Haymarket2008
Well-Known Member
@MansionButler84 Are you liking what you are hearing so far regarding the retheme? Any reason to worry about cut corners or half baked experiences?
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News Splash Mountain retheme to Princess and the Frog - Tiana's Bayou Adventure
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ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
Oh, God. I hate this project. The ride will be fine, but I don’t like retrofits. It would be a helluvalot better (and a helluvalot less condescending) as a new ride at DHS.
It’ll still have the 50 foot plunge….
Any leads on:
A. How long they'll be down?
B. Fate of the America Sings AAs
C. Anything regarding Pooh or Hungry Bear
ppete1975
Well-Known Member
or just a new ride anywhere... im tired of removing a ride then replacing it. This is of course a different situation but Disney has gotten a bit out of hand with the replacement instead of new.
SailorMercury
Well-Known Member
Gut Little Mermaid and One Man’s Dream and make a black box for PatF out of it.
Then make Launch Bay a Princess M&G and do something with the Fairy Tale hall.
I have solved all of Disney’s Problems.
"Here lie Brer Rabbit, Fox and Bear.
In Frontierland they lived, till Disney said,
'Get them outta there'
jt04
Well-Known Member
Space Mountain has to be on the list too. Post 50th anniversary will be busy.
WDW's Splash Mountain Nightmare Before Christmas overlay #Confirmed!
Splash Mountain Wishables Removed from Disney Parks Collectible Pin Pack - Disney Pins Blog
Details on the Splash Mountain Wishables Removed from Disney Parks Collectible Pin Pack!disneypinsblog.com
Little Green Men
Well-Known Member
Mocking Disney for removing something that’s extremely problematic isn’t exactly a great trait.
The Aracuan Bird
Well-Known Member
Part of what is “extremely problematic” with it is how they’ve felt with it. Let’s go over the points.
- Joel Chandler Harris writes the Uncle Remus stories, attaching a negative stereotype to stories that weren’t his.
- Disney adapts these stories based off this version. Live action segments have...issues. Animated segments retain most of what was in the original stories. Uncle Remus stereotype is retained.
- Disney creates Splash Mountain. Uncle Remus stereotype is dropped. However, they fail to acknowledge the true nature of the stories, and refuse to acknowledge it outside of the ride.
- Disney decides to get rid of the ride, and to avoid potential backlash for a cheaply made replacement, they reinforce the narrative that the Brer Rabbit stories are racist at their core (not true) because their original film was bad, and they absolve themselves from the blame of not putting the effort to do right by what they stole.
Yeah, I think they kind of deserve criticism for that. I’m not sure if the poster’s intent was in the right place. Maybe not. I do have to question the use of the term “woke”. But I don’t think the company is doing a great thing here.
They should have put in the effort to fix the mistakes they caused with Song of the South. They shouldn’t be using their only black princess up on a 50ft flume drop ride when a large part of the target audience (young children) won’t get to ride it, and that’s awful for them. As for the new theme of the ride, I don’t care, as long as it’s good. The log ride itself is the least concerning piece of this puzzle.
Your bar for this must be set really really low!
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But not problematic enough to shut down immediately? Super interesting to see a poster be labeled a "terrible person" by people who defend a major cooperation and their fake "wokeness" because it is clear that their bottom line is way more important than shutting down this little racist making log ride. I love SM but I will be honest I am excited for the new version whatever that may be because I love the Frog and Princess movie.
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Magenta Panther
Well-Known Member
I actually met the author so yeah, I'm aware she was white. I speak of the adaptation by Disney via the "director" Ava DuVernay, whose adaptation was garbage. She made changes to the story, not to enhance it for the screen, but to push her political agenda. She thought the characters were too white. She thought the storyline wasn't woke enough. She filled a thoughtful, imaginative, emotionally-driven tale with unnecessary preachy "empowerment" tripe. Thus ruining it. I have no patience with that kind of crap. I CAN see the issues with the original film "Song of the South". But I agree with Whoopee Goldberg that the film should be shown. There is much that is very good in it. A little judicial editing would, IMO, solve most of the issues some have with it. I think it's better to do that, so that new generations can enjoy the film's magic, music and James Baskett's Oscar-winning performance, than burying it and pretending it never happened. Same with Splash Mountain. The Oriental Land Company, BTW, has no intention of removing the Splash ride from Tokyo Disneyland. They apparently think we're being very silly about the whole thing. I agree. And I think it's hilarious that Iger can't do squat about Splash remaining in the best Disney park in the world. Yeah! Pound sand, Iger!
As for African-Americans writing original stories that can be adapted to Disney rides and shows, naturally I'm all for it. But I have the same standard for that as I do for all creative things: the material has to be good. Like Walt, I "take my hat off to talent". That's all that matters to me.
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
Rather than even changing the attraction, they could add a museum/display area explaining the oral history of these African American stories and how they came to be...
Their adaptation to book form saved these African American folk tales from disappearing completely...
Perhaps an exhibit celebrating the origin of the stories would be better than erasing them and their history from existence
Maybe Song Of The South was not the best way to represent them, but for it's time, I believe it tried...
