Staggs says changes to Fantasyland...

[ToTBellHop]

The section of the article you quote seems to *refute* the notion that a male protaginst would be added to FLE. Not sure if that was your intention or not.

All Staggs said is that the additions will not be princess-oriented. How does that refute a male lead?

 

[jakeman]

So there has been a little bit of bickering regarding sources and insider information over the past few days, but I would just like to thank everyone who brings us this information.

I think we sometimes overlook the risk that each posting is for you guys in our desire for more facts.

I for one appreciate all the information everyone post, regardless of how far fetched it is.

So, thank you everyone who sheds light on the inner workings of Disney and provides insight into upcoming projects, however unlikely they may be sometimes! :wave:

 

[orky8]

To help make the FLE more appealing to boys, it doesn't need to change away from the princess/female dominated franchises, it just needs to add more rides. A Snow White M&G would mostly appeal to girls, whereas a Snow White ride (ala Scary Adventure) pretty much appeals to both - maybe more so to girls, but nothing is ever going to a 50-50 split. It seems that this is what Staggs et al are doing, adding more rides so boys will find the area appealing as well.

My gut (perhaps because it is my desire) is that something like the mine coaster is coming. Cindy & Aurora are being moved to FLE East (or removed altogether) and replaced with a SW/Dwarf M&G and a mine "coaster" or dark ride. They should build the Dwarf cottage for the M&G and the mine next to it for a ride. I'm not sure how they will integrate this with SW Scary Adventure - perhaps Scary Adventure will be going away. Well, I'm not sure about any of this, but this is my guess.

Alice also makes sense, but I lean towards SW. Perhaps even both. It's fun to guess/speculate (I'm looking at you JT). I won't be crushed or feel mislead if I guessed wrong.

 

[castevens]

The section of the article you quote seems to *refute* the notion that a male protaginst would be added to FLE. Not sure if that was your intention or not.

Yes and no. It refutes it by saying that it is still female-oriented, but then it goes on to talk about thrill rides and the sort. I was merely implying that the lack of specifics with that portion of the article was the fuel to the speculation.

 

[castevens]

So there has been a little bit of bickering regarding sources and insider information over the past few days, but I would just like to thank everyone who brings us this information.

I think we sometimes overlook the risk that each posting is for you guys in our desire for more facts.

I for one appreciate all the information everyone post, regardless of how far fetched it is.

So, thank you everyone who sheds light on the inner workings of Disney and provides insight into upcoming projects, however unlikely they may be sometimes! :wave:

seconded.

I come here FOR the speculation

 

[ToTBellHop]

To help make the FLE more appealing to boys, it doesn't need to change away from the princess/female dominated franchises, it just needs to add more rides. A Snow White M&G would mostly appeal to girls, whereas a Snow White ride (ala Scary Adventure) pretty much appeals to both - maybe more so to girls, but nothing is ever going to a 50-50 split. It seems that this is what Staggs et al are doing, adding more rides so boys will find the area appealing as well.

My gut (perhaps because it is my desire) is that something like the mine coaster is coming. Cindy & Aurora are being moved to FLE East (or removed altogether) and replaced with a SW/Dwarf M&G and a mine "coaster" or dark ride. They should build the Dwarf cottage for the M&G and the mine next to it for a ride. I'm not sure how they will integrate this with SW Scary Adventure - perhaps Scary Adventure will be going away. Well, I'm not sure about any of this, but this is my guess.

Alice also makes sense, but I lean towards SW. Perhaps even both. It's fun to guess/speculate (I'm looking at you JT). I won't be crushed or feel mislead if I guessed wrong.

Maybe they could keep the M&Gs but lower the cost by combining the princesses together into a sorority-like M&G? Princess U.?

Mine train is possible but Staggs does exclude the princesses from the additions. Whether or not we can extend that to an exclusion of the seven dwarfs is anyone's guess. Of course, this is all guesswork at this point. I, for one, am excited to hear what the actual additions are since I was never all that wowed by the original FLE. I'm glad we have someone in management who also felt the FLE was a bit thin on excitement...

