Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts Tres

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Disneyhead'71

Disneyhead'71

Well-Known Member
WDWFigment said:
Phase 2.0 was pretty widely discussed on the Disneyland-centric sites; I'm familiar with it. Just because there was a more aggressive solution doesn't mean what we got wasn't aggressive. Besides, Phase II almost never happens in any Disney project. DCA 2.0 might be the one expansion to buck that trend, as it looks like we're about to get a Phase 2...

If Disney had no other choice with DCA, I'd like to see WDSP explained. Disneyland Resort needed a resort draw and its second gate wasn't pulling its weight. Disneyland Resort Paris has even more rooms to fill, and its second gate is an absolute mess that does a worse job pulling its weight. Yet somehow, there is a choice in Paris?

There's a choice in Paris, just as there was a choice in Anaheim. If Iger takes the blame for the failures, he should take credit for the successes, too. DCA 2.0 was a success, and he deserves credit. Not it being dismissed as a no brainer.

It's easy to say X or Y is an easy decision when you're sitting in the peanut gallery judging decisions through the narrow lens of a fan...
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And yet, Potter Phase II is butt deep in construction. Yet again another difference between TWDC and Universal Studios. What do the sports guys call it? Oh yeah, follow through.
 
TalkingHead

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
Disneyhead'71 said:
And yet, Potter Phase II is butt deep in construction. Yet again another difference between TWDC and Universal Studios. What do the sports guys call it? Oh yeah, follow through.
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Saw your pics at OU. Those facades look massive! I don't know how the rides will turn out, but the environment alone looks like it'll be an E-ticket.
 
Cosmic Commando

Cosmic Commando

Well-Known Member
WDWFigment said:
If Disney had no other choice with DCA, I'd like to see WDSP explained. Disneyland Resort needed to have draw as a destination resort and its second gate wasn't pulling its weight. Disneyland Resort Paris has even more rooms to fill, and its second gate is an absolute mess that does a worse job pulling its weight. Yet somehow, there is a choice in Paris?
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We don't know what will eventually happen with WDSP. You could have asked how Disney would "let" DCA 1.0 happen in mid-2007 before the makeover was announced. I don't mean to swat away your question; it is worth discussing. It could be that Disney itself is more insulated from WDSP, both financially and culturally. I think the "embarrassment theory" is good; a famous chef having their signature restaurant in their hometown shut down by the Health Dept. is a lot more embarrassing and damaging than the same thing happening to a restaurant run by a franchisee halfway across the world. Maybe the financials in WDSP aren't quite as bad as we think; if people loved DCA 1.0, Disney would be fine with the tackiness.

When I say that they wouldn't let DCA 2.0 fail, I don't think it was an eventuality that there would be some giant makeover. I think, over time, Disney could have probably figured out how to iron out some of the wrinkles from DCA 1.0 and lower expectations and make it somewhat profitable. I think once they did decide on the makeover, though, they had to have it succeed. Spending $1.2B and not fixing DCA's image problem would have been a disaster.
 
lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
WDWFigment said:
If Disney had no other choice with DCA, I'd like to see WDSP explained. Disneyland Resort needed to have draw as a destination resort and its second gate wasn't pulling its weight. Disneyland Resort Paris has even more rooms to fill, and its second gate is an absolute mess that does a worse job pulling its weight. Yet somehow, there is a choice in Paris?
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The organizational structure of Euro Disney SCA and until recently the organization of their debt. Until The Walt Disney Company purchased the debt, all spending had to be approved by the various debt holders. Even now with The Walt Disney Company being the sole debt holder, new spending will be financed with new debt. While Walt Disney Parks & resorts effectively controls Euro Disney SCA there is still a shareholder group that oversees management to ensure actions taken by management are in the interest of the SCA's silent partners, the shareholders, and not the controlling partner. A massive $1 billion plus reboot of the Walt Disney Studios Park would require Euro Disney SCA to take on that $1 billion plus in additional debt financed by The Walt Disney Company, who is not going to be able to just give such a sum to another company in which they only own about a third.
 
ScoutN

ScoutN

OV 104
Premium Member
BGW Saga and drama just got thicker. Post on a BGW forum here.

I am posting this as rumor since there is obviously no public announcement made. Sea World is looking for a buyer for Williamsburg and Tampa as far as I know. Jim Atchinson is looking at ways to cut all spending for the rest of the year especially since the park is not doing well at all this year. There was even slight mention of the park being closed for next year. When I investigated this further this information has trickled down into lower management outside corporate and they are under the impression it would only close two years from now. I don't see that happening but the fact that it has actually been mentioned starting in corporate and making its way down is very disconcerting. If Sea World does find a buyer for this park then who knows what will happen. I know this seems contradictory to all the plans that have been made for future seasons but this is coming from corporate. I tried to see if this info had been leaked elsewhere and came across a blog posted a few days ago that mentioned a European theme park chain was interested in the Williamsburg property. There are a million possibilities of what's going on but those are the facts that have leaked out. Here is some more: Whether Sea World has let SG burn money or his friends Carl and John have covered up his wrongdoings doesn't negate that this park has been mismanaged. Which leads me to believe that it starts higher up for Sea World to want to sell Tampa as well. They put in charge a man, SG, that has run his own finances into the ground. He was forced to sell his million dollar plus mansion in FL for a huge loss. He was forced to sell his house here in Ford's Colony for a $47,000 loss. He is obviously not good with money and yet they give him the most money to burn. He even took from the maintenance budget this year causing certain safety hazards to remain and other structural damages go by the wayside. So, is the handwriting on the wall? Are they trying to go out in one big hoorah? Did he sell his local home because he knows the ship is sinking or is he consolidating to stay for the long haul and BG Williamsburg isn't going to be sold? Did Sea World open their shares to the public to buy to take their money and run or help with the losses they already have incurred? We can speculate all day long but the truth is above. Talk of selling because of the loss of profits is underway and they have been reported to be looking for a buyer. As much as this could suck it might be a blessing in disguise and the only way to get rid of SG and a whole slew of bad management and unqualified people. Although I would never wish the park to close because that would cripple this community.
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disneyonmymind

