Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

[ford91exploder]

I can't speak to others, but Ricky Brigante (who came up specifically) tends to say on his podcast if he paid, was comped, received a free review copy, etc.

And that's all that is necessary to say in my opinion, Just like at press events with sandwiches and soft drinks "Light refreshments were served to the press corps"

 

[Goofyernmost]

I am not outraged. I would totally take free stuff and write reviews if I had a blog and it was offered, but I'm too lazy so that's not going to happen. I would also admit that I did it. To take stuff, write good reviews without mentioning said free stuff, and then act outraged when you get called on it is silly.

Not if there is no legitimate reason to get called on it. Let's say you did that and you didn't feel as though you have done anything wrong, which I assume you would because you just said that you would totally take free stuff. If you felt that it was wrong enough that you might have to disclose it...why would you have taken it to begin with?

 

[janoimagine]

I can't speak to others, but Ricky Brigante (who came up specifically) tends to say on his podcast if he paid, was comped, received a free review copy, etc.

I have listened to several and cant say I recall hearing disclosures ... however I can say that on his site you will not find anything that remotely resembles one, be it in his DVD reviews, or food, or event reviews.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I don't think many of us commenting care that bloggers got swag that we did not, Speaking for myself I care about the payola aspect much more, Kevin Yee is hardly a 'doom-n-gloom' guy yet he was the only one with the INTEGRITY to report that Disney was giving away Alcohol/Food/Swag at their blogger event.

When I was a press photographer at many press events sandwiches and soft drinks were served and the reporters dutifully mentioned 'light refreshments were served at the event' no biggie and the food and drink was bait to get the reporters and photogs to show up,

Lets face it if you have two presser's and one is known for having food and soft drinks which one are you going to attend as opposed to the one held outdoors with no shade or water.

I'm just going to ask a couple questions. Isn't payola an up front payment to get things to go the way one wants it too? How is non-guaranteed, previously not announced, after the fact gift giving payola and not appreciation gifts. You don't bribe someone after they have given you what they want do you? And lets say you do opt for the food and drinks instead of the bugs and sunshine, does that necessarily mean that you will tow the company line no matter what?

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

If you were planning a trip to a place you haven't been before (so, you're now the rube. Just play along for a minute, ok?) would you rather

A) check out a handful a websites that come up first on a google search saying how awesome everything about your destination is. How great the pillows are, the pools are the perfect temp, crowds are low and not rowdy, and there's absolutely no problems with anything breaking down ever and everything smells like fresh baked cinnamon buns,

or

B) would you rather check out a handful of websites that come up first on a google search that gives it to you straight? Watch out for the little kids that like to hide and play around the slide at the pool, the food at the diner isn't so great so save your $50 and eat elsewhere, rides that are most likely to break down often or rides that need a fp as soon as you enter the park because they're too crowded... A heads up about the excessive EVC and stroller usage and steer clear of the first parade because the second isn't so packed


?

I mean. Really. This is what it boils down to. The websites posting all of the pluses and none of the minuses I can just about guarantee are getting a "gift bag" "swag" or some sort of pay off (sorry, no matter what you choose to call it, its a payoff) from said company/destination than the ones who tell you what's actually going on.



Now can we please get off this stupid, inane topic?

 

[alphac2005]

How do you know? Most of them were blogging way before any perks and many blog without any perks period

....but, most of these sites are now "big" operations and income and perks are now their lifeblood. Without them, nearly all of the site owners don't have a pot to in. If you've created a well enough known site that you basically don't have to hold a real job and your income comes from Google AdSense royalties and other ad networks, you're certainly not going to slam Disney because they can easy take away the access and what they do in many cases of turning a blind eye to obvious copyright ownership violations. Some of the jokers that @WDW1974 has mentioned that sell all sorts of DVDs and merchandise in any other universe would have a lawsuit thrown on them, so there isn't a chance in the world that these bloggers will want to tempt fate.

These people have turned Disney into not only a fanboi crazyhouse, but a business built on a house of cards (great series, BTW) and at any given moment, the Mouse can end the lifestylers, well, lifestyles.

 

[Clamman73]

I can't speak to others, but Ricky Brigante (who came up specifically) tends to say on his podcast if he paid, was comped, received a free review copy, etc.

Yes, like in his recently posted review of California Grill, he mentions the gift card and says it had no influence on his opinion of the food and service.

 

[crispy]

Not if there is no legitimate reason to get called on it. Let's say you did that and you didn't feel as though you have done anything wrong, which I assume you would because you just said that you would totally take free stuff. If you felt that it was wrong enough that you might have to disclose it...why would you have taken it to begin with?

I am not sure I am following your question, but I think I know what you are asking. If I received free stuff to review, I would feel that disclosing that would be the ethical thing to do. As I said, I don't think it's necessarily wrong for them to receive free stuff because I see it as marketing tool. Disclosure and openness is key if you want to maintain any credibility.

As a background, I used to work for a government agency where we were forbidden to take freebies or gifts so I tend to be sensitive about things like this. If someone tried to offer me a gift, I always reported it to a superior just to cover my rear-end.

