Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

[flynnibus]

So what percentage of those strollers are Disney rentals. Who is it that is making selfish decisions really. Those that use what is available to them or those that enable?

Now you're just trying to defend people as victims themselves... What's next... people are fat because Disney has so many quick service locations?

Disney didn't force any of people to take a rental stroller. I know, asking people to take responsibility for their choices might be considered 'mean' these days... but so what.

 

[doctornick]

I would never take a toddler into a theme park to begin with. That kind of thinking is completely foreign to me and my family. I can wait until they are 5 or 6.

Well, you could, but it's hard to come up with a place that is as fantastic for a 3 year old to visit as a Disney park. It's particularly cool to take them in the nice 2.5-3 year old window when they are free to go to the parks (and free for buffets like character meals) and still can enjoy a ton or rides and shows and have great memories. Heck, some stuff like the Disney Jr on stage is basically directed towards the preschool set.

Also, when they are preschool, you can be much more flexible in terms of times to visit and going off season when it's not crowded, since missing school isn't an issue.

I would say from my friends/family/associates that when the oldest child is about 4-6 years old is a typical time frame for people to plan a big WDW trip.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Oh, there are far more strollers at WDW than DLR, it's not even close. But, IMHO, due to the space limitations at DL, the impact is just as bad. WDW has abundant stroller parking that generally is not interfering with walkways or access to attractions, where DLR tends to shoehorn them into tighter locations and they can be more of an obstacle. Especially during times like shows/parades when the walkways become even more tight.

Folks at DL may put their strollers in tighter places, but the most you'll see is ten to maybe fifteen strollers. It's not like there are thirty, forty strollers in one area. It's a sea of strollers in that photo flynnibus posted.

 

[flynnibus]

In reality the people most inconvenienced by unnecessary strollers are the people there with strollers.

But just because they accept the negatives for themselves... it doesn't make the impact go away for others. So honestly, I don't care if it impacts them or not... it doesn't change how it impacts everyone else as well.

 

[doctornick]

Folks at DL may put their strollers in tighter places, but the most you'll see is ten to maybe fifteen strollers. It's not like there are thirty, forty strollers in one area. It's a sea of strollers in that photo flynnibus posted.

Visually, it's certainly worse at WDW, it's not even close. Going to WDW is simply a rite of passage for the pre-school set, so you get a ton of people from that crowd from all over.

But I would say that in terms of how much the strollers impact space being taken up and walking around, it is not much difference between the parks and possibly worse with DL.

 

[flynnibus]

Folks at DL may put their strollers in tighter places, but the most you'll see is ten to maybe fifteen strollers. It's not like there are thirty, forty strollers in one area. It's a sea of strollers in that photo flynnibus posted.

That picture is just one view which might be difficult to get the scope of if you haven't seen it in person. WDW has put a lot of effort into setting up stroller parking areas and manning the areas with CMs to try to keep their space used efficiently. But instead of seeing an entire walkway blocked like it kind of looks like in that photo.. you see things like entire armies of strollers lined up to the side of the building, etc. But packed in areas like FL don't have a lot of flexibility. So instead of nice benches along a walkway.. now we get 50+ft of stroller parking 2-4 strollers deep.

 

[englanddg]

That picture is just one view which might be difficult to get the scope of if you haven't seen it in person. WDW has put a lot of effort into setting up stroller parking areas and manning the areas with CMs to try to keep their space used efficiently. But instead of seeing an entire walkway blocked like it kind of looks like in that photo.. you see things like entire armies of strollers lined up to the side of the building, etc. But packed in areas like FL don't have a lot of flexibility. So instead of nice benches along a walkway.. now we get 50+ft of stroller parking 2-4 strollers deep.

It wasn't always like that though...that's part of the issue.

 

[Californian Elitist]

That picture is just one view which might be difficult to get the scope of if you haven't seen it in person. WDW has put a lot of effort into setting up stroller parking areas and manning the areas with CMs to try to keep their space used efficiently. But instead of seeing an entire walkway blocked like it kind of looks like in that photo.. you see things like entire armies of strollers lined up to the side of the building, etc. But packed in areas like FL don't have a lot of flexibility. So instead of nice benches along a walkway.. now we get 50+ft of stroller parking 2-4 strollers deep.

Why do they allow this?

