Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker Reactions: SPOILERS

[Sirwalterraleigh]

The reboot know as”episode 7” did not make its BO on merit...

It made it Because it was Star Wars...they thought Disney would make it huge...it was a protest of the cgi prequels...

And it just happened to be the cool thing to do.

Look at the box office of phantom menace...most of those people wanted their money back...but it drew them in nonetheless

 

[Mike S]

It may have been advertised as the end of the Skywalker Saga, but it was really a conclusion to the new trilogy. In many ways, it was merely part 2 of the JJ Abrams SW saga. A tagline in the trailer isn't enough to turn RoS into an Endgame level event.

Maybe it would feel more like a conclusion to the saga if the Emperor had been more present from the beginning, and if it came down to Luke as the main protagonist in the end. That's still a maybe. I don't buy that it would have been "easy" for anyone to have made this new trilogy more popular. There are things I have criticized, but it's awfully easy to do so in hindsight and from behind a keyboard. TFA seemed to do what you claim everyone wanted, and it was popular, but there were still many many people who hated how much it leaned into the past films.

On a side note, I've always felt the idea of MCU being a bit intertwined story to be overstated. Infinity War was fun because it brought together a bunch of great characters and actors with fun chemistry, but as a conclusion to an overall story? I never found the movies to be that connected, other than the infinity stones being mentioned on occasion. Many of the interconnecting story elements were relegated to brief scenes during the end credits. In Infinity War, didn't Tony Stark ask "who's Thanos?". That's not a sign of a story that has been building to a showdown with a major villain.

TFA didn’t really do that though. It remade ANH. A new story with the old characters that paid them proper respect ≠ has to be a retread of old plot points.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

They were both the ending movies of major events. Endgame shouldn't compare to TFA, it should be more like ROS. Infinity Wars should be closer to TFA. End Game was the conclusion to that Saga.

But you mention doing better than the average MCU movie. It's disingenuous to an extent. Star Wars wasn't starting from scratch. As you stated, TFA did $2 billion. It was an event BECAUSE it was so well known. The MCU had to build itself up (and FYI, do it by having a ton more movies than 5 in 5 years, which again, disingenuous when discussing the final movie that was nearly 2 years after the last release). In that same time frame between Star Wars movies, you have Black Panther, Captain Marvel, Spiderman, and Ant Man and the Wasp. 3 of those 4 movies blow the conclusion of the Skywalker Saga away in Box Office. And those are not full Avenger Movies. 7 movies between 2 Star Wars Movies, and 6 of them did bigger numbers than ROS. Now, maybe they never would have had a shot at End Game numbers (not sure I agree on that), but there is NO WAY the finale should be the lowest of the 3 and 4th lowest of the 5 total releases.

You actually summed up why people discuss what a failure this was (despite the billion dollar box office). You say it didn't feel like a conclusion of the Skywalker Saga, but a separate trilogy. The point of this trilogy WAS to be the end of Skywalker, and the jumping point into a whole new universe. They really didn't come close to achieving this, and the end result is you now have discussions of new trilogies set hundreds of years apart from anything remotely connected to what everyone knows.

I will forever say fatigue is insanely overrated. Again, you can't claim 5 movies in 5 years and not claim a ton more with the MCU since 2 of those movies had no connection to the trilogy. It was a poorly done trilogy. If you want my opinion, essentially they decided to go full on artsy for 8, and turned off a bunch of fans. They truly believed Star Wars was too big to fail, and that they could alter things to bring in new crowds and the die hards, while maybe mad, had too much love for Star Wars to ever stop watching (I think Iger continued to believe it when he stated that he didn't even need to market Galaxy Edge and thought they could open half a land). They got cold feet with the reception (especially after Solo), and so they tried to do what they thought the non-artsy fans wanted. Again, I think the assumption was the fans are so die hard they will come back after a year and a half and all will be forgiven. My guess is, a miscalculation, and what you now did was that while you still have a lot of fans that have not come back, you have now completely angered the artsy crowd who feel THEY have now been spurned. I have no inside anything, but this is just how I have kind of pieced things together.

Ultimately, I don't think it's particularly productive to compare Star Wars to the MCU so much. The MCU managing to produce 20+ movies with remarkably consistent popularity is it's own thing. It's a very unique achievement, that no one has been able to duplicate. If there was a magic formula to create a similar cinematic universe, everyone would do it. Several have tried, all have failed.

