News Star Wars: Galaxy's Edge - Historical Construction/Impressions

[SWGalaxysEdge]

Well, sounds like someone is way off...either your contact or the MC story. The numbers above seem very high IMO.

..my source is an imagineer working on RotR and they calculated it based on... "Capacity for AL will be around 4000 per hour. Bird will be around 3200 per hour, these times are based on the actual “ride time” that’s from the moment you actually get in the seats."

 

[MisterPenguin]

Capacity for AL will be around 4000 per hour. Bird will be around 3200 per hour, these times are based on the actual “ride time” that’s from the moment you actually get in the seats. Most rides average 3-5 minutes except for small world 15 to 20 long and boring minutes.

Capacity is measured in throughput, not ride length. You count how many people load or unload in an hour.

Ride length is not a meaningful number unless you know how often and how many ride vehicles launch.

To use an extreme example to make that point: A ride length of 10 seconds may make one think that a ride has an awesome capacity because it's so short, but not if the vehicle holds one person and only launches once per minute. That's a 60 pph capacity.

 

[SuddenStorm]

..my source is an imagineer working on RotR and they calculated it based on... "Capacity for AL will be around 4000 per hour. Bird will be around 3200 per hour, these times are based on the actual “ride time” that’s from the moment you actually get in the seats."

Those numbers are just so darn high, I'm struggling to figure out how RotR could possibly be above 2000 an hour. Let alone 4000.

 

[mickEblu]

So is the hangar scene really only a pre show scene we walk by or through? Wouldn’t that be a huge waste of capacity?

 

[MisterPenguin]

..my source is an imagineer working on RotR and they calculated it based on... "Capacity for AL will be around 4000 per hour. Bird will be around 3200 per hour, these times are based on the actual “ride time” that’s from the moment you actually get in the seats."

Let's go about this another way:

We know that RotR ride vehicles hold 8 people.

So, assuming every vehicle is full, in order to get a 4000 pph throughput capacity a RotR vehicle has to launch 500 times an hour.

That's 8.3 RVs per minute.

That's a RV launching every 7.2 seconds.

 

[britain]

That's 8.3 RVs per minute.

Clearly they're way off, but what if it works Rat-style, so 4 vehicles load up with 8 passengers each. Maybe not 8 RVs per minute, but 4 RVs every minute maybe?

So around half - which is closer to the 1800 pph insiders here have been saying for awhile.

 

[flynnibus]

Clearly they're way off, but what if it works Rat-style, so 4 vehicles load up with 8 passengers each. Maybe not 8 RVs per minute, but 4 RVs every minute maybe?

So around half - which is closer to the 1800 pph insiders here have been saying for awhile.

The dependency is still the same no matter how many load together... the only thing that changes it would be is if multiple vehicles travel together as a pack and hence dispatch together.

Otherwise simultaneous loading is used to allow for more time in the station without stressing the dispatch interval.

Dispatch is bound by two things... 'space' to take the vehicle in to the ride... this defines your minimum... and having a vehicle ready.. which dictates what your load design is like. Your 'maximum' is defined in part by how much hold capacity your load/unload has and your zones on the ride path to allow 'absorbing' backups.

Space Mountain is the quickest dispatching attraction I can think of at the parks.. and it has a 20 second dispatch interval. That really takes the cast pushing the guests hard and constantly to do that. More load, settle, and check stations give guests more time.. but most people should notice how terse and direct the Space Mountain CMs are... and it's all about ensuring on-time dispatches.

Something like Indy/Dinosaur is probably more akin to what Alcatraz will be like.. as it has simultaneous load stations and about the same passenger counts and concepts. I've seen sources quote 18 seconds for Indy dispatch.. but I'm not sure how accurate that is.

 

[chadwpalm]

Things to consider:

Attractions like Pirates, HM, Splash have show scenes that run on loops. IJA, RSR, the FL dark rides have shows that run on timing. Currently, we don't know how RotR will be and how much of the experience depends on timed show scenes. Shanghai Pirates uses timing because of the screens. This causes the ride vehicles to have to be spaced apart at a minimum distance. How many RotR vehicles they can run depends on that. I'm sure that's something they are continually tweaking. Like Mystic Manor, it may be possible for them to have multiple vehicles in one scene. Again, we don't know.