disneyonmymind

Member
Scoutn757 said:
BGW Saga and drama just got thicker. Post on a BGW forum here.
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I honestly hope this isn't true. BGW is a local favorite and is responsible for bringing thousands of people to Williamsburg. I can't even fathom it closing. When I went in June I did hear numerous complaints from employees about the current park management and how bad things are behind the scenes, but I didn't think anything of it at the time.
 
D

doctornick

Well-Known Member
Cosmic Commando said:
I think once they did decide on the makeover, though, they had to have it succeed. Spending $1.2B and not fixing DCA's image problem would have been a disaster.
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Well, this is what I hope regarding DHS. It seems that there is momentum for a makeover and I'm hoping that the powers that be are determined to "do it right" and make sure it succeeds. But I'm skeptical given the scant info on specifics that have circulated so far. The components sound like some nice additions but it seems sparser than what DHS really needs (especially considering how much physical space is supposed to be closed and repurposed).
 
the.dreamfinder

the.dreamfinder

Well-Known Member
This was also posted to the same thread:
I forgot to mention this since it's only a rumor and I haven't heard any truth to it. But Auggie Busch has obviously been upset at the direction of the park so there was talk that he was looking for a way to buy BG Williamsburg. The rights to his name end in another year or two so that will be a big ing match.
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WDWFigment

WDWFigment

Well-Known Member
lazyboy97o said:
The organizational structure of Euro Disney SCA and until recently the organization of their debt. Until The Walt Disney Company purchased the debt, all spending had to be approved by the various debt holders. Even now with The Walt Disney Company being the sole debt holder, new spending will be financed with new debt. While Walt Disney Parks & resorts effectively controls Euro Disney SCA there is still a shareholder group that oversees management to ensure actions taken by management are in the interest of the SCA's silent partners, the shareholders, and not the controlling partner. A massive $1 billion plus reboot of the Walt Disney Studios Park would require Euro Disney SCA to take on that $1 billion plus in additional debt financed by The Walt Disney Company, who is not going to be able to just give such a sum to another company in which they only own about a third.
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Doesn't this assume there's a risk to taking the 'all in' approach? That it's not a sure thing? If not, then why be concerned about approval?

Regardless of the organizational structure and the debt, if rebuilding WDSP were a no-brainer, it should be approved in an instant because it's essentially all reward. Unfortunately, there IS an "if" there, just as there was an "if" with DCA 2.0. It was not a no-brainer decision, just as WDSP is not a no-brainer.

I'd argue that if either one is an easier decision, it's WDSP. WDSP is an awful park (I didn't visit DCA in 2001, but I cannot fathom it being worse than WDSP even today) that does poor numbers. Plus, DLRP is in greater need of being a European destination resort rather than a day-trip because it has more hotel rooms to fill.
 
lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
WDWFigment said:
Doesn't this assume there's a risk to taking the 'all in' approach? That it's not a sure thing? If not, then why be concerned about approval?

Regardless of the organizational structure and the debt, if rebuilding WDSP were a no-brainer, it should be approved in an instant because it's essentially all reward. Unfortunately, there IS an "if" there, just as there was an "if" with DCA 2.0. It was not a no-brainer decision, just as WDSP is not a no-brainer.

I'd argue that if either one is an easier decision, it's WDSP. WDSP is an awful park (I didn't visit DCA in 2001, but I cannot fathom it being worse than WDSP even today) that does poor numbers. Plus, DLRP is in greater need of being a European destination resort rather than a day-trip because it has more hotel rooms to fill.
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Disneyland had a sole owner and four decades of successful operation behind it during which time it became an engrained part of Americana. Disneyland Paris has a shorter, mostly troubled history in which blame is still placed on the park that has seen the amassing of an enormous amount of debt.
 
ScoutN

ScoutN

OV 104
Premium Member
the.dreamfinder said:
This was also posted to the same thread:
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Disneyhead'71 said:
Never under estimate Auggie Busch.
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AS much as I would like to say there is a chance of that happening I really do not see that as a plausible option. Speculators instantly throw them in the ring with it. At the end of the day their ownership of the parks was to promote a beer. A beer that they no longer own. The profit aspect was irrelevant during that time frame. There would be a lot of work cut out for them. Not saying that the work ile is not high as is.
 
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