Soul at Epcot

[Goofyernmost]

Frozen should have had an original new story, not just cutting and pasting scenes. It's lazy and boring, but hey people love it. Why not create a new adventure story with the same cast.......oh that might cost more money, nope. The masses wont care anyway, they will line up for hours for this joke of a ride.
Maelstrom was like every other ride-movie in the pavilion, about the country. It was nothing mindblowing but it kept you in the world showcase, it kept you feeling like you were on a world tour, it kept Epcot different than any other theme park on the planet.
Frozen just started WDW on a slope of dumming down its previous standards just to cram more IP junk down our throats. To sell more merch and Dusney plus subscriptions. And the sheep are loving this new trend.
God forbid you learn something new about a country or history.

So your saying that this is so boring that people love it? Could it be that you don't like it therefore it is awful and shouldn't be there. Cut and Paste? OK, ask yourself how often you have ridden SSE. That has been basically the same story for the past 39 years. Talk about boring, but yet people just keep going to it. And I would bet that you would be one of the first to aggressively hate any change. You cannot say it is full time exciting and that they couldn't think up a new story or purpose to make it less boring. So it boils down to what people that pay to get in like and their numbers. The place has to be built for the majority or it will close completely. It is easy for someone that does not like it to just walk on by the attraction. No one is forced to go to it. If, as you say, "hey, people love it" So maybe it isn't as bad as you are trying to tell us. I have been a WDW fan for 36 years and there are attractions that I haven't been to for 20+ years. Why? Because, those attractions did not appeal to me personally, so I didn't have a desire to see them, but I have yet to demand that they do it differently.

Disney started dumbing down Epcot in the late 80's. Why because the hidden teaching goal was not pulling in the numbers they needed too survive. They tried to simplify the edutainment for those that didn't want to be enlightened and they did OK, but did make some major mistakes. Imagination, I'm looking at you! They managed to change that so it was no longer educational and no longer entertaining. That place is like watching a major store go out of business.

Frozen brought that Pavilion back to life when it was taking it's last breath. I feel that they did the right thing and that we, the fans, are overthinking the situation and misidentifying what a positive change is when we see one.

 

[eliza61nyc]

But at what cost?? You get something a lot less true to form.. a Frozen ride that feels shoehorned in with no real captivating or interesting story. It’s just, “lets go see Elsa in her ice castle, but on the way, lets see some characters along the sides just singing the songs out of context where they don’t fit in with the story.”. Like it isn’t even implemented to truly fit the ride. The update/enhance route would’ve been a lot better in that case. With that you could’ve made it a lot more exciting without ruining the original intent & nature of it all. But yeah..
And when it comes to Great Movie Ride, again, same thing... probably could’ve been updated to feature other movies too..

I mean, it’s one thing if even the original concept there never worked there to begin with. In that case, replacing it entirely would make sense. But in the case that it worked initially (like say the original Journey Into Imagination), but became bad after trying to completely redo the ride, replacing everything that made it great initially with an unfitting film IP & a bunch of cheap props & effects (Journey Into Your Imagination) and then redoing it again, keeping 99% of the bad elements with only 1 or 2 elements of the original shoehorned in with no proper context or utilization (Journey Into Imagination With Figment), I say it’s better to go back to what worked and simply enhance/upgrade it with new tech & spfx.

so I'll confess, I don't have a problem with that. NOw I'll admit, I'm not a ride "scientist" as I admiringly call some of the posters here. and it is said with admiration.
I don't know about "true to form" as I don't know what the "form" originally went. I didn't get any in depth story telling with maelstrom, it was just old musty and downright boring. The movie ride with their cheesy actors trying to inject some life into the ride as for most people just the ride to sit down and chill on. not imo a great reputation.

I do recognize that there was this golden age of Epcot and again I totally agree that Disney could have done stupendous things, lol but i guess we could go round with that one. I just really dislike being bored to tears with a ride, so yes I'll take Elsa and her shoe horn into Norway ride over dull as dishwater any day.

 

[NickMaio]

So your saying that this is so boring that people love it? Could it be that you don't like it therefore it is awful and shouldn't be there. Cut and Paste? OK, ask yourself how often you have ridden SSE. That has been basically the same story for the past 39 years. Talk about boring, but yet people just keep going to it. And I would bet that you would be one of the first to aggressively hat any change. You cannot say it is full time exciting and that they couldn't think up a new story or purpose to make it less boring. So it boils down to what people that pay to get in like and their numbers. The place has to be built for the majority or it will close completely. It is easy for someone that does not like it to just walk on by the attraction. No one is forced to go to it. If, as you say, "hey, people love it" So maybe it isn't as bad as you are trying to tell us. I have been a WDW fan for 36 years and there are attractions that I haven't been to for 20+ years. Why? Because, those attractions did not appeal to me personally, so I didn't have a desire to see them, but I have yet to demand that they do it differently.