Also, building footprint size doesn't always equate to ride length proportionally. The northern side of the Pirates building has multiple levels, and the Splash showroom is two levels as well. The FL dark rides are a small footprint, but they twist and turn in corridors which allow there to be more track length. It all depends on how well the current Imagineers designed the space. We have the hanger and AT-AT rooms which are large, but the rest could be a lot winding corridors. Again, we don't know.

We can estimate Falcon because we know roughly how many pods and how many riders in each pod. Capacity will depend on how quickly they can load/unload and how long the ride experience is. Most estimates hit between 1800-2000. For a non-omnimover it's not terrible, but not awesome either. Still more than Star Tours or Splash. I can see RotR being between 2500-3000 if done right, but probably will be closer to 2000-2500. RSR is about 1500 an hour, right? I think it will be a bit better than that.

If you gauge this against Mystic Manor, which is also a trackless system, based on YouTube videos, it looks like the load time (vehicle start to vehicle start) is around 45-50 seconds. It loads 4 vehicles at a time and each holds 6 persons. That makes it about 1700-2000 an hour capacity. RotR holds 8 people. Assuming the same 50 second load time and 4 vehicles loaded at the same time (this is the unknown variable), that puts it at about 2300 an hour. 4 vehicles loaded at a time every 50 seconds allows there to be a 10-12 second spacing between each vehicle, which is plenty of time to reset timed elements in the show.

 

[britain]

The dependency is still the same no matter how many load together... the only thing that changes it would be is if multiple vehicles travel together as a pack and hence dispatch together.

Right, yes, Rat sends off 4 vehicles "sideways" away from the loading platform simultaneously.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Capacity will depend on how quickly they can load/unload and how long the ride experience is.

Ride length doesn't matter. If you launch 1,000 people every hour for a one minute ride or 1,000 people every hour for a 5 minute ride, the throughput capacity is exactly the same -- 1,000 pph.

The only difference is that one has five times as many people currently experiencing the ride.

 

[Disney Irish]

Those numbers are just so darn high, I'm struggling to figure out how RotR could possibly be above 2000 an hour. Let alone 4000.

 

[Curious Constance]

They're the same ride, how could they design one to have over double the capacity of the other?

Sorry

 

[Disney Analyst]

Things to consider:

Attractions like Pirates, HM, Splash have show scenes that run on loops. IJA, RSR, the FL dark rides have shows that run on timing. Currently, we don't know how RotR will be and how much of the experience depends on timed show scenes. Shanghai Pirates uses timing because of the screens. This causes the ride vehicles to have to be spaced apart at a minimum distance. How many RotR vehicles they can run depends on that. I'm sure that's something they are continually tweaking. Like Mystic Manor, it may be possible for them to have multiple vehicles in one scene. Again, we don't know.

Also, building footprint size doesn't always equate to ride length proportionally. The northern side of the Pirates building has multiple levels, and the Splash showroom is two levels as well. The FL dark rides are a small footprint, but they twist and turn in corridors which allow there to be more track length. It all depends on how well the current Imagineers designed the space. We have the hanger and AT-AT rooms which are large, but the rest could be a lot winding corridors. Again, we don't know.

We can estimate Falcon because we know roughly how many pods and how many riders in each pod. Capacity will depend on how quickly they can load/unload and how long the ride experience is. Most estimates hit between 1800-2000. For a non-omnimover it's not terrible, but not awesome either. Still more than Star Tours or Splash. I can see RotR being between 2500-3000 if done right, but probably will be closer to 2000-2500. RSR is about 1500 an hour, right? I think it will be a bit better than that.

If you gauge this against Mystic Manor, which is also a trackless system, based on YouTube videos, it looks like the load time (vehicle start to vehicle start) is around 45-50 seconds. It loads 4 vehicles at a time and each holds 6 persons. That makes it about 1700-2000 an hour capacity. RotR holds 8 people. Assuming the same 50 second load time and 4 vehicles loaded at the same time (this is the unknown variable), that puts it at about 2300 an hour. 4 vehicles loaded at a time every 50 seconds allows there to be a 10-12 second spacing between each vehicle, which is plenty of time to reset timed elements in the show.

So we need an insider to tell us how loading works for this ride. @marni1971 ??

 

[TP2000]

I don't exactly think ride shut downs in January for a June opening qualify as scandalous... yet.