 

[raymusiccity]

You and every other person on planet Earth.

.......oh, ye of little faith.

What about Toy Story 2 ; Toy Story 3 ? .... Not too shabbily reviewed by everyone on earth.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I am not sure I am following your question, but I think I know what you are asking. If I received free stuff to review, I would feel that disclosing that would be the ethical thing to do. As I said, I don't think it's necessarily wrong for them to receive free stuff because I see it as marketing tool. Disclosure and openness is key if you want to maintain any credibility.

As a background, I used to work for a government agency where we were forbidden to take freebies or gifts so I tend to be sensitive about things like this. If someone tried to offer me a gift, I always reported it to a superior just to cover my rear-end.

OK, but what I am obviously missing is why anyone thinks that a blogger is in need of credibility. They are, well, blogging about their passion. There is no legal or moral or policy that dictates that they must tell you what motivates them to say what they say. What they project is enthusiasm and their unique perspective about the subject matter. No one has asked them to put their right hand on the bible. They express themselves as they feel it, for whatever reason that they feel it and all the rest of us have absolutely no reason to take everything they say as gospel. In fact, we would be the ones lacking in credibility if we did. How irresponsible can we be anyway, and how many ways must our butts be saved from ourselves by others. Seriously!

 

[alphac2005]

Here's a way to look at this:

If there is something that would make a visit personally better for your family, something that they could change that would make it more enjoyable? Safer? Cleaner? More affordable? You'd like to see it happen - even if the experience in the parks overall is still overwhelmingly positive for you. Because not only would you have an even better time, but making something better means they aren't allowing it go get worse (sounds wierd to type that, but doing nothing about a problem usually doesn't result a problem staying static - it tends to get worse).

With access to an audience who wants to learn about WDW... while keeping the overall tone positive, working in some constructive critisism. Encourage guests to enjoy the parks, either as a first timer or as a repeat. But put a bug in their ear that it can be a little better and if they make that improvement the second trip will be better than the first. And that there are ways that a guest can express their desire for something to be improved so the 2nd trip is better than the 1st.

And if others who provide a 'overwhelmingly positive' view on the net get on the act and do the same (esp. if it's co-ordinated around something specific, like say, cleanliness), that's a huge incentive for them to act on it...

I'd like to add a little here because I think you have many great points. I listened to Ricky for many years and it became increasingly obvious at times that he's holding back whether it's conscience or subconscious because of the line that he walks or that he is afraid of crossing. I truly believe that Ricky was a hardcore fan that did this as a hobby just as Michelle states and it grew into something bigger. One of the differences that I've found with Ricky is that he truly has talent as a writer and clearly the digital media aspect. What disappoints me is that clearly sees issues, but he holds back and I think it's obvious that the line doesn't want to be crossed.

Here's something else to chew on as well, if you think about Disney and the general main stream media press, their model has always been built on a unbelievably positive coverage and for good reason, payola, but not in a true form and therefore broadcasters and journalists turn a blind eye. Your worldwide press coming to a park opening gets flown in and put up at no expense. It's part of the formula to get unwarranted (and at a time warranted) positive free press coverage advertising.

I constantly see ways that my company can improve and welcome feedback from our customers and others in the business. The problem with the Mouse is that they've had decades of spoils in the media from a hometown paper that does nothing but shovel their b.s. onto the readers and hole in the wall television affiliates fawning over their latest magical whatever because they got a tidy little trip. I couldn't sit there and hold back because of being unsure of what access would be lost. Venues like Ricky's are tools for the Mouse and are used by the Mouse as free advertising and nothing more. Ricky has a very polished looking product and he keeps on giving the Mouse pretty well traffic webpages, YouTube videos, etc., at no cost to them.

This all boils down to bloggers and journalists. As someone who was in the true field of journalism, it nauseates me. People that shill for a company in order to get things or access, are just that, shills or fanbois that think they're journalists. It's an insult to the true professionals akin to a reality star that thinks that they are a true actor or just like some dude that buys a rack of toys from Toys 'R' Us and puts them on eBay and he considers himself a business owner.

 

[crispy]

OK, but what I am obviously missing is why anyone thinks that a blogger is in need of credibility. They are, well, blogging about their passion. There is no legal or moral or policy that dictates that they must tell you what motivates them to say what they say. What they project is enthusiasm and their unique perspective about the subject matter. No one has asked them to put their right hand on the bible. They express themselves as they feel it, for whatever reason that they feel it and all the rest of us have absolutely no reason to take everything they say as gospel. In fact, we would be the ones lacking in credibility if we did. How irresponsible can we be anyway, and how many ways must our butts be saved from ourselves by others. Seriously!

I think when you call yourself an expert on something then you do indeed need credibility. I don't read a lot of Disney blogs (or really many blogs at all), but there is one that I have enjoyed in the past. The blog started as a labor of love, but now it has pretty much become a paid advertisement for Disney. Everything is "fabulous" and "amazing." Reviews no longer mention good and bad - everything is "great!". I don't feel like it's this person's passion anymore, it's their job. Instead of getting a real feel for the Disney experience, I am reading a marketing piece. So, yes, I think this person has lost credibility and I think their site has lost what made it compelling in the beginning.