 

[Gomer]

I think people are concentrating too much on the gender of the protaginist in determining if a movie is "too girly". I think Alice in wonderland can be an extrenely "masculine-freindly" property.

For the most part, the princess movies are about love, finding a prince, and living happily ever after. Although boys can enjoy that, I can see how that would be more appealing to little girls.

Alice, on the other hand, is an adventure film featuring a lost child in a dangerous and surreal fantasy land. Giant bugs, insane ramblings, creepy dissapearing cats, magic potions, playing card soldiers, and a crazy queen who likes to chop peoples heads off. Those are all very boy freindly. It was one of my favorites as a young boy, and it also one of my son's favorites.

 

[DisneyParksFan1]

So there has been a little bit of bickering regarding sources and insider information over the past few days, but I would just like to thank everyone who brings us this information.

I think we sometimes overlook the risk that each posting is for you guys in our desire for more facts.

I for one appreciate all the information everyone post, regardless of how far fetched it is.

So, thank you everyone who sheds light on the inner workings of Disney and provides insight into upcoming projects, however unlikely they may be sometimes! :wave:

I third that.

 

[Grizzly Hall 71]

Pinocchio- No it's not coming here. What's so thrilling about Pinnochio anyway?
Dumbo- Already here
Ichabod/Mr. Toad (never going to happen, but I'm going for a complete list)- Had it's turn.
Peter Pan (I know it's been shot down)- No
101 Dalmations (greatly underutilized)- Well it's both a female and male lead so from your logic it wouldn't work. Nor does it fit into Fantasyland.
Sword in the Stone-What's so thrilling about it?
Jungle Book- Belongs in AK or AL had it's turn at AK.
Robin Hood- Once again how can they make it thrilling?
more Pooh (and they have a new Pooh movie coming out in 2011 = synergy)- No Pooh is not thrilling.
Rescuers- Does not fit FL
Fox and the Hound- Does not fit FL
Black Cauldron (does anyone even remember this?)- Horrible!
Great Mouse Detective- Does not fit into FL
Oliver and Company- Um it took place in New York.
Aladdin- It belongs in AL.
Lion King- Had it's turn in FL.
Hunchback- France in Epcot.
Hercules- Took place in Greece.
Tarzan- Africa in FL? No
Emperor's New Groove (waited too long for that)- Took place in South America
Atlantis (did anyone see this?)- Oh yeah, FL needs another submarine ride.
Stitch (cringe)- Why is this up here?
Treasure Planet (did anyone see this?)- No.
Brother Bear (did anyone see this? Yet they made a sequel)- Took place in North America, FL is about more European stuff.
Chicken Little (cringe)- Really?
Meet the Robinsons (actually an okay movie)- Yes the family of Tomorrow belongs in the land of today. Makes a lot of sense.
Bolt- No. What are you serious now?
Reboot Ralph (which no one has even heard of yet, but comes out in 2013)- I guess

So there it is.

 

[lebeau]

All Staggs said is that the additions will not be princess-oriented. How does that refute a male lead?

That's not exactly what he said. Let's dissect:

"he said Disney is trying to broaden the project’s overall appeal. For instance, plans for three interactive princess meet-and-greets — where children could dance with Cinderella, celebrate Sleeping Beauty’s 16th birthday or play a role in a story with Belle of Beauty and the Beast — are being altered."

Okay. Still staying with princesses. Just altering for "broader appeal".

“One of the things that I thought the early design did fantastically was delivered on that princess experience. And that does tend to skew towards girls. … We’ve kept that intact — not exactly, necessarily, the way it was presented, but that appeal is there,” Staggs said.

Again, kept the princess theme intact. Just changed the presentation.

“I think we’ve added some things that aren’t just princess-focused, and that’s a good positive.”

I assume you're hanging your hat on this line. But that doesn't exclude princesses. This could mean we'll see some princes or the seven dwarves. Or even fairies! It certainly doesn't mean a property with a male lead will be added to the mix.

 

[ToTBellHop]

So there it is.

Some may accuse you of being overly defensive of your own opinions. After all, we are all just guessing here. No need to try to discredit every possible option so that Alice in Wonderland is the ONLY possible option. It seems more than a little narrow-minded to me to suggest that only 1 of Disney's films would have any place in a Fantasyland expansion. While I agree that AiW is more boy-friendly than a princess franchise, I don't actually understand why something like 101 Dalmations wouldn't fit.

