Spaceship in Spaceship Earth

[Expo_Seeker40]

Well I still want to use a source and say the reason why we don't have these pieces in storage is because they don't truly exist anymore in whole.

Both the cyndrical satelite and solar panneled satelite along with both astronauts were taken down during the 1994 rehab. They were completely disasambled in anticipation of a "plussing" to make them more up to date aka what happened with the new 1994 earth projection. Money, time, etc caused them to never come back. They were probably thrown out or made it into the homes of some CM's or Imagineers in small portions. It would be more of a pain in the @$$ to hide them, paint them black which would ruin them...or try to hide them. Neither of them are there! I highly doubt they are anywhere up there or in storage. It is plenty bright enough up there now to atleast see that neither of them is there.

The moonrock pieces have always been there and have served their purpose. It's really the space station overhang roof that was tried to be hidden with all the pink and white track lighting removed, star effects removed, etc.

I can't believe the "Object" in the shaft is NOT the window. It's got to be. There is nothing there that even indicated where another window would be then you factor in the theory that it probably is the window...and it has the extension off of the tube that probably held the arm for the satelite...which I believe.

I think we have solved the whole 180top set piece puzzel.

The eleborate moon colony, space station set never came about. Only the moonrock work and the space station shaft came about in a simple form.

The space station constited of an AA girl inside a window...my opinion THE window that we see in the shaft. The space station overhang roof had lighting on it. The solar paneled satelite was in the shaft.

The cyndrical satelite was just outside the shaft not too far away.

The earth projection was different.

:brick: :dazzle: ahhhhh all this 180top stuff makes my head "spin" and rotate backwards for my return to earth. :hammer:

P.S. Also consider when viewing the footage of 180top 1993 or 1994...the lens and equipment being used versus the lens and equipment beanboon used to document 180top. As I see it the girl is in the window. The window frame is vertical rectangular, but her actual portion where she is...is at the bottom of the rectangle and cropped by a cover piece. The cameraman in my opinion simply views the satelite and then tilts his camera backwards in his seat to view the window then quickly brings it back to view the pink track lighting. This completely matches what I experience in january. The best time to view the window is when you have just gone under the floating television in space. That's what the cameraman could have done, but with the satelite being so noticeable he filmed that instead and then realizing where this other bright light source was coming from, quickly filmed the window before going back to a frontal view...we then quickly pass under the window....through the door, and into the tomorrow's child sequence.

 

[jasondiff]

i think you might be on to something with the girl location. a few posts back someone mention the frame around her was wider (like a 4 x 3) or something and the tube is 3 x 4 high looking.

I mentioned that earlier with my post and included a modified graphic of Martin's where I proposed a different location for the window.

But I just watched Jeff's DVD again (and again and again). The window the girl is in is definitely tall. The top third or so of the window has nothing in it, so the window doesn't look so tall. But there is a point where the red track lighting reflects off the window, and you can see it is actually pretty tall.

It is also noticeable from the video that the window is not vertical, the top actually tilts out quite a bit, I'd say a 20-30 degree angle.

So based on the video it seems the window could be in that spaceship, it is actually the right size. But, it doesn't look like the former window space is angled enough to be the window with the girl. I'm going to try to get a screen capture to post here to show what I'm trying to say.

Edit: here are the screen captures. The first one is when you first see the window in the video, and the second one is right before she goes out of view (i.e. you go right under her if the window is indeed in the rocket-thingy).

 

[jasondiff]

And finally, Houston - we have a problem. I hope Jeffs DVD footage helps with this (and hope to see for myself soon!) but I agree with an earlier point raised; it would seem the girl isn`t where we thought she was. Watching the footage again, as the camera angle shifts as the car moves, we pass completley infront of her and to her left (our right) - something that`d be impossible if she was directly above the descent ramp. With this theory she`d need to be to the east of the cone shape. Not sure where exactly - roughly where the white square is in the pic below. ARGH!