 

[spaceghost]

A few points:

• I would (and have) used a stroller at WDW for older children that we would never even consider using a stroller for at home. That's why we've rented strollers there - we didn't have one to bring. There is a lot of walking for, say, a 5 y/o at WDW. Not sure how using a stroller on vacation equates to obese, lazy children... (which my children are not...well not obese anyway. Some days I'm not sure about their work ethic... )
• I think that the comparisons to strollers at DLR are not entirely fair - both DL and DCA are noticeably more compact than at least 3 of the parks in FL. In particular, EPCOT involves a lot of walking. MK is much more spread out vs. DL. DAK is not quite as spread out, but the walking there is not easy walking. The uneven pavement and pathways may make for nice theming, but are not good on the feet and legs.
• Some people pushing strollers through the park are colossal jerks. Some of us are not.
• Bottom line, I'm not going to apologize or feel bad for using a stroller for my children in a family targeted theme park. Sorry.

 

[flynnibus]

Why do they allow this?

Disney just tries to manage the situation.. the strollers are already in the park. I don't know why.. is it the stroller revenue they are addicted to? Do they think it makes people more likely to come? Is it purely a customer service thing? I don't think anymore knows except Disney sure has done a lot of things to ensure the strollers are felt welcome...

 

[flynnibus]

It wasn't always like that though...that's part of the issue.

Not only was it not like this before... but it's been accelerating...

 

[ford91exploder]

Actually, I think we are witnessing an effort to invest in the parks, and to invest in quality. The investments in amenities may not be the $500 million E-tickets we want, but they are investments nevertheless.

I have many criticisms of NFL and of the new bathrooms. But not that they look cheap. Surely, it is in itself commendable that TDO is willing to invest in quality? It is 2013, bathrooms don't need to look as sparse and Spartan as they did in 1973.

All toilet humour aside, an adequate amount of bathrooms, clean, of quality design, adds to the general sense of quality of a theme park. It is very much a decisive difference with the seashore amusement park.


Edit: how on earth did I end up with discussing strollers, nutrition and bathrooms for a hobby? Mother was right, I should've learned a respectable trade!

Like my lawyer buddy, He tells his mom he's a piano player in a house of ill repute...

 

[FloridaRes]

I have been told that manning the stroller parking section (i.e. moving illegally parked strollers to the official areas) is about the worst job you can get. Parents go berserk.

 

[ford91exploder]

Although I know you would like to believe it is as simple as that, you would be wrong. What we eat is only part of the story. There is also the question of quantity, physical issues (thyroid and metabolism) and social issues. To say that the food is poison is just not realistic. How is it a public health issue turned into a personal weakness, how is it not that, when I have the freedom to choose what path I take. You must have a very low opinion of the intelligence level of the American public. Sorry, but that's my decision and, I will not be very happy if the government steps in and starts to tell me what I can and cannot eat. That's carrying the roll of government to levels of power that are just plain unacceptable around here. I won't argue that a lot of the stuff that we have available to us in this country is not the healthiest things we could be pursuing but seriously do you think we just all gather at McDonald's three meals a day, everyday? We all have stoves in our homes and we use them.

As for me...you do know that I am 65 years old don't you. When I was a kid they didn't even have such a thing as McDonald's. I am the "your grandparents" that you are talking about. All meals were home cooked and without many preservatives or "poisons" as you are so fond of saying. Yet I had weight issues. I guess it was something other then "poisons" that did me in.

Look we all know that some people are genetically predisposed to becoming overweight - its especially prevalent in pacific islanders and others who have had thousands of years of feast-famine nutrition cycles in their case its a survival trait. The problem here is what 'Big Food' has been doing to the american diet and High Fructose Corn Syrup HFCS is one of the key reasons for the obesity epidemic. Fructose or 'Fruit Sugar' has a marvelous adaptation in that mammals have no satiety reflex for this sugar works well for fruits as it means fruit will be eaten and seeds spread.

Back when I was growing up which was not that long ago, Sugar was used as a sweetener I'm sure we all remember no Coke before dinner it will spoil your appetite - Guess what Mom was RIGHT because the glucose receptor in the brain says enough glucose - stop eating, With HFCS no such response occurs and you consume much more sugar that you would normally,

As an experiment Get some 'Minute Maid Lemonaide (with HCFS) and some 'Simply Lemonaide' and try to see how much you can drink before feeling 'full' (on different days of course)

Most people will be able to drink a glass or two of the Simply Lemonade but they can finish the whole Minute Maid. Difference of course is the form of sugar used Fructose vs Glucose (cane sugar) and THIS is the root of the whole obesity epidemic.

People today are not fat because of character weakness but in large part due to their diet, which of course makes getting out and exercising even more important and getting in the habit of walking.

 

[WDWFanDave]

Thought I'd check in here with a quick note about the Magic Bands...tried to use with a pin to make purchases...you know-the monetization of the project to justify it...didn't work at all. Tried for Emporium purchase, Gastons purchase, and even for dinner at Crystal Palace. Works to open the room door, park entry and FPP. Guess we will see how the rest of the trip goes.