For the record, ANY franchise can become a thrill ride. Been on Splash Mountain lately? I would argue something like Robin Hood is much more exciting than Song of the South, and yet the latter got the thrill ride. It's the ride system that determines the thrill factor, not the story.

I assume you're hanging your hat on this line. But that doesn't exclude princesses. This could mean we'll see some princes or the seven dwarves. Or even fairies! It certainly doesn't mean a property with a male lead will be added to the mix.

Well, we KNOW there won't be any fairies...so, yes, princesses are excluded. Doesn't mean their franchises are, though, I agree. For example, a ride focusing on Aladdin would work even though Jasmine is a princess. Seven dwarfs are certainly possible. I just happen to dislike the Snow White franchise, but I'm not the one calling the shots on this, so it doesn't matter how I feel.

 

[Grizzly Hall 71]

Some may accuse you of being overly defensive of your own opinions. After all, we are all just guessing here. No need to try to discredit every possible option so that Alice in Wonderland is the ONLY possible option. It seems more than a little narrow-minded to me to suggest that only 1 of Disney's films would have any place in a Fantasyland expansion. While I agree that AiW is more boy-friendly than a princess franchise, I don't actually understand why something like 101 Dalmations wouldn't fit.

For the record, ANY franchise can become a thrill ride. Been on Splash Mountain lately? I would argue something like Robin Hood is much more exciting than Song of the South, and yet the latter got the thrill ride. It's the ride system that determines the thrill factor, not the story.

Have you stayed in the Hollywood Tower Hotel Lately?

I don't mean to come off as rude but 101 Dalmations does not fit the theme of Fantasyland whatsoever. Fl is more about imaginary places. 101 Dalmations took place in London. Sure you said Treasure Planet and Atlantis but that wouldn't fit the theme of a Fantasyland Forest.

 

[Grizzly Hall 71]

Some may accuse you of being overly defensive of your own opinions. After all, we are all just guessing here. No need to try to discredit every possible option so that Alice in Wonderland is the ONLY possible option. It seems more than a little narrow-minded to me to suggest that only 1 of Disney's films would have any place in a Fantasyland expansion. While I agree that AiW is more boy-friendly than a princess franchise, I don't actually understand why something like 101 Dalmations wouldn't fit.

For the record, ANY franchise can become a thrill ride. Been on Splash Mountain lately? I would argue something like Robin Hood is much more exciting than Song of the South, and yet the latter got the thrill ride. It's the ride system that determines the thrill factor, not the story.



Well, we KNOW there won't be any fairies...so, yes, princesses are excluded. Doesn't mean their franchises are, though, I agree. For example, a ride focusing on Aladdin would work even though Jasmine is a princess. Seven dwarfs are certainly possible. I just happen to dislike the Snow White franchise, but I'm not the one calling the shots on this, so it doesn't matter how I feel.

Well Pirates of The Caribbean was more exciting than both of those and all it has it is a boat ride!

 

[lebeau]

This past week, we went a little get-away to Indianapolis. While we were there, we visited the largest children's museum in the world. 5 stories. Tons of attractions for kids of both genders. The big ticket item was a multi-story dinosaur exhibit. There was also a Star Wars exhibit and an exhibit featuring rock stars and their cars.

Anyway, there was a rather large Barbie exhibit. Very impressive and interactive. They had a runway set up. Costumes. A turn table and cameras lined up so kids could play DJ or photographer at the fashion show. They had make-up rooms, hair styling rooms, etc.

The whole place was pink. It was girl-central.

And it was packed with little boys. They danced on the runway. They played with Barbies. I even saw them doing each other's hair.

There was plenty of "boy stuff" to do. You could spend all day in the dino exhibit. You could go see the Star Wars stuff or make a music video. (I saw Michael Jackson's Captain Eo costume, by the way.) But these boys were having a grand old time at the Barbie fashion show.

Just sayin...

 

[ToTBellHop]

Have you stayed in the Hollywood Tower Hotel Lately?