Star Wars is a franchise that has done well with releasing movies every three years. If it's not suited to a Marvel style onslaught of films, that's fine. Marvel also has an advantage of having a wide range of genres. Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, Guardians, are all very different styles of movies. Every Star Wars movie on the other hand, is a sci-fi space epic. Rogue One or Solo didn't feel sufficiently "different" to me from the other films, the way Marvel movies do.

 

[erasure fan1]

On a side note, I've always felt the idea of MCU being a bit intertwined story to be overstated.

It is and it isn't. The genius of what Feige did in the mcu was create a connected storyline that was there if you wanted to follow it. But really not needed to enjoy what was being presented on an individual movie basis. I personally found a lot of connective tissue between the movies. My sisters and mom, not so much. But that's why it works so well.

but there is NO WAY the finale should be the lowest of the 3 and 4th lowest of the 5 total releases.

100% agree. And even though some on these boards won't admit it, I'm sure Disney is of the same mindset as well. At a minimum, I believe Disney expected close to force awakens numbers.

And I will chime in on the fatigue claims as well. It wasn't/isn't fatigue that has hurt star wars. It was sloppy handling of the franchise. Plain and simple. Poor planning, arrogance, bad PR... take your pick and you won't be wrong because the answer is all of the above.

 

[erasure fan1]

Star Wars is a franchise that has done well with releasing movies every three years. If it's not suited to a Marvel style onslaught of films, that's fine. Marvel also has an advantage of having a wide range of genres. Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, Guardians, are all very different styles of movies. Every Star Wars movie on the other hand, is a sci-fi space epic. Rogue One or Solo didn't feel sufficiently "different" to me from the other films, the way Marvel movies do.

To be fair, it's hard to say if it can or can't have a more Marvel type formula yet. Why? Because we haven't seen them try yet. What we've seen so far is putting out star wars every year, just because it's star wars, with no real vision or direction, doesn't work that well. And when the person in charge says things like, we can't do what Marvel is doing because they have years of material to pull from and we don't???? Of course it won't work. If guys like Feige, Favreau and Filoni can't figure it out, I will agree it might not work. But until someone with real knowledge of the franchise gets a crack at it, I still think it can work.

I think the other big issue is star wars needs to be able to have a captain America the first avenger or an antman. If Disney is going to mandate every star wars movie does 1.5 billion, then yea, it will never work. Some movies might just need to be allowed to do Solo type numbers to get the ball rolling.

 

[Joesixtoe]

Ultimately, I don't think it's particularly productive to compare Star Wars to the MCU so much. The MCU managing to produce 20+ movies with remarkably consistent popularity is it's own thing. It's a very unique achievement, that no one has been able to duplicate. If there was a magic formula to create a similar cinematic universe, everyone would do it. Several have tried, all have failed.

Star Wars is a franchise that has done well with releasing movies every three years. If it's not suited to a Marvel style onslaught of films, that's fine. Marvel also has an advantage of having a wide range of genres. Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, Guardians, are all very different styles of movies. Every Star Wars movie on the other hand, is a sci-fi space epic. Rogue One or Solo didn't feel sufficiently "different" to me from the other films, the way Marvel movies do.

Speaking of fatigue--we had 4 hours of stars wars in the form of Mandalorian, it was I believe the #1 show in the U.S and we all can't wait for season 2.. also people even complained of the length of the show, as in we want more star wars.
About the sequels.. remember we had 30 plus years of stories about Luke, Han and Leia out saving the galaxy.. disney decided to dumb them down, so we can like their characters..

 

[RobWDW1971]

You actually summed up why people discuss what a failure this was (despite the billion dollar box office). You say it didn't feel like a conclusion of the Skywalker Saga, but a separate trilogy. The point of this trilogy WAS to be the end of Skywalker, and the jumping point into a whole new universe. They really didn't come close to achieving this, and the end result is you now have discussions of new trilogies set hundreds of years apart from anything remotely connected to what everyone knows.

