have free choice what lands we want to include in the park. So far we only heard about FL and Main Street USA.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Btw, good news (at least concerning the competition). From tomorrow on I have a kind of holiday. No major work for at least a week, so I have a lot of time to invest in our competition.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Then how about this; let's be extreme strict about allowing ourselves clones unless we reimagine them to a significant degree - perhaps with only one or two exceptions (Railroad and Carousel)? I definately support populating this with original attractions as the majority - and not resorting to never built attractions either.

But please I really need my Fire Mountain, it's my favorite never built attraction and would be a terrific weenie for our AL.

 

[universalmickey]

we can do some Marvel rides also, since Disney now own Marvel

 

[MaterA113]

I see you all are eagerly jumping into more than just Main Street/Fantasyland..

Please do not go ahead into other lands.

Thank You!

 

[universalmickey]

ok, lets focus on Fantasyland

 

[stitchcastle]

This Paradise Pier influence doesn't happen to involve a certain nighttime show does it? Cause I do have ideas for that sorta thing.

I've thought about that but no, crowd control issues would be quite a headache if we put such a massive show in Fantasyland.

The Paradise Pier influence, I thought of it as a good way to let the more exotic themed attractions to fit into Fantasyland as part of this big travelling Fantasy circus. We could then presumably have The Little Mermaid, Aladdin, Dumbo, even the Pirates.

This would then let it be a natural transition between Fantasyland and Adventureland

 

[stitchcastle]

I am however concerned about the size of a ride in the castle. I don't think that it is possible to build a too elaborated ride inside the castle because we don't have the possibility to connect the castle, as it is located in the very center of the park, to any large building which could house the ride, like they did for HM or PotC in DL. Perhaps a show based attraction would be more suitable for the castle, like they did with IttbaB in the Tree of Life in DAK.

I think it's possible, we could just have the entrance of the ride inside the castle and then queue the guests to the west or east wing.

 

[stitchcastle]

Spike-in-Berlin, I really like your approach to this. I too want to go with something recognisable as a classic Magic Kingdom park (castle, hub, lands etc.) but with a bold new direction in some areas. Now I'm assuming that this park would be built outside the US (having a location really impacts how we design it). Perhaps we could assume its the Shanghai park we're designing?

For the attractions which are definably Disney, and which we really should include, I would list;

Disneyland Railroad
Jungle Cruise
Pirates of the Caribbean
Haunted Mansion
Big Thunder Mountain
Carousel
Dumbo the Flying Elephant
Peter Pan's Flight
"it's a small world"
Space Mountain

I think Star Tours (2.0) and the Indiana Jones Adventure are also good additions. My main suggestion though concerns Big Thunder Mountain - I actually think we shouldn't include a Frontierland in our park, as I don't think it has the same ressonance anymore - especially outside America where the history angle is lost.

I also don't think the traditional Main Street USA would work. Now it could be updated to the 1920s version we all know about (not very original considering the Disneyland Paris Imagineers designed much of it), or 1950s (but I think another team is doing that), or we could go for something more unique - but I realise people might be apprehensive about moving too far from the classic model.

Other thoughts; perhaps an Aladdin Castle leading to Adventureland at the northern most point rather than Fantasyland (which would be moved to the west)? Not too fond of this myself but thought I'd throw it out there.

I think the best way to do this is just to get as many ideas suggested and then pick and choose from those. Lets not hear one idea then definately decide we're going to do it just yet.

I agree about pretty much all of those points, except maybe Adventureland. I sort of want a whole 1920's explorers theme connecting all of Adventureland (this would work well with the general 20's feel of Main Street). We could potentially bring in the Society of Explorers and Adventurer's storyline into the entire land with attractions concerning its famed members: Harrison Hightower, Lord Henry Mystic, Henry Jones Sr. etc...

I also think we can forgo Star Tours and think up a bigger, more elaborate Star Wars attraction.

 

[MaterA113]

Please DO NOT work on any other lands than Trevor said you could, so please just work on Fantasyland at the moment... A new land (i think Adventureland, not sure...) will be coming up within the next 2 days!

Thank You!

 

[stitchcastle]

oops! sorry ^_^

anyway, back to Fantasyland.

