MK Stitch's Great Escape Replacement— Don’t Hold Your Breath

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Original: Present or existing from the beginning.

Neither Space Mountain nor Matterhorn are original attractions. They are classic attractions (subjective) but not original. This isn't semantics, now if you'll excuse me I need to get back to my hair-brained ideas.

Indeed. People really mean "unique" or "particular" or "iconic" when they misuse "original." Original meaning 'first' or 'from the start' is used in "Original Sin" and "to originate". The phrase "it's an original" should only be used for the thing that started it all, not for something unique.

And....... it's "hare-brained." As in "mad as a march hare" to bring it around to an appropriated Disney property. :p
 

5thGenTexan

Well-Known Member
If only they could do a real track upgrade to both SM and Matterhorn like this. The additions to Matterhorn the last couple years have been great (inside the ride), but man, those sleds and track still feel like you're tailbone is getting jackhammered. I'd say the new cars add about 20% more comfort than the old ones, but they still suck.

Does it matter which side (Matterhorn)? I rode the left side and I didn't feel like it really hurt that much.
 

DznyRktekt

Well-Known Member
Original: Present or existing from the beginning.

Neither Space Mountain nor Matterhorn are original attractions. They are classic attractions (subjective) but not original. This isn't semantics, now if you'll excuse me I need to get back to my hare-brained ideas.

Part of the definition, yes. Of course we all know it was the first and earliest of the Space Mountains, also an original design by WED. Potato-potato.

o·rig·i·nal
əˈrijənl/
adjective
  1. present or existing from the beginning; first or earliest.
 

rle4lunch

Well-Known Member
Does it matter which side (Matterhorn)? I rode the left side and I didn't feel like it really hurt that much.

Actually, yes. One track is faster and bumpier than the other. Both are still way too rough though. During the beginning and end it feels like your running over potholes while sitting on a skateboard.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
No, but it's part of it. It's also far clearer than anything currently being done. The futuristic view from Disney's intellectual properties is just as cohesive as Fantasyland. Similarly a "celebration of discovery and exploration" is more in line with what I think Future World (or as I want to call it, Discovery Expo) should be.

Tomorrowland and Future World in the same resort has been a problem for a while, and one I've been complaining about for close to a decade. Both areas are in need of change, so now is as good a time as any to make a distinction and give a direction to both areas. I've offered my opinion and very few other people have offered their's. By no means am I so jaded to think that my suggestion is the only way to solve the problem, but people (not necessarily you) aren't even willing to accept that there is a problem. That's the greater issue here. There's a problem with these two lands and they both need to be fixed.
There is no part of a distinction based on intellectual property that is related to story content, just when the story was created. When a story was initially created and for what medium has nothing to do with the experience. It is an external metric. Tomorrowland and Future World were given a story-driven distinctiveness and that it has been ignored is not a failing of the distinction, it is instead the same lack of respect for themed entertainment as a medium that has seen theme and story ignored across the board.

Does that mean Mission: SPACE is better suited for Tomorrowland? Not arguing, just asking.
Mission: SPACE is rather closely related to Mission to Mars. Should it not then be in Tomorrowland based on your criteria? While it is a fictional story, it is not really the sort of more fantastic story that is labeled "sic-fi."
 

999th Happy Haunt

Well-Known Member
Mission: SPACE is rather closely related to Mission to Mars. Should it not then be in Tomorrowland based on your criteria? While it is a fictional story, it is not really the sort of more fantastic story that is labeled "sic-fi."

Mission to Mars wouldn't fit in Tomorrowland TODAY as a sci-fi story. When it was made it wasn't really made to be a look into the future, more of a fantasy adventure set far into the future. Today the attraction would be closer to a reality that a fantasy, as we are coming very close to actually arriving on Mars, so it would probably fit best in Epcot as a possible real look into the future.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Mission to Mars wouldn't fit in Tomorrowland TODAY as a sci-fi story. When it was made it wasn't really made to be a look into the future, more of a fantasy adventure set far into the future. Today the attraction would be closer to a reality that a fantasy, as we are coming very close to actually arriving on Mars, so it would probably fit best in Epcot as a possible real look into the future.
How was/is Mission: SPACE a fantasy adventure? It is about space flight training. The hyper sleep conceit is the only way out there idea.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Yes... to a Swiss pavilion in Epcot.
Yeah, well, technically that would be some kind of improved clone. Not removing it from Disneyland.
Space Mountain as it stands today is a worse ride than when it got a subpar refurbishment 7-8 years ago. I enjoy the ride, but that enjoyment is hampered because it's the worst version of what it could be.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, Space Mountain and Peter Pan's Flight are far and away the most overrated attractions in Walt Disney World. My argument above relocating Space Mountain is fueled largely be the simple understanding that the entire ride needs to be torn down and replaced with a new version. While that can happen in Tomorrowland, I've also called for a distinction between the two lands (Tomorrowland and Future World). My distinction (and my distinction only) would have Space Mountain be more appropriately placed in Epcot. If Disney creates a different way to properly differentiate between Tomorrowland and Future World and Space Mountain fits in Tomorrowland I would still want it to be rebuilt from the ground up.
I think only the track needs replacement, not the whole building.
Indeed. People really mean "unique" or "particular" or "iconic" when they misuse "original." Original meaning 'first' or 'from the start' is used in "Original Sin" and "to originate". The phrase "it's an original" should only be used for the thing that started it all, not for something unique.

And....... it's "hare-brained." As in "mad as a march hare" to bring it around to an appropriated Disney property. :p
And Magic Kingdom's Space Mountain is the original that came before all the others around the world.
Does that mean Mission: SPACE is better suited for Tomorrowland? Not arguing, just asking.
Let's put it this way. Tomorrowland is a whimsical look at the future and Future World should be a serious one. Space Mountain is far from a serious look at future space travel. The current space pavilion should be replaced by one based on Cosmos.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
Yeah, well, technically that would be some kind of improved clone. Not removing it from Disneyland.

I think only the track needs replacement, not the whole building.

And Magic Kingdom's Space Mountain is the original that came before all the others around the world.

Let's put it this way. Tomorrowland is a whimsical look at the future and Future World should be a serious one. Space Mountain is far from a serious look at future space travel. The current space pavilion should be replaced by one based on Cosmos.
Serious vs Whimsical is enough of a distinction. However, I'd say that Jim Hill's rumors of Dreamfinder and Figment being relocated to Tomorrowland as walk around characters would also better fit this whimsical vs serious approach. Would you be ok with those two moving to Magic Kingdom?
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Serious vs Whimsical is enough of a distinction. However, I'd say that Jim Hill's rumors of Dreamfinder and Figment being relocated to Tomorrowland as walk around characters would also better fit this whimsical vs serious approach. Would you be ok with those two moving to Magic Kingdom?
No because that's the one area of Future World that actually should be a bit whimsical. You can't have progress with no imagination.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
No because that's the one area of Future World that actually should be a bit whimsical. You can't have progress with no imagination.
Here's the thing, people want both Epcot and Tomorrowland to evolve but not too much. I want clear distinctions made between the two and for me a focus on Discovery is a true evolution that I can get behind.
 

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