Martin,
It's so hard to tell from Jeff's footage but it actually looks like you *might* be going directly under her. The camera pans away too soon to be certain, but it's definitely possible. I know this goes against the thoery I proposed earlier and you are also now thinking possible. There's just not a lot of stuff (stars, reflections, anything) in the video to be able to tell just how far the camera pans between the satellite and the window.

What's also quite confusing to me from the video is where the red track lighting is in relation to the window. One would think as you decend backwards it would come into the top of the screen, but in the footage it comes in from the bottom.

 

[DubyooDeeDubyoo]

You know that serial killer in CSI who makes little miniatures of his murder scenes? I imagine he must have started one day making a little replica of 180top to show where everything was, and then went mad with frustration.

For the life of me I really don't remember any sort of window in the area Marni has highlighted, and I looked it over pretty hard. Then again, though, I do remember right below that area was a bunch of black rock/boulder style shapes, and I think a few hid some speakers. I can't imagine them placing show elements on the floor in front of a blank wall, so it could be very possible that she was sitting in that wall and looking out to the repair going on in the center-ceiling in the room, with the space station theming continuing all the way back to the cylinder shape on the wall.

I rode Irons enough times two weeks ago to pretty much have a photographic memory of everything I could swivel my head to look at, but watching the Cronkite version there's just so many things that don't make sense, not just because the effects have changed and the mirrors covered up, the Irons descent just seems so much more legitimately claustrophobic, like they actually brought the whole ceiling down a foot.

What room is this pictured above? It's the only piece of the finale that doesn't seem to be swarmed with mirrors so I can mentally "place" myself in Irons.

 

[marni1971]

I wish I could say the girl was in the window as we thought; it`d make things so much easier. I agree I don`t see how she could be to the right of the cylinder either. Unless it`s a parallax trick and (certainly in my video) being sat in the left seat suggests we go further past her than we actually did.

Regarding the missing props, could it be possible the `extended track` mentioned before was intended for the `94 rehab, but as mentioned the building wouldn`t take it? This would be why it`s not on any original layouts and why the props were removed so construction could begin? There is of course a possibility the prop parts are lying up on the projection deck, out of eyeline. Unless you actually walk up there, behind the core, you wouldn`t be able to see them. The only ways out for them would have been via the elevator on 115ft level, meaning carrying them down the ascent tunnel by hand, or indeed riding them down on the Omnimover. For this we really need a full, lights on , walking tour

jasondiff; the red strips would have been opposite the window, on the other side of the core.

I`ve watched Marks video again and again, and tried to plot where the window goes as he turns to the strips. I want to agree the girl is in the cylinder above the track. Everything says it is, apart from the parallax issue. I might just ignore it and go back to our original theory that she`s in the cylinder. There`s more proof saying she was than she wasn`t.

And lying in bed I had a thought (yes, I am that sad... Valentines Day and I`m thinking of 180top... sorry, Michelle!) - it`s quite apparent now so I apologise for those who made the connection earlier. The large satellite is in the docking bay of the spacestation since it`s under repair. The robot arm is attatched to the station. I always assumed it was from an unseen (and unbuilt) space shuttle or similar. The girl is indeed watching the repairs (said the Disney blurb) since it`s in her space station. Sorry I didn`t catch up with this sooner!

I`ve also a theory the `moon rocks` were from the original pre-opening idea of the station-under-construction that didn`t work. They were left up there, but not used and emphasis shifted to making it appear you were orbiting the earth and not on the moons surface. Kind of makes sense since I can`t see how satellites and a space station would be only a few feet above the lunar surface - even with incorrect forced perspective.

Dubyoo - this room (with rotating purple gobos) was the first room after leaving the `visual` core - right now I`d place it just around the classroom screen. I`m also working on a before and after comparisson.

BTW; Omnispace, welcome!

 

[kcnole]

Every possible answer seems to cause 10 more questions...:veryconfu

I propose we send this thread in as a possible episode of "Lost".

