Splash Mountain re-theme announced

[bennyw01]

Like any Disney Park fan I was apprehensive about the re-theme of Splash Mountain, but this is due to my history with the attraction I couldn't see beyond my own enjoyment. Now if you take the 5 minutes to think about it, the source material for this attraction makes people very uncomfortable in a world that should be inclusive. No one should come to the Happiest Place on Earth and ever feel historical un-welcome or have to explain dated notions of slavery to their children. Its the same ride mechanism just with a slightly modern message, a message that we should all be able to agree with as being just.

 

[celluloid]

Like any Disney Park fan I was apprehensive about the re-theme of Splash Mountain, but this is due to my history with the attraction I couldn't see beyond my own enjoyment. Now if you take the 5 minutes to think about it, the source material for this attraction makes people very uncomfortable in a world that should be inclusive. No one should come to the Happiest Place on Earth and ever feel historical un-welcome or have to explain dated notions of slavery to their children. Its the same ride mechanism just with a slightly modern message, a message that we should all be able to agree with as being just.

Could you elaborate on what dates notion of Slavery Splash Mt is displaying?
I imagine most children can't relate to Naveen or Tiana. Either you are rich or will meet someone rich. The mama Odie song and work hard message would be good, but kind of falls apart when Naveen is rich and they have magic help them. It is not anymore healthy or realistic if you take it literally. You can say it's more recognizable and marketable, but I do not think Princess And The Frog has any moral high ground compared to the simple fable displayed in the scenes of the ride Splash Mt.

 

[Brer Panther]

So, Brer Fox is an offensive black stereotype because he's a "schemer trying to get an easy meal who's not nearly as clever as he thinks"... does that mean Wile E. Coyote is an offensive black stereotype too? I at least understand why Brer Fox's VOICE makes some think of him as an offensive stereotype (even though it's no worse than Eddie Murphy's), but this just seems ridiculous.

And Brer Bear is an offensive black stereotype because he's a "big, dumb brute"? How does that automatically make somebody a black stereotype? I legitimately do not get this...

 

[Rich Brownn]

That does not negate the fact that the film didn't glorify slavery. Please stop conflating the prettying up of reconstruction with glorifying slavery. And if you've seen the film, the white plantation owner's wife is the most dis-likable character in the entire thing, so it's not as if even reconstruction was being "glorified".

Other that the kid, all of the white folks seem brain dead LOL... I actually had a black friend watch it with me (she and I go back a long time) and her comment was "OK, it wasn't as bad as I thought. Gone with The Wind is way more offensive. " (She liked a great portion of it though)

 

[Rich Brownn]

The problematic parts of SotS aren't the animated characters.

Excluding the Tar Baby cartoon, of course.

 

[Incomudro]

The movie revels in the plantation aesthetic, the images of black "mammies" and "uncles" cooking and serving white people in their big house, and the black farmers dutifully gathering around the plantation to sing hymns and pray for the little white kid. The movie even begins with a musical salute to "I Wish I Was in Dixie". The fact that the movie is purportedly set after the black plantation workers had been freed is utterly incidental to the plot.

There is NO line, and this whole movement which will now fundamentally change Disney Parks will be fun to watch. I hope they push the absolute envelope when re-doing these attractions to the point that everything is so boring that Disney loses. They deserve every bit of what they get for this dumb decision.

You're correct unfortunately.
There is no line.
Because wherever and whenever the line gets drawn - and conditions are met - it gets moved further and drawn again.

 

[Incomudro]

The same way that Mammy from Gone With The Wind is a stereotype despite being portrayed by a black actress.

When people say things like this...
Where there not people like her at the time the movie depicts?
It may not be flattering, but people like that existed.

 

[Rich Brownn]

Could you elaborate on what dates notion of Slavery Splash Mt is displaying?
I imagine most children can't relate to Naveen or Tiana. Either you are rich or will meet someone rich. The mama Odie song and work hard message would be good, but kind of falls apart when Naveen is rich and they have magic help them. It is not anymore healthy or realistic if you take it literally. You can say it's more recognizable and marketable, but I do not think Princess And The Frog has any moral high ground compared to the simple fable displayed in the scenes of the ride Splash Mt.

I think two of the differences between the stereotype and Tiana is 1) She isn't just hanging around waiting for a man to rescue her. She is actively trying to get her dreams on her own and is held back 2) Rather than the girl submitting to the price, he actually not only falls in love with her (despite her not being a princess and possibly dooming him as a frog forever) he goes with her to live her dream, not carry her off to his palace.