I think we have to keep it simple, we can't make our Fantasyland too massive that it completely dwarfs all the other lands, especially considering this is not a park for WDW where it's okay to have a huge Fantasyland.

Here is my attraction roster proposal:

Fantasyland
*~Castle Courtyard - The castle itself is the main Disney Castle from the company's logo and will be massive, with two stages on either side, perfect for shows.

The castle itself will have 2 attractions within:

*Mickey's Philharmagic - our first 'clone'
*Disney's Bedtime Story - using the Hunny Hunt ride system, The Blue Fairy tells us a magical tale by bringing to life our collection of dolls and having them reenact famous children's stories.

coming out of the castle we have a wide courtyard that is used for shows, particularly
*Clopin's Festival of Fools - a loud, colorful show that announces the arrival of the Fantasy Cirucs to town.

*Cinderella's Glass Carousel - directly after the stage, on a mound surrounded by a Swan moat is the beautiful 2-level glass domed Carousel themed after Cinderella.

*~Fairy Tale Village - The part of the land that we see directly after the castle. Themed to a nondescript European village (looks predominantly mediterranean) Canals wind through this picturesque little village. The attractions are as follows:

*Fantasyland Gondolas - fanciful gondolas travel throughout all of Fantasyland with 4 stops: The Fairy Tale Village, The Fantasy Circus, The Park's central plaza, and the foot of the Forbidden Mountain (more on that later).

*Mad Hatter's Mad Tea Party (clone #2)

*Mickey and the Beanstalk - dark ride using Mr. Toad technology

*Kiki's Delivery Service - dark ride using Peter Pan technology

*The Hunchback of Notre Dame - dark ride using Snow White technology

restaurants could include Tiana and Naveen's, a spin-off restaurant from the Princess and the Frog created for Naveen's homeland as well as The Mad Hatter's Unbirthday Eatery.

*~The Forbidden Mountain - shadowing over the land is the Forbidden Mountain, a range of mountains that are perpetually under clouds and thunder. The attractions here include:

*Dragon's Peak - The tallest mountain in the range, is actually a dormant Volcano, but why does it have fire coming out? Because therein lies a nest of dragons and it is up to you fly in using Merlin's magic to save the trapped Princess.

*The Nightinggale's Labyrinth - You must search this elaborate crystal and topiary maze to look for the legendary Nighttinggale and have it sing you a song. But be careful not to get lost or you will end up in Maleficent's dungeon.

restaruants in this area could include Phil's Place. Philoctetes' bar where he gushes about the Heroes he has trained.

*~Fantasy Fair - the circus has rolled into town and they have set up shop in the western part of Fantasyland!

*Dumbo the Flying Elephant - clone #3 (duelling edition)

*Voyage of the Little Mermaid - the unbuilt french version.

*Magic Lamp Theater - clone #4

*Sebastian's Under the Sea Swings

*Pirates of the Carribean - an enhanced version of the original that follows the storyline of the movies. Filled with elaborate new sets and special effects.

*Shipwreck Fleet - a play area themed to a series of docked old ships.

*It's A Small World - the reimagineered version where we are suspended in flying machines rather than boats.

*Circus of Fantastical Things - the main attraction of this part of the land where it will feature magic tricks and great special effects including the substitutiary locomotion spell from Bedknobs and Broomsticks and Elliot from Pete's Dragon.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

I think it's possible, we could just have the entrance of the ride inside the castle and then queue the guests to the west or east wing.

Yes but where do we place the ride itself? The loading area, the track and the rooms where it runs through? Major rides at least need an awful lot of space, take a look at the ride buildings of PotC and HM.

 

[stitchcastle]

Yes but where do we place the ride itself? The loading area, the track and the rooms where it runs through? Major rides at least need an awful lot of space, take a look at the ride buildings of PotC and HM.

we could make it two stories where a majority of the ride track is underground, leaving more store space on top.

 

[FigmentJedi]

Not really sure about how to go about it ride-system wise, but I would like to pitch a thrill/scare based Wonderland darkride, Wrath of the Jabberwock. Basically puts you through an adventure through the Tulgey Wood based on the poem and going for a mixture of the classic film and the Tim Burton styles for the three main beasts of the Bandersnatch, Jub Jub bird and the Jabberwock, all narrated by the Cheshire Cat in keeping with his Twas Brillig song from the old movie.