Usually we are still at the 'nothing will be finished in time for opening' phase this far out, so call me optimistic.

Exactly. You and I have seen a lot of these things, and that's exactly where we generally are this far out. Nothing looks ready, and CM's panic, and bloggers blare alarm about "They'll never make it!". Heck, just look at the current state of the new parking structure on this rainy Monday, and you'll think "That will never be ready by June!". But they'll make it, they always do.

Let's go about this another way:

We know that RotR ride vehicles hold 8 people.

So, assuming every vehicle is full, in order to get a 4000 pph throughput capacity a RotR vehicle has to launch 500 times an hour.

That's 8.3 RVs per minute.

That's a RV launching every 7.2 seconds.

Thank you for that.

Let's just round up to an RV (ride vehicle) launching every 8 seconds, because that matches with 8 riders in each vehicle. And it's still impossible at every 8 seconds, let alone 7 seconds.

An RV launching every 8 seconds means they'd need to get a rider sitting down every single second, with CM's doing the obligatory seatbelt checks (pull on the yellow tab!) once per second, for 4,000 people per hour. Assuming you'd need a minute or so for each 8 person RV to load and be checked... You would have to have an army of CM's just for that function, and a huge series of identical loading areas all loading, seating, prepping, checking and launching to get an RV out onto the track every 8 seconds.

The ride warehouse for RotR is big, but it's not that big. And @marni1971 has already told us that a third of that building is needed for maintenance and support, with the actual ride track taking up the other two thirds.

 

[SWGalaxysEdge]

So we need an insider to tell us how loading works for this ride. @marni1971 ??

..I'll ask my guy too..and find out how it can be 4000/hour...

 

[MisterPenguin]

An RV launching every 8 seconds means they'd need to get a rider sitting down every single second, with CM's doing the obligatory seatbelt checks (pull on the yellow tab!) once per second, for 4,000 people per hour. Assuming you'd need a minute or so for each 8 person RV to load and be checked... You would have to have an army of CM's just for that function, and a huge series of identical loading areas all loading, seating, prepping, checking and launching to get an RV out onto the track every 8 seconds.

Well, you *can* do that if you have multiple load stations and they're coordinated to take turns leaving/launching. A large mulit-loading station could have dozens of RVs filled with people waiting in a RV queue to cast off. The question is whether the ride can handle the RVs stacked on top of each other.

 

[Stevek]

..my source is an imagineer working on RotR and they calculated it based on... "Capacity for AL will be around 4000 per hour. Bird will be around 3200 per hour, these times are based on the actual “ride time” that’s from the moment you actually get in the seats."

Which means the ride times have to be much shorter than anyone has anticipated so far.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Which means the ride times have to be much shorter than anyone has anticipated so far.

Ride times don't affect throughput capacity.

A ride that launches 1,000 an hour for a one minute ride and another one that launches 1,000 an hour for a one hour ride, have the same throughput capacity.

 

[TP2000]

Well, you *can* do that if you have multiple load stations and they're coordinated to take turn leaving/launching. A large mulit-loading station could have dozens of RVs filled with people waiting in a RV queue to cast off.

Yes, it's entirely possible. But you'd need space for dozens of waiting vehicles, dozens of loading vehicles, and an army of CM's to manage it all and check one seatbelt per second. Which is why the seatbelt per second thing is so important, and why 8 seats and an 8 second launch interval is so convenient for this mind game.

Take Guardians of Galaxy for instance with a 21 person vehicle, that has 6 different loading areas on two different levels for 3 different shafts.

And that ride has a widely reported hourly ridership of 1500 for the California, Paris and Tokyo versions. 500 riders per shaft per hour, and on ride videos with the timing of each 21 person vehicle support that 1500 number.

For an 8 person RotR ride vehicle that has almost one third the capacity of a Guardians elevator, you'd need triple the loading areas that Guardians has for its six elevators. I'm just not able to see how the 4,000 per hour number is possible.

 

[Stevek]

Ride times don't affect throughput capacity.

A ride that launches 1,000 an hour for a one minute ride and another one that launches 1,000 an hour for a one hour ride, have the same throughput capacity.

Define what you mean by throughput capacity. I think everyone is assuming the number of guests that can ride per hour will be determined by number of vehicles, loading time and ride time. That's clearly not what you seem to be talking about.