Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Ep 8). SPOILERS. Plot points revealed and discussed.

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I could have sworn her original contact was through 2019. I guess it makes more sense then. If all the focus is going to ep9, you aren't going to replace her with a year to go on your biggest film. And no one is taking a one year contract extension, so this was probably they best option.

“Best option” is highly debatable.

Hollywood can’t be completely beholden to Fan bases or PORTIONS of Fan bases...
But Star Wars is mostly about selling product...that’s what has made it such a freight train.

But man...If product is down - which has been reported since last year - that’s something that has to be tied off immediately.

So in addition to that post about blu ray sales dropping off a cliff (almost as ridiculous as solo being a flop...in my opinion)...there seems to be more bleed we don’t fully know about.

Gary Kurtz just died...the guy responsible for that “too adult” feel of empire that Lucas complained about...but actually secured the entire legacy...

Kennedy seems pulled in too many directions and her “loyalty” to whoever is calling the shots (presumably iger and chapek and the directors WAY too much) is putting her more in the Rick mccallum basket than Kurtz or Alan Ladd.

 

[tk924]

must be the Russians.



The Last Jedi Blu Ray Sales Drop to 56% of Force Awakens

Further evidence that The Last Jedi sadly did turn off about half the audience, the-numbers.com is now reporting the launch week sales of The Last Jedi and... it's not good. Whereas The Force Awakens sold 3,420,540 units in its first week of release, The Last Jedi only sold 1,940,241 units. In raw monetary terms, the Last Jedi brought in over $40,000,000 less revenue in its first week of Blu Ray sales. Given its divisive nature, it is likely that after collectors' purchases the sales dropped rapidly in comparison to other Star Wars movies. Those numbers will be released next Wednesday.
Blu Ray sales are one of the very best ways of gauging an audience's reaction to a movie as purchasing a movie after seeing it in a theater is a vote from the consumer's wallet for the quality of the film. Although some are pointing to Solo's plummeting box office returns as a shock, Disney knew privately they were in trouble with the Star Wars brand as they've been holding onto The Last Jedi's Blu Ray sales outside of public view for the past few months. When a sequel gathers only 56% of its predecessor's Blu Ray sales, it indicates a massive swing in public opinion. As an example, the first Captain America movie released on BluRay to a sales amount of $20,313,189, while the sequel released to sales amount of $22,358,092. This indicates growth from one entry in the franchise to the next. Dropping the amount of Last Jedi from Force Awakens in the launch week tally is a gigantic number, and further evidence that Disney is hemorrhaging Star Wars consumers post-TLJ.
Links for reference:
The Last Jedi sales numbers: https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Star-Wars-Ep-VIII-The-Last-Jedi#tab=video-sales
The Force Awakens sales numbers: https://www.the-numbers.com/movie/Star-Wars-Ep-VII-The-Force-Awakens#tab=video-sales
This post is not intended to make a statement as to the quality of either film or as to the direction of story content for the franchise. This post is simply a report on Blu Ray sales.

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Yes, and not only Blu Ray sales are down but toy sales are down too. Which is also another big fan indicator. They can't give TFA and TLJ toys away. A lot of this stuff is showing up discounted at Five Below and Ollie's. Maybe the Dollar Store/Tree will be next.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Yes, and not only Blu Ray sales are down but toy sales are down too. Which is also another big fan indicator. They can't give TFA and TLJ toys away. A lot of this stuff is showing up discounted at Five Below and Ollie's. Maybe the Dollar Store/Tree will be next.

I won’t completely blame decline in merch sales on decline in quality/appeal...consumer habits are shifting...

But I will put a lot of it on it. Good still sells and rehashed/disjointed doesn’t.

Ironic on a day where it looks like toys r us is coming back.

Look for all those “General leia” RC flying action figures to be in the bin in the back

 

[erasure fan1]

Best option” is highly debatable.

It's not the best option, but in Disneys eyes it is. Like I said earlier, if the rumors were true, they couldn't get a better replacement. A 3yr extension isn't a super vote of confidence. So I think Disney is going to let ep9 play out and than depending on that outcome, decide the future.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It's not the best option, but in Disneys eyes it is. Like I said earlier, if the rumors were true, they couldn't get a better replacement. A 3yr extension isn't a super vote of confidence. So I think Disney is going to let ep9 play out and than depending on that outcome, decide the future.

Granted.

The raging internet theory was she was bagged in May and they were waiting for fiscal year end 9/30.

I never believed that...I do think rian Johnson is done and that’s part of her deal...

But just to muse...

She was on ice. Disappeared from everything for 4 months. That’s not done “unintentionally” in Hollywood. You sell product by being seen.

Rumors of not being able to find a replacement...abrams supposedly said “no” (thank god...if true).
That could be...

No real new development. When is Hollywood shy about making sequels? When do they go holding pattern by Choice. It’s unheard of now.