 

[celluloid]

I think two of the differences between the stereotype and Tiana is 1) She isn't just hanging around waiting for a man to rescue her. She is actively trying to get her dreams on her own and is held back 2) Rather than the girl submitting to the price, he actually not only falls in love with her (despite her not being a princess and possibly dooming him as a frog forever) he goes with her to live her dream, not carry her off to his palace.

You mean she takes the rich Prince with her?

I am not trying to belittle Patf. The notion that has no evidence from others is this change brings a story with less stereotypes than the current fable in the ride.

 

[orlandogal22]

Like any Disney Park fan I was apprehensive about the re-theme of Splash Mountain, but this is due to my history with the attraction I couldn't see beyond my own enjoyment. Now if you take the 5 minutes to think about it, the source material for this attraction makes people very uncomfortable in a world that should be inclusive. No one should come to the Happiest Place on Earth and ever feel historical un-welcome or have to explain dated notions of slavery to their children. Its the same ride mechanism just with a slightly modern message, a message that we should all be able to agree with as being just.

Literally NO child is getting off Splash Mountain after riding it for the first time and saying - "Mom & Dad, can you teach me about slavery?"

 

[Father Robinson]

I didn't read through the whole thread and I am sure it has been mentioned but it does bear mentioning again, especially to all the Disney Shills that are on these boards ...

The petition to save Splash Mountain far exceeds all of the petitions to retheme Splash Mountain combined.

But we all know petitions mean nothing ...

Although I will put one thing in perspective ... the total number of people who have signed all the re-theme Splash Mountain petitions combined equates to about 30K people. WDW alone gets 58M visitors a year and Disneyland is 19M ... therefore the people that want Splash Mountain re-themed equates to approximately 0.0003% of the park going population.

Disney Corporate Executives, Disney Shills, and whoever is paid by Disney to read these boards ... I am sure you factored those numbers into your decisions, right?

The numbers are irrefutable, the overwhelming majority do not want this change to happen- and here's something else shocking, not everyone that doesn't want it to happen is a racist. Some people are just sick of losing classic e-ticket attractions, some people want ADDITIONS to the park not re-themes because that doesn't help with crowd control, some people are scared at the prospect of losing an attraction with 100 AAs (a dying art) which will undoubtedly be replaced by an attraction with considerably less (maybe) ...

My point is this- there is a way to have this discussion with civility and grace and without assuming what someone's motives may be behind what they want to see happen here but at the end of the day there are two big arguments for both sides that come from these numbers:

1. Disney is clearly making a decision that goes against the numbers, maybe that means something, maybe they think they are doing the right thing? (Although maybe its a marketing ploy to detract from the park delays)

2. The people that don't want it changed is the OVERWHELMING majority, so maybe those that do want it changed shouldn't think all of those people are crazy or racist or un-woke or whatever.

That's all.

 

[bennyw01]

Literally NO child is getting off Splash Mountain after riding it for the first time and saying - "Mom & Dad, can you teach me about slavery?"

OK, try to picture this, you're a black parent, your kid comes off Splash Mountain and wants to know more about the characters. They discover Song of the South and ask you why can't they watch this or find it anywhere on Disney+? You'd then have to explain to your child why Disney has a ride that trivialises their ancestors strife through stereotypes and poor taste. Its 2020, we should educating all children better and use this as a turning point to amend this for those who aren't completely happy with Splash... like I said Disney is about inclusion and we should empathise with that.

I don't disagree that on the surface Splash Mountain is innocent, I waited a number of days before I posted because I needed to put myself in the shoes of someone it did affect. Firstly I was the same.. why should we change Splash Mountain and the reason is that we care enough to accept change for the better.

 

[aw14]

Literally NO child is getting off Splash Mountain after riding it for the first time and saying - "Mom & Dad, can you teach me about slavery?"

I have posted this before but its worth repeating. My daughter, now 17, was roughly 8 the first time she rode SM. Outside of all the fun elements, drops, animatronics, etc...the one thing she remembers to this day is the song that she mis heard.

She leaned over to me & said "dad, why are they signing pretty good show us your ". I damn near peed myself laughing so hard.

You are correct, the idea that a someone goes on that ride & comes off asking about slavery or reconstruction is likely never going to happen.

 

[aw14]

OK, try to picture this, you're a black parent, your kid comes off Splash Mountain and wants to know more about the characters. They discover Song of the South and ask you why can't they watch this or find it anywhere on Disney+? You'd then have to explain to your child why Disney has a ride that trivialises their ancestors strife through stereotypes and poor taste. Its 2020, we should educating all children better and use this as a turning point to amend this for those who aren't completely happy with Splash... like I said Disney is about inclusion and we should empathise with that.