 

[Nubs70]

The purpose of a journalist is to provide critical analysis, report the good and bad. If a journalist (or blogger) accepts swag, discloses swag, and still provides critical analysis, they are showing integrity. A journalist or blogger that accepts swag, fails to disclose and fails to provide critical analysis but provides a sloven one sided positive analysis, akin to the services provided by Linda Lovelace, that person is a shill.

 

[Turtle]

is more than they've done on the mine train...

 

[lebeau]

Yes I am banned. Laugh it up.

Wait. If I was banned I could not write this. Weird.

 

[Nubs70]

And I've worked for those organizations in my case government and university , Oddly enough the same rules never apply to those at the top only those who actually work for a living.

Strange how the Cx0 can go to the Superbowl and be in the company 'hospitality suite' but a lowly tech will get fired for accepting a hat, I was quite a bit higher in that food chain but still low enough the gifts rule applied.

I can give about example of this.

A company I was working for instructed me to put out a closed bid for a chemical supply for our facility. I notified the five largest suppliers which included the incumbent. All suppliers contacted performed trials and submitted results and pricing. One supplier was even a good friend with I had worked with for years at a previous employer.

At this point was my 6 month review for which I was rewarded with a 10% raise.

After reviewing the trial results of each supplier in respect to performance and pricing, I submitted my recommendation which was neither the incumbent or my friend. A week later, I am summoned to HR and informed that I am not meeting expectations, frog marched out of the building, and into my 2nd rye and coke by 11:30 am.

Come to find out, they selected the incumbent. I also found out that the VP of Manufacturing had been receiving a week long, all expense paid, vacation to Vegas for years courtesy of the incumbent. Had I known that, it would have saved me a lot of trouble.

 

[flynnibus]

No, but I'm not going to get into the Flynnibus circle of simply repeating everything, but with more words - so I'll let you have whatever last word you want. But, no. No. And no.

So it's my fault people can't articulate themselves accurately? Pfft

More like people don't like their generalizations being challenged and can't face their justifications being torn apart. I know what people are TRYING to say.. but the truth is they are starting with conclusions and then working backwards to make up 'rules' to make it work. But their justifications and broad strokes don't actually work. They'd rather sit with "I know because I know!!" instead of actually having a rational basis.

There is something they believe... and their conclusion probably is not wrong.. they just can't properly ID why that is. It's like the ancients knowing the Sun was going to come up everyday... but they thought it was because the Sun went around the earth. Their 'end game' was right... the sun was going to come up.. but WHY was all wrong.

People get upset when their justifications don't line up because it confuses them... "I know it doesn't work over there, but it works over here!" - simplifications that draw wrong conclusions when applied elsewhere.. because the underlying principle is wrong. It may line up with a correct answer from time to time... (the sun did come up!) but that doesn't make it right.

 

[ThemeParkJunkee]

I think when you call yourself an expert on something then you do indeed need credibility. I don't read a lot of Disney blogs (or really many blogs at all), but there is one that I have enjoyed in the past. The blog started as a labor of love, but now it has pretty much become a paid advertisement for Disney. Everything is "fabulous" and "amazing." Reviews no longer mention good and bad - everything is "great!". I don't feel like it's this person's passion anymore, it's their job. Instead of getting a real feel for the Disney experience, I am reading a marketing piece. So, yes, I think this person has lost credibility and I think their site has lost what made it compelling in the beginning.

This is my feeling. I read Disney Blogs and Message boards for a year or two leading up to a trip. I have been doing so off and on since the late 1990's. I do searches for specific information and have found this board as a result. Many "blogs" and some message boards have seemed to have transformed from tips and helpful information to cheerleading squads. Where complete sentences with thoughtful words once were, buzzwords such as "Magical", "Amazing", "Fantastic" have been substituted. Whenever there is more than one exclamation point in a description...I know not to pay attention anymore.

 

[flynnibus]

Come to find out, they selected the incumbent. I also found out that the VP of Manufacturing had been receiving a week long, all expense paid, vacation to Vegas for years. Had I known that, it would have saved me a lot of trouble.

Don't rock the boat!!!

Nothing ed me off more than choices like that made for all the wrong reasons. I never managed to stay in those roles long either but *knock on wood* I've never gotten the boot for calling out the BS... tho I've been lucky enough to not have to deal with outright fraud/embezzlement either.

 

[Clever Name]

Not always, and no offense taken... but I mainly blog to leave my family a journal of sorts. Something fun to laugh about after I'm gone. You know, my Disney park concept art obsession and my love of Karen Carpenter!

It's like a Kodak slide show collection! Most likely by the time you're gone, your family and others will look back at the Internet as a worthless and ancient technological boondoggle. It will be nothing but Facebook, Twitter and other such wastes.