I don’t know...a big part thinks she was fired and they switched course - for now. What you’re saying could go right to that.

 

[erasure fan1]

I do think rian Johnson is done and that’s part of her deal..

I very much agree. It's not an accident that when the ceo talks about star wars, he talks about the B&W series of movies but makes no mention of the Rian Johnson trilogy? I don't buy it. You only announced 2 series of movies. So in my eyes when you are talking about slowing things down, and you only mention 1 of the 2 movies that have been announced, you can stick a fork in the other.

 

[tk924]

...I do think rian Johnson is done

I certainly hope so. Fingers crossed.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I certainly hope so. Fingers crossed.

That’s just half the problem...

Gotta have somebody else that can push through a decent story. There seems to be “systemic” problems at LFL with that...

I’m interested to see Weiss/Benioff...but I have doubts they ever actually get a story to screen...

I think they go treverrow once they see the difficulties

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

That’s just half the problem...

Gotta have somebody else that can push through a decent story. There seems to be “systemic” problems at LFL with that...

I’m interested to see Weiss/Benioff...but I have doubts they ever actually get a story to screen...

I think they go treverrow once they see the difficulties

Weiss/Benioff: Game of Thrones is fantastic but the show was less well received once they didn't have George R.R. Martin's books and had to write their own material. Could be good, but uncertain.

Colin Treverrow? No, just no. His Jurassic World movies are stunningly bad. Why he was hired to write and direct a Star Wars movie to begin with is beyond me. Thank goodness they dumped him early, and weren't faced with a Solo-type scenario during shooting.

Rian Johnson trilogy: I'm fine if they go ahead with this, I liked TLJ for the most part. Some of the things TLJ was criticized for were actually due to J.J. Abrams. Luke being a recluse, the mystery of Rey's parents not having a satisfying resolution, were elements he inherited.

 

[erasure fan1]

Colin Treverrow? No, just no. His Jurassic World movies are stunningly bad.

He means that they fire them like they fired Treverrow. Not that they bring Treverrow back.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

He means that they fire them like they fired Treverrow. Not that they bring Treverrow back.

Gotcha, read that wrong.

I'm glad they're firing people who aren't a good fit, but how did it take so long to realize Solo was off course? Why was hiring Treverrow even a consideration?

 

[erasure fan1]

Gotcha, read that wrong.

I'm glad they're firing people who aren't a good fit, but how did it take so long to realize Solo was off course? Why was hiring Treverrow even a consideration?

It goes back to the lack of a solid plan for the series. It's a lack of vision. They hired directors and told them to make their movie. Instead of having a plan, then hiring the right people that fit that plan. All of a sudden you have a problem and have to hit the panic button.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

It goes back to the lack of a solid plan for the series. It's a lack of vision. They hired directors and told them to make their movie. Instead of having a plan, then hiring the right people that fit that plan. All of a sudden you have a problem and have to hit the panic button.

And how is that humanly possible? After the prequels.

Where are the box office defenders on this? I’m all ears

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Gotcha, read that wrong.

I'm glad they're firing people who aren't a good fit, but how did it take so long to realize Solo was off course? Why was hiring Treverrow even a consideration?

Have you seen it??

It’s honestly - objectively - the second best disney movie.

It had Star Wars “moments”...that’s what define them. The whole movies arent citizen kane or Shawshank...but the moments made them endearing on another level.

And it’s telling that Ronnie Howard managed to rescue a few...as opposed to the 40 somethings that it should be easy for but can’t seem to get it.

Honestly - it seems to be tied to which directors are true fans of the STORY...not the money or the prestige.

I submit two have been and two really aren’t.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

It goes back to the lack of a solid plan for the series. It's a lack of vision. They hired directors and told them to make their movie. Instead of having a plan, then hiring the right people that fit that plan. All of a sudden you have a problem and have to hit the panic button.

On the one hand, I agree they should have had a solid plan for the new trilogy from start to finish. On the other hand, Lucas himself seemed to make it up as he went along. Return of the Jedi ended up offering very little new story-wise to add to the saga.

I also think they did have at least a bit of an idea how the trilogy would play out, as we know the focus of Episode 9 was going to be on Leia and Kylo Ren.

Star Wars is generally not the place to allow director's to deliver a unique personal vision. Maybe a standalone film could be a bit different, but you generally want a director who will execute the plan, keep things on schedule & budget, etc. That's why they hired Richard Marquand for RotJ, someone who would put Lucas's ideas on screen, not develop his "own" movie.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Have you seen it??

It’s honestly - objectively - the second best disney movie.

It had Star Wars “moments”...that’s what define them. The whole movies arent citizen kane or Shawshank...but the moments made them endearing on another level.

And it’s telling that Ronnie Howard managed to rescue a few...as opposed to the 40 somethings that it should be easy for but can’t seem to get it.