To me, this is the most damning statement about this trilogy - by marketing it as the end of the saga, even Disney admits there is little interest in Rey as a character or her journey. The movie ends with her being (compared to what we've seen in all the other movies) one of the most powerful Jedis of all time and yet even Disney doesn't care about her future adventures. Nope, Skywalker saga is over, moving on.

 

[Magenta Panther]

Speaking of fatigue--we had 4 hours of stars wars in the form of Mandalorian, it was I believe the #1 show in the U.S and we all can't wait for season 2.. also people even complained of the length of the show, as in we want more star wars.
About the sequels.. remember we had 30 plus years of stories about Luke, Han and Leia out saving the galaxy.. disney decided to dumb them down, so we can like their characters..

Iger's minions didn't just "dumb down" the original SW characters, they made them sad, bitter has-beens and then killed them off.

 

[RobWDW1971]

Iger's minions didn't just "dumb down" the original SW characters, they made them sad, bitter has-beens and then killed them off.

And poor Admiral Ackbar went from saving the galaxy to being an extra in the background and killed offscreen - didn't even get the obligatory "What the - ?!"

 

[LSLS]

Ultimately, I don't think it's particularly productive to compare Star Wars to the MCU so much. The MCU managing to produce 20+ movies with remarkably consistent popularity is it's own thing. It's a very unique achievement, that no one has been able to duplicate. If there was a magic formula to create a similar cinematic universe, everyone would do it. Several have tried, all have failed.

Star Wars is a franchise that has done well with releasing movies every three years. If it's not suited to a Marvel style onslaught of films, that's fine. Marvel also has an advantage of having a wide range of genres. Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, Guardians, are all very different styles of movies. Every Star Wars movie on the other hand, is a sci-fi space epic. Rogue One or Solo didn't feel sufficiently "different" to me from the other films, the way Marvel movies do.

Star wars isnt releasing close to the mcu anyways. They had three movies with the same characters. But beyond that, just think about what you are saying about this fatigue stuff. You are trying to convince me that a fan base so large and rabid they literally hold conventions (maybe even multiple ones) at convention centers where they travel from all over the world cant quite afford the mental willpower or $12 to see a movie more often than every 3 years. If people cant get invested in a movie every couple years, what hope does a land devoted to said franchise have?

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Star wars isnt releasing close to the mcu anyways. They had three movies with the same characters. But beyond that, just think about what you are saying about this fatigue stuff. You are trying to convince me that a fan base so large and rabid they literally hold conventions (maybe even multiple ones) at convention centers where they travel from all over the world cant quite afford the mental willpower or $12 to see a movie more often than every 3 years. If people cant get invested in a movie every couple years, what hope does a land devoted to said franchise have?

People are coming out to see these movies. Other than Solo, fans have come out to see Star Wars movies in 2015, 2016, 2017, and 2019.

Rise of Skywalker is already the 16th highest grossing film of all time. It might not be reaching the highs of The Force Awakens, but let's not pretend people aren't still paying their $12 to watch these movies.

Personally, fatigue is absolutely a factor. I saw The Phantom Menace more times in the theaters than it realistically deserved, because it was new Star Wars. Likewise I saw The Force Awakens more times than the Last Skywalker.

Fatigue may be one of the reasons this movie is a hit, while not generating Force Awakens levels of business.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Speaking of fatigue--we had 4 hours of stars wars in the form of Mandalorian, it was I believe the #1 show in the U.S and we all can't wait for season 2.. also people even complained of the length of the show, as in we want more star wars.
About the sequels.. remember we had 30 plus years of stories about Luke, Han and Leia out saving the galaxy.. disney decided to dumb them down, so we can like their characters..

Different scenarios. Pressing play on the next episode of a TV series, combined with a comparatively low monthly fee, is different than the expense and effort of going to a movie.

In any case, my point was that 4+ hours of the Mandalorian gave people a Star Wars fix, making it less likely they'd be paying to see Rise of Skywalker multiple times. It's feasible it impacted the film's performance. I know they needed it to help launch Disney+, but I'm still surprised they didn't wait a month or two to release it.

 

[erasure fan1]

But beyond that, just think about what you are saying about this fatigue stuff. You are trying to convince me that a fan base so large and rabid they literally hold conventions (maybe even multiple ones) at convention centers where they travel from all over the world cant quite afford the mental willpower or $12 to see a movie more often than every 3 years. If people cant get invested in a movie every couple years, what hope does a land devoted to said franchise have

Exactly. So many people were talking about fatigue, then celebration sells out in 20min or so. I just don't buy it.