I don't mean to come off as rude but 101 Dalmations does not fit the theme of Fantasyland whatsoever. Fl is more about imaginary places. 101 Dalmations took place in London. Sure you said Treasure Planet and Atlantis but that wouldn't fit the theme of a Fantasyland Forest.

I've never found Snow White to be particularly imaginary, but that's not the point. Fantasyland is more about lands of magic to me--that's where the fantasy comes from. Talking dogs (to me) are fantastical. And I'm not suggesting that 101 Dalmatians will actually get a ride. The franchise is largely dead nowadays (at least partially thanks to Glenn Close). My point is there are many options. AiW is one of them, but not really a shoe-in. Sure, Mad Tea Party is getting a new roof. But, ALL of the Fantasyland rides have been getting spruced up facades, so that doesn't really suggest anything more than the fact that Fantasyland will look very different in 3 years.

 

[lebeau]

Well, we KNOW there won't be any fairies...so, yes, princesses are excluded. Doesn't mean their franchises are, though, I agree. For example, a ride focusing on Aladdin would work even though Jasmine is a princess. Seven dwarfs are certainly possible. I just happen to dislike the Snow White franchise, but I'm not the one calling the shots on this, so it doesn't matter how I feel.

That's my point. Some people seem to be assuming that some boy-centric franchise is getting shoe-horned in to FLE. But I don't think that's necessarily the case. They may just expand on the original ideas in a way that is a little more gender-neutral.

 

[ToTBellHop]

That's my point. Some people seem to be assuming that some boy-centric franchise is getting shoe-horned in to FLE. But I don't think that's necessarily the case. They may just expand on the original ideas in a way that is a little more gender-neutral.

Gender-neutral would be ideal and the most popular option. Which means less dancing with princesses and more adventure. I doubt E-ticket though given Staggs said the budget won't increase by much. I don't know how much they planned on wasting on all of the M&Gs, but I would imagine that number is no where near what an E-Ticket would require.

For that matter, anyone know how much they were planning on blowing on the original FLE? It only had one real ride, yet I get the impression the overall cost as going to be tremendous (and a tremendous waste of money only marginally increasing capacity).

 

[RSoxNo1]

I think people are concentrating too much on the gender of the protaginist in determining if a movie is "too girly". I think Alice in wonderland can be an extrenely "masculine-freindly" property.

For the most part, the princess movies are about love, finding a prince, and living happily ever after. Although boys can enjoy that, I can see how that would be more appealing to little girls.

Alice, on the other hand, is an adventure film featuring a lost child in a dangerous and surreal fantasy land. Giant bugs, insane ramblings, creepy dissapearing cats, magic potions, playing card soldiers, and a crazy queen who likes to chop peoples heads off. Those are all very boy freindly. It was one of my favorites as a young boy, and it also one of my son's favorites.

Considering the name change of Rapunzel to Tangled and the link to the poor box office #s for Princess and the Frog, Disney is very cognicent about Female leads being sold to boys. What they fail to realize is that the Disney name itself has those negative connotations to some boys, so it may be a situation where any franchise that logically fits into Fantasyland is still going to be a tough sell to the male demographic.

 

[lebeau]

Gender-neutral would be ideal and the most popular option. Which means less dancing with princesses and more adventure.

It seems like if the princesses are going to dance, it will be in a much less costly environment.

I expect more adventure is a safe bet.

 

[Evil Genius]

1) The Burton Wonderland film may technically have a female protagonist, but let's be honest, it is/was a Depp starring vehicle and THAT'S what drove box office sales. Otherwise the film was garbage.

2) Look at the root word in Fantasyland...hmm...fantasy...as in outside the realm of reality. In other words...ANY Disney animated classic would FIT in Fantasyland! 101 Dalmations...talking dogs...yup fantasy! Brother Bear...again anthropomophized animals AND a human transforming into a bear...seems pretty fanciful to me as well...I think we see where I'm headed with this...

3) If I had my druthers...they want something less "girly" and at the same time E ticket-esque...I got three words for you: Herecules-Mount Olympus! You get your boy demographic...your thrill...AND a new mountain!