Honestly - it seems to be tied to which directors are true fans of the STORY...not the money or the prestige.

I submit two have been and two really aren’t.

Solo? It was good. Fun, but a bit forgettable. It kind of did everything right (story, dialogue, action, etc.) but didn't quite manage to combine everything into a movie that is as memorable or well liked as the original.

Moments are definitely key for Star Wars, and a lot of movies for that matter. The Force Awakens had it's pros and cons for example, but when everyone is walking out of the theater quoting "That's not how the force works!", you sort of know it connected with audiences on some level.

On a side note, no one in these movies has the charisma and screen presence Harrison Ford does, and while his death made sense story-wise I do think they made an error not having him in all three movies.

The Honest Trailer for Solo really nailed a lot of things about it (link below):

-Han Solo is the least interesting character in the Han Solo movie.

-New and interesting characters are killed off almost immediately.

-Doesn't stick with one the way most Star Wars movies do. Not a lot of passion for this film one way or the other.

-By the numbers as they check off obligatory Han Solo origin elements from a list, including silly ones like where he got his name.

Honest Trailer: Solo

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

On the one hand, I agree they should have had a solid plan for the new trilogy from start to finish. On the other hand, Lucas himself seemed to make it up as he went along. Return of the Jedi ended up offering very little new story-wise to add to the saga.

I also think they did have at least a bit of an idea how the trilogy would play out, as we know the focus of Episode 9 was going to be on Leia and Kylo Ren.

Star Wars is generally not the place to allow director's to deliver a unique personal vision. Maybe a standalone film could be a bit different, but you generally want a director who will execute the plan, keep things on schedule & budget, etc. That's why they hired Richard Marquand for RotJ, someone who would put Lucas's ideas on screen, not develop his "own" movie.

They actually hired Marquand because he wasn’t in the directors guild...the truth was he messed with Lucas a lot more than was believed...that’s probably why some of the “realism” of jedi was more advanced...it’s still the most authentic feeling Star Wars to this date...the new ones are close.

But if I interpret your post:

So the general sketch of the trilogy was pulled off better in the 80’s than now...that’s bad.

9 is DOA due to “unfortunate events” and an awful lack of judgement by abrams/Kennedy

...I feel so much better

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

But if I interpret your post:

So the general sketch of the trilogy was pulled off better in the 80’s than now...that’s bad.

9 is DOA due to “unfortunate events” and an awful lack of judgement by abrams/Kennedy

...I feel so much better

I don't think they had a general sketch of the original trilogy at the time. If you read J.W. Rinzler's book on the making of Jedi, for example, it describes how the script went through many changes. There didn't seem to any plan in place from the start. His books are great, by the way.

I don't think it means anything for Episode 9 one war or the other. I don't think many movies are written with a specific outline for multiple parts established in stone.

Optimistically, I think Episode 9 has a lot more story to tell whereas Jedi just kind of wrapped things up with action. Episode 8 set up some plot points like the need to rebuild the resistance and Rey's potentially using of the Jedi texts to train another generation of force users. It should do more than just give us another Death Star battle.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I don't think they had a general sketch of the original trilogy at the time. If you read J.W. Rinzler's book on the making of Jedi, for example, it describes how the script went through many changes. There didn't seem to any plan in place from the start. His books are great, by the way.

I don't think it means anything for Episode 9 one war or the other. I don't think many movies are written with a specific outline for multiple parts established in stone.

Optimistically, I think Episode 9 has a lot more story to tell whereas Jedi just kind of wrapped things up with action. Episode 8 set up some plot points like the need to rebuild the resistance and Rey's potentially using of the Jedi texts to train another generation of force users. It should do more than just give us another Death Star battle.

It’s ironic we are talking about this after Kurtz...who was the prime antagonist in the story you were referring too...I’ve also read the book. Of course.

Lucas changed the tone for commercial purposes - That’s no secret. But jedi was decent enough that it didn’t matter.

“Dead Han Solo won’t sell any toys”


As far as abrams/Kennedy...it’s pretty obvious they were told to eliminate the old characters...and did so ill advised and ham handily.

First...you rejoin them. Obvious 101...
Second, you have skywalker go down protecting the others...maybe both the boys?

This isn’t hard.

Betting on fisher was bad. I’m sorry...she couldn’t pull it off before her demise...and now look where you’re at? Check the toxicology report. I’m serious.

Unused footage from 5 years ago after a movie in between that made no sense? “Everybody has the force”??

What a wreck...but hey...haven’t really thought about it much

 

[Phroobar]

Yes, and not only Blu Ray sales are down but toy sales are down too. Which is also another big fan indicator. They can't give TFA and TLJ toys away. A lot of this stuff is showing up discounted at Five Below and Ollie's. Maybe the Dollar Store/Tree will be next.

No. Bad distribution practices is the blame here. Stores have empty pegs and never refresh with new waves. It's been that way for years.