 

[Magenta Panther]

I LOATHE strollers. ESPECIALLY when they're used for kids far too old for them. To those parents who misuse strollers...thanks for crapping up the landscape at WDW.

 

[PhotoDave219]

This is exactly why I was saying its highly subjective. Everyone has their own thinking and their own reasons for doing what they do. Every kid is very different even within the same family. It's a slippery slope when we start judging other people based on our own opinions and lifestyles. Who gets to make up the rules?

Yeah but there's one thing to criticize what people eat/drink.... Its another to comment/question/openly mock someone bringing supplies for an army platoon or more inside a stroller/lorrey/small truck into a theme park.

Its a damn theme park. You dont need to nest while youre there and you certainly dont need that much food....

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I grew up on a farm with 4 brothers and 2 sisters. we grew/raised all of our own food, and with that many mouths to feed, we sure didn't have large portions at any meal. We worked hard, played hard, and didn't sit around all day - ever. But even so, I always battled a weight issue, as did one of my brothers, while the other 5 of us did not. same food - same lifestyle, different outcomes. It happens.

I know of seven siblings who all smoked. Two died of lungcancer, one at 48 and the other at 62. Five lived to ripe old age. This shows smoking doesn't kill.

In other words, to say that modern processed American foods cause obesity does not mean that everybody reacts the same way to the same food, always, to the exclusion of all other factors. It merely points out one factor. A factor that becomes very clear when the anecdote is changed for large scale data.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

Although I know you would like to believe it is as simple as that, you would be wrong. What we eat is only part of the story. There is also the question of quantity, physical issues (thyroid and metabolism) and social issues. To say that the food is poison is just not realistic. How is it a public health issue turned into a personal weakness, how is it not that, when I have the freedom to choose what path I take. You must have a very low opinion of the intelligence level of the American public. Sorry, but that's my decision and, I will not be very happy if the government steps in and starts to tell me what I can and cannot eat. That's carrying the roll of government to levels of power that are just plain unacceptable around here. I won't argue that a lot of the stuff that we have available to us in this country is not the healthiest things we could be pursuing but seriously do you think we just all gather at McDonald's three meals a day, everyday? We all have stoves in our homes and we use them.

As for me...you do know that I am 65 years old don't you. When I was a kid they didn't even have such a thing as McDonald's. I am the "your grandparents" that you are talking about. All meals were home cooked and without many preservatives or "poisons" as you are so fond of saying. Yet I had weight issues. I guess it was something other then "poisons" that did me in.

I think you misunderstand. I have a high opinion of the American public. And a very low one of your food industry and its Washington lobby.

Personal anecdote does not negate the statistic about an US obesity epidemic. This epidemic is not the result of personal choice as the Washington lobby would have you believe, but of a lack of personal choice. When presented with the choice to be overweight, or not, people choose the first. They are simply withheld the easonable means and options. If you buy normal food for a normal family at a normal supermarket that you prepare in a normal way, you get overweight in America. But not in Germany, Korea, Italy. Or America until recently. It nowadays takes superhuman effort to stay slim in America.

In America I gain a kilo a week. In France I lose a kilo a week. I am the same person eating the same amount.

[Thus ends today's course of 'how to lose friends and alienate people' 101 - talk endlessly about Big Food, the Washington lobby, and obesity rates!]

 

[The Empress Lilly]

Well, you could, but it's hard to come up with a place that is as fantastic for a 3 year old to visit as a Disney park. It's particularly cool to take them in the nice 2.5-3 year old window when they are free to go to the parks (and free for buffets like character meals) and still can enjoy a ton or rides and shows and have great memories. Heck, some stuff like the Disney Jr on stage is basically directed towards the preschool set.

Also, when they are preschool, you can be much more flexible in terms of times to visit and going off season when it's not crowded, since missing school isn't an issue.

I would say from my friends/family/associates that when the oldest child is about 4-6 years old is a typical time frame for people to plan a big WDW trip.

I can tell kids between two to three often have lots of fun at Disney Parks (c). But do they have more fun than they would at a local amusement fair, or a sandbox, or a visit to 'mad uncle' William?

There is fun, but there is also a lot at WDW that isn't fun for the youngest: a punishing climate (being north European, I need to dress kids in Florida as if it were winter, lest they die of suncancer), being dragged around all day long, no escape from the busy atmosphere and people, stressed parents, sometimes unpleasant experiences that are too scary or too loud. Etc. Pre-school at Disney is fun, but not as much fun as it is made out to be, and for many kids barely worth it, or worse.