 

[joel_maxwell]

Regarding the missing props, could it be possible the `extended track` mentioned before was intended for the `94 rehab, but as mentioned the building wouldn`t take it? This would be why it`s not on any original layouts and why the props were removed so construction could begin? There is of course a possibility the prop parts are lying up on the projection deck, out of eyeline. Unless you actually walk up there, behind the core, you wouldn`t be able to see them. The only ways out for them would have been via the elevator on 115ft level, meaning carrying them down the ascent tunnel by hand, or indeed riding them down on the Omnimover. For this we really need a full, lights on , walking tour

And lying in bed I had a thought (yes, I am that sad... Valentines Day and I`m thinking of 180top... sorry, Michelle!) - it`s quite apparent now so I apologise for those who made the connection earlier. The large satellite is in the docking bay of the spacestation since it`s under repair. The robot arm is attatched to the station. I always assumed it was from an unseen (and unbuilt) space shuttle or similar. The girl is indeed watching the repairs (said the Disney blurb) since it`s in her space station. Sorry I didn`t catch up with this sooner

do we have a photo of this extended track yet? can this be on the mission list for the photo shoot tomorrow?

ahhh, dont beat yourself up. i actually checked the thread once i got home and posted, made sam understand the importance of the thread and showed her all the images posted through the 25 pages (super romantic) and we watched AI and alabama almost beat florida.

 

[beanboon]

It's not a boom lift, it's an aerial work platform (it goes straight up).

I don't think that kind of lift can go directly up very well in the first place.

Maybe we can convince Siemens to move SSE back in time a little for it's next makeover? How far back should we go? So far back that the CM is in the top spinning guests' cars around?

 

[Captain Hank]

Regarding the missing props, could it be possible the `extended track` mentioned before was intended for the `94 rehab, but as mentioned the building wouldn`t take it? This would be why it`s not on any original layouts and why the props were removed so construction could begin? There is of course a possibility the prop parts are lying up on the projection deck, out of eyeline. Unless you actually walk up there, behind the core, you wouldn`t be able to see them. The only ways out for them would have been via the elevator on 115ft level, meaning carrying them down the ascent tunnel by hand, or indeed riding them down on the Omnimover. For this we really need a full, lights on , walking tour

As far as I can remember, there wasn't really anything up on the projection deck, aside from the two Earth projectors, the star projector, and the lift (which looked very similar to what beanboon shows in his picture).

 

[beanboon]

Some more pictures:

This is looking into what would have been the big moon scene. You can see the cables from the projection screen coming in from the left. No satellites here.

This looking backwards and up just past the projection screen. Notice the mist nozzles and all of the water damage. I don't know what the shape is in front of it, but it is mentioned in one of Marni's drawings.

Looking at where the satellite may have been, no evidence shows up here. The classroom scene is to the left and the rocket behind and above you.

Was the smaller capsule mounted here? This is staircase 11 with new platform decking at vehicle level. I imagine this was added in case the staircase around the corner was to be used for an evac instead of going along the access along the track. This platform could be covering up a larger mount that would make more sense for this capsule. Anyway, this is where F-61 is shown on the original plans.

I believe this is what illuminated the larger satellite. It's all rusty as the misters dripped on it. I would bet it is a UV light as the satellite was very dimly lit.

This is looking towards the projection screen, the ride cars behind you are barely visible in the bottom of the picture. The curved shape shown earlier is visible here, above that is where the laser still is, there is a fan visible that was to probably move the mist around better and the screen is off in the distance.

 

[mousermerf]

ooking towards the projection screen, the ride cars behind you are barely visible in the bottom of the picture. The curved shape shown earlier is visible here, above that is where the laser still is, there is a fan visible that was to probably move the mist around better and the screen is off in the distance.

*squints* I think I see myself in that picture..

Anywho, If i recall correctly, the lazer pointed at the curved shaped, creating a fan-like effect.