Time has passed, we are more evolved now on the issues...
Make the stories' origins a part of the attraction...Use this as a teaching moment, not erase and replace with something else.
Their adaptation to book form saved these African American folk tales from disappearing completely...
Perhaps an exhibit celebrating the origin of the stories would be better than erasing them and their history from existence
Maybe Song Of The South was not the best way to represent them, but for it's time, I believe it tried...
Time has passed, we are more evolved now on the issues...
Make the stories' origins a part of the attraction...Use this as a teaching moment, not erase and replace with something else.
FantasiaMickey2000
Well-Known Member
It’s a great idea but Disney of today is not a company of courage. They are going to take the easy way out to appease activist political groups every time. Shame that James Baskett was the first African American to win an Oscar and Disney will make sure that performance never sees the light of day or is discussed ever again.
KCheatle
Well-Known Member
I think there are extremists on both sides - people who will negatively categorize anyone who wants to make change as "woke" and people who believe all people who are not on the streets actively protesting are terrible humans. I think most people fall in the middle; recognizing that racism is still pretty prevalent, and things need to get better.
That being said, I think Disney jumped too quickly into committing to this SM makeover and did it solely to stay relevant in the media. I think it was easy for them to pat themselves on the back in admitting Song of the South Disney-fied a very serious cultural problem, and then promising to make up for that by substituting the ride theme with like literally their only black protagonist (Soul didn't come out until Christmas).
What I hear is: Hi! Disney here. We have known SOTS was problematic for a while now, but this ride was like super popular and it would cost a lot of money to do an overlay, so we did not do anything to change it. But now we feel like we need to stay relevant, so we're promising to change it, but only if we can do it with a coupon code (2-for-1 deal), and we're going to restrict the options for overlay to only something involving a black protagonist. Ah! Since we only have one of those, that's what we're going with. Oh, and again, we're only doing this if we can get a good deal $$ on it, and if not, then sorry - it's staying as is.
Also, we are not changing IASW even though each region is over-simplyfyingly seperated by skin color. And, we are not changing Peter Pan's Flight even though we portrayed Native Americans very poorly in that movie. And, we are not changing pirates of the carribean, which has no black animatronics, even though a significant amount of pirates were black, having become pirates after their slave ships were taken over.
So, it seems to me Disney isn't REALLY committed to the overall message of change and bettermant, and is more committed to staying relevant in the media, but only if it can do it at a discount.
Ultiamtely, I'm all for changing SM to PATF. The music is awesome and I love hte movie. But, I don't believe for one second that Disney will prioritize the movement for cultural change above their bottomline. They want to appear as if they do so that people believe they are supporting a "good" business. But, never forget, Disney is a for profit business.
That being said, I think Disney jumped too quickly into committing to this SM makeover and did it solely to stay relevant in the media. I think it was easy for them to pat themselves on the back in admitting Song of the South Disney-fied a very serious cultural problem, and then promising to make up for that by substituting the ride theme with like literally their only black protagonist (Soul didn't come out until Christmas).
What I hear is: Hi! Disney here. We have known SOTS was problematic for a while now, but this ride was like super popular and it would cost a lot of money to do an overlay, so we did not do anything to change it. But now we feel like we need to stay relevant, so we're promising to change it, but only if we can do it with a coupon code (2-for-1 deal), and we're going to restrict the options for overlay to only something involving a black protagonist. Ah! Since we only have one of those, that's what we're going with. Oh, and again, we're only doing this if we can get a good deal $$ on it, and if not, then sorry - it's staying as is.
Also, we are not changing IASW even though each region is over-simplyfyingly seperated by skin color. And, we are not changing Peter Pan's Flight even though we portrayed Native Americans very poorly in that movie. And, we are not changing pirates of the carribean, which has no black animatronics, even though a significant amount of pirates were black, having become pirates after their slave ships were taken over.
So, it seems to me Disney isn't REALLY committed to the overall message of change and bettermant, and is more committed to staying relevant in the media, but only if it can do it at a discount.
Ultiamtely, I'm all for changing SM to PATF. The music is awesome and I love hte movie. But, I don't believe for one second that Disney will prioritize the movement for cultural change above their bottomline. They want to appear as if they do so that people believe they are supporting a "good" business. But, never forget, Disney is a for profit business.
jt04
Well-Known Member
Agree with most of this. But PatF is more relevant and relatable in 2021. It is also proactively inclusive which is something P&R has been far too slow at. It is an elegant solution to several problems in the park. But being more race inclusive is the most important. IMO.
jt04
Well-Known Member
Disney has always depicted protagonists vs antagonists. Not sure race has anything to do with that basic storeyline that is as old as history itself. Including Tiana and the PatF franchise would likely include more than just the overlay of Splash. IMO.
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I said this over in the Cali thread but I figured it works here, Disney has essentially dug themselves into a hole with Song Of the South. Years and years of pretending it's some hideous monster that can never see the light of day has prevented them from releasing it without facing "DiSney REleaSeS ExTREmleY Racist MovIe" backlash. They really had no choice but to say they're getting rid of the material people had problems with and bring in something people wouldn't be as upset with.
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