I don't disagree that on the surface Splash Mountain is innocent, I waited a number of days before I posted because I needed to put myself in the shoes of someone it did affect. Firstly I was the same.. why should we change Splash Mountain and the reason is that we care enough to accept change for the better.

How is it a change for the better to PatF? Understanding the background of that tale being a white, European story.

Who does it affect & how? Why is it a bad thing, IF a child asked their parent about the story? Isn't that a teachable moment?

 

[orlandogal22]

OK, try to picture this, you're a black parent, your kid comes off Splash Mountain and wants to know more about the characters. They discover Song of the South and ask you why can't they watch this or find it anywhere on Disney+? You'd then have to explain to your child why Disney has a ride that trivialises their ancestors strife through stereotypes and poor taste. Its 2020, we should educating all children better and use this as a turning point to amend this for those who aren't completely happy with Splash... like I said Disney is about inclusion and we should empathise with that.

I don't disagree that on the surface Splash Mountain is innocent, I waited a number of days before I posted because I needed to put myself in the shoes of someone it did affect. Firstly I was the same.. why should we change Splash Mountain and the reason is that we care enough to accept change for the better.

I worked at Disney.

The average child - of any race - is getting off Splash Mountain laughing at how soaked they got, how much fun it was, and then racing to get to their next Fastpass.

The end.

 

[bennyw01]

You guys need to scratch the surface a little on the source material for Splash Mountain.

Even on release the National Negro Congress picketed cinemas as they found it insulting, 1947 isn't that long ago but 28 years of Splash Mountain is a good run.. you think we really need hold onto something that was described as 'as vicious a piece of propaganda for white supremacy as Hollywood ever produced '??

Clearly there's something here, I am glad they are changing it and I hope it makes you feel uncomfortable cause that's how many people have felt for decades.

 

[celluloid]

Literally NO child is getting off Splash Mountain after riding it for the first time and saying - "Mom & Dad, can you teach me about slavery?"

You mean you never stopped enjoying the thrills and theme because it was clear it was some sort of monument to systemic racism?

 

[orlandogal22]

You guys need to scratch the surface a little on the source material for Splash Mountain.

Even on release the National Negro Congress picketed cinemas as they found it insulting, 1947 isn't that long ago but 28 years of Splash Mountain is a good run.. you think we really need hold onto something that was described as 'as vicious a piece of propaganda for white supremacy as Hollywood ever produced '??

Clearly there's something here, I am glad they are changing it and I hope it makes you feel uncomfortable cause that's how many people have felt for decades.

Oh, that surface has been "scratched" on here over the last 200+ pages.

 

[celluloid]

You guys need to scratch the surface a little on the source material for Splash Mountain.

Even on release the National Negro Congress picketed cinemas as they found it insulting, 1947 isn't that long ago but 28 years of Splash Mountain is a good run.. you think we really need hold onto something that was described as 'as vicious a piece of propaganda for white supremacy as Hollywood ever produced '??

Clearly there's something here, I am glad they are changing it and I hope it makes you feel uncomfortable cause that's how many people have felt for decades.

Even if this was true. If the discomfort of losing a beloved theme park and pop culture piece of artwork is the same level of discomfort someone may feel about it existing, then it is all the more reason it should stay.

 

[thomas998]

OK, try to picture this, you're a black parent, your kid comes off Splash Mountain and wants to know more about the characters. They discover Song of the South and ask you why can't they watch this or find it anywhere on Disney+? You'd then have to explain to your child why Disney has a ride that trivialises their ancestors strife through stereotypes and poor taste. Its 2020, we should educating all children better and use this as a turning point to amend this for those who aren't completely happy with Splash... like I said Disney is about inclusion and we should empathise with that.

I don't disagree that on the surface Splash Mountain is innocent, I waited a number of days before I posted because I needed to put myself in the shoes of someone it did affect. Firstly I was the same.. why should we change Splash Mountain and the reason is that we care enough to accept change for the better.

Why would the parents even mention Song of the South? They could simply tell their child that the characters are based on black folktales which is true and avoids mentioning Song of the South completely. Given the cartoons had also been shown at various time in the past without the live action portions of the movie as stand alone cartoons one could argue that the ride was never intended to even be connected to Song of the South. As I understand it originally Disney originally intended to make several movies with rabbit, fox and bear.