 

[joel_maxwell]

great shots beanboon... that is a great flash. the photo with the mister damage is one that intrigues me the most. secondly, the pic of 180top platform (pic 1) wow, what a mess up there.

are you going back in for another round. if so, do you think your light could illumniate the ceiling and end my curiousity of which tile on the membrane opens and how it functions.

once again, great shots.

 

[Expo_Seeker40]

Wow.....am I bored or what....thanks beenboon for the pics! Yeah I'd love to see what the entire space station overhang roof looks like. Now we know what the walls look like, and we got the backside of it in your previous pictures of the overhang roof and window.....this is the most mysterious and dusty area in all of Epcot lol.

 

[marni1971]

Beanboon, great pics, as always! What a mess the mister made... interetsing why they didn`t take a smoke/mist based route. Probably too uncontrolable - a few puffs towards the Earth and the projection direction would be highlighted perhaps? Also, in the stair11 pic, it looks like a support strut sticking up out of the floor - kind of a hollow tube where a support tube could slot in, like scaffholding?

Expo, your diagrams are showing me up

I`m working on the media footage. I have completed a side-by side comparisson of 86 and 94, accurate to within a few feet or so. One thing that strikes me is the current positioning of the screens on the descent. I never made the connection, but they are higher than I thought; both in the `open` top of the core. I`ve done (yet) another plan below...

I`m certain of the red strip position and orientation. This also helps tie in the satellites postion. Note the track curve; on closer inspection of the core wall shape relative to the track I noticed this. You do actually partially go `past` the window position before coming back to it`s center (hence the video images of going `past` the AA. I may be slightly off with the `94 positions, but for the space needed, and with comparisson to the 86 footage, the classroom has to be up in the core roof, just before the cone. There`s just no space for it until around the 62ft mark, where the dioramas begin. This would place the news screen before it - either as marked, or between the marked news position and the classroom position. Perhaps the news position I`ve marked is the 2nd, now removed screen? Or was the 2nd screen between the current (marked) one and the classroom?

 

[mousermerf]

Umm.. no...

Merf has to now upload merf's pics.

Merf has pics of the New's screen where you can clearly see reference points (the exit signs and a light that illuminates the track) from two angles and it's much closer to stairway 11, methinks.

 

[mousermerf]

BTW, merf was in that car barely visible ahead of beanboon's pics and took the photo's of the rear of the screen just before he took the photo of the back of merf's car.

Merf was not into the core quite yet, just before the screen, and thinks of the groundplan, the long straight piece is the "drop" into the core.

 

[PBarton]

Wow - some realy great pictures there!

Just wondering..

Does anyone know what the accoustics are like in 180 top? Has anyone been up there when the ride has stopped, with all the sound effects and music silenced?

What would it sound like if you shouted something? I bet it echos like crazy..

Spaceship Earth must be several feet deep in dust at the bottom of the ride lol.

 

[marni1971]

Umm.. no...

Merf has to now upload merf's pics.

Merf has pics of the New's screen where you can clearly see reference points (the exit signs and a light that illuminates the track) from two angles and it's much closer to stairway 11, methinks.

What... the news screen is more in 180top than in the core? DO upload

 

[jasondiff]

Wow - some realy great pictures there!

Just wondering..

Does anyone know what the accoustics are like in 180 top? Has anyone been up there when the ride has stopped, with all the sound effects and music silenced?

What would it sound like if you shouted something? I bet it echos like crazy..

Spaceship Earth must be several feet deep in dust at the bottom of the ride lol.

I think there's a lot of soundproofing material all over the walls, throughout the ride, although you certainly can hear the "Your time machine is about to rotate for your return to earth" quite a distance away.

 

[joel_maxwell]

What... the news screen is more in 180top than in the core? DO upload

martin, since i just went recently, i remember the classroom scene monitor being right on the left (as you have it) but a little farther down. if memory serves i think it is 10 or so feet more down the decent. im looking for merfs pics to help me out on this.