 

[jt04]

Exactly. So many people were talking about fatigue, then celebration sells out in 20min or so. I just don't buy it.

Fatigue is a risk but I think they will avoid by world building that builds slowly through the live action stuff. Definitely is working so far with Mandalorian.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Fatigue is a risk but I think they will avoid by world building that builds slowly through the live action stuff. Definitely is working so far with Mandalorian.

That’s AFTER their plan A just went out with a thud...

But I don’t mean to tarnish anyone’s nametag or anything

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Different scenarios. Pressing play on the next episode of a TV series, combined with a comparatively low monthly fee, is different than the expense and effort of going to a movie.

In any case, my point was that 4+ hours of the Mandalorian gave people a Star Wars fix, making it less likely they'd be paying to see Rise of Skywalker multiple times. It's feasible it impacted the film's performance. I know they needed it to help launch Disney+, but I'm still surprised they didn't wait a month or two to release it.

Good grief...the kicker is never gonna put one through when you put the posts on wheels

Are you seriously trying to say people can’t afford a ticket to Star Wars because of a $6 streaming service? Or they’re “too busy” to go to a movie in amongst their binge streaming and grubhub deliveries?

People all of a sudden became “frugal” or did the economy collapse six months ago and I missed it again?

The movie sucked...it will be remembered in that light. The die is cast.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Exactly. So many people were talking about fatigue, then celebration sells out in 20min or so. I just don't buy it.

Completely different event with different capacity. Rise of the Resistance sold out today in seconds, does that mean anything in terms of the movie's reception? Not really. Really not seeing the point these apples to oranges comparisons.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Good grief...the kicker is never gonna put one through when you put the posts on wheels

Are you seriously trying to say people can’t afford a ticket to Star Wars because of a $6 streaming service? Or they’re “too busy” to go to a movie in amongst their binge streaming and grubhub deliveries?

People all of a sudden became “frugal” or did the economy collapse six months ago and I missed it again?

The movie sucked...it will be remembered in that light. The die is cast.

You clearly didn't comprehend what I wrote, so I guess I'll try and explain it again.

People can afford a ticket to Star Wars, and were able to go see this movie. Lots of people did. Far more than go out to see most movies.

When it's the fifth movie in five years, and there's 4 hours of new Star Wars on television at the same time, the demand for a new movie is going to decrease. Simple as that. If we'd gone three years without a movie and there was no TV show, I expect I'd be more eager to see it again, as would many others.

It's not the only reason for the ultimate box office performance, but I certainly believe fatigue to be a factor.

 

[RobWDW1971]

You clearly didn't comprehend what I wrote, so I guess I'll try and explain it again.

People can afford a ticket to Star Wars, and were able to go see this movie. Lots of people did. Far more than go out to see most movies.

When it's the fifth movie in five years, and there's 4 hours of new Star Wars on television at the same time, the demand for a new movie is going to decrease. Simple as that. If we'd gone three years without a movie and there was no TV show, I expect I'd be more eager to see it again, as would many others.

It's not the only reason for the ultimate box office performance, but I certainly believe fatigue to be a factor.

Is there where we bring in Marvel again and pumping out multiple films in the same year or should we wait a few more posts?

 

[erasure fan1]

Completely different event with different capacity. Rise of the Resistance sold out today in seconds, does that mean anything in terms of the movie's reception? Not really. Really not seeing the point these apples to oranges comparisons.

The event and the speed it sold out shows you there is a big demand from star wars fans. It is the hardcore fans going and spending upwards of $1000 plus depending on where they are coming from. That shows that there is still a lot of demand for the product. I get what you are saying and I do sort of agree. The problem I have with what you are saying is the fatigue is not because of too much star wars. It's because of meh star wars. We aren't having this conversation if they had made better movies. You even said more people went than most movies. You aren't seeing that multiple repeat views as much with this one. You can't underestimate the power of the hardcore fan going multiple, multiple, multiple times. That is where this movie is falling short. Again, not because of fatigue, but because of quality. So if you are saying there is mediocre star wars fatigue, then I'm right there with you.