Disney started dumbing down Epcot in the late 80's. Why because the hidden teaching goal was not pulling in the numbers they needed too survive. They tried to simplify the edutainment for those that didn't want to be enlightened and they did OK, but did make some major mistakes. Imagination, I'm looking at you! They managed to change that so it was no longer educational and no longer entertaining. That place is like watching a major store go out of business. But, Frozen brought that Pavilion back to life when it was taking it's last breath. I feel that they did the right thing and that we, the fans, are overthinking the situation and misidentifying what a positive change is when we see one.

No, I am saying that no matter what WDW does with IP based rides that the masses will devour it. No matter if it lacks a new original story or compelling idea.
That clips of a movie with out of context scenes will do great. People will love anything.

Epcot was, and still is one of the top 6 attended theme parks in the world. They were never hurting for attendance.
They switched Epcot to thrill rides simply because they were afraid to loose market share to Uni and other parks.
Not staying true to the intended purpose and allow Epcot to be different, in turn offer a different experience where people can learn without even trying.
My nieces who are 6 and 8 went to Epcot for their first time last Feb. It was their favorite park, tied with HS.
I think we expect little from our population, it shows in our media, our culture, and how we treat each other.
We desperately need another enlightenment, desperately.

People keep going to SSE because deep down they like learning and find the rides message very engaging. Not because it has not changed in almost 4 decades.
Sure, change SSE, but give it purpose and value. Not some IP trash with zero character or soul.

 

[WondersOfLife]

People keep going to SSE because deep down they like learning and find the rides message very engaging. Not because it has not changed in almost 4 decades.
Sure, change SSE, but give it purpose and value. Not some IP trash with zero character or soul.

Im pretty sure a majority of people go to SSE because it’s “the ride in the big ball.” Most people can’t even remember its name.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Im pretty sure a majority of people go to SSE because it’s “the ride in the big ball.” Most people can’t even remember its name.

And that's not necessarily a bad thing. uber fans have this notion that their way is the only right way. Maybe some folks DON'T want to learn on their vacation, maybe they want to veg out. There are folks who actually enjoy seeing the favorite movies come to life, they aren't looking for "purpose" in their vacation or maybe their purpose is to just have a good time on a ride and don't need to find the meaning of life on vacation.

 

[The Grand Inquisitor]

If you haven’t watched Pixar’s “Soul” film yet... I highly recommend doing so!

Personally, the film gives me just as strong Epcot vibes as Inside Out. Beautiful movie. Wonderful message. Anybody think there’s ever a chance of this film making it over to the park?

I absolutely agree! I just watched the movie last night with my family. This would've been a great replacement for the Wonders of Life pavilion alongside Inside Out. Soul hands down was a fantastic movie.

 

[NickMaio]

And that's not necessarily a bad thing. uber fans have this notion that their way is the only right way. Maybe some folks DON'T want to learn on their vacation, maybe they want to veg out. There are folks who actually enjoy seeing the favorite movies come to life, they aren't looking for "purpose" in their vacation or maybe their purpose is to just have a good time on a ride and don't need to find the meaning of life on vacation.

Yes I am positive that there are plenty of those people at WDW.

 

[Fox&Hound]

1). Impressive animatronics don’t make for an impressive ride.

2). Can you compare the story of the attraction to, say, Splash Mountain, Haunted Mansion.... and I’m gonna say it.. Little Mermaid???

3). They didn’t even bother replacing the old ride system (or even the boats!) that break down constantly.

4). Maelstrom was at least worth its typical walk-on wait time. Are you justifying Frozen Ever After’s 40 minute to hour wait lenth in turn for a minute and a half ride? (Peter Pan’s Flight for comparison)

5). Are you also considering projected face animatronics are more impressive than physical face animatronics?

6). Where does the “charm” come from? Serious question since there is apparently a lot of it.

7). Good use of a small space? My goodness. You know.. it didn’t HAVE to be a small space. They could have expanded or located it within another park. Brand new building. Ect. To make the attraction worthy of the gigantic movie it’s based on. Disney wasn’t “limited.” They CHOSE the space it went in.

8). They did do it as cheap as possible, but enough to make it rideable.

Okay, I'l bite...

1. Really? Well Spaceship Earth goes in a slow moving circle and yet it is the animatronics and the story that have people coming back for more (plus, it is iconic). Is Small World that impressive if you took out the animatronics? Nope, another slow boat ride down a winding path. Don't the AA's in Splash enhance the ride and provide it's charm? Yes, the drop is impressive but if you removed the AA's I seriously doubt as many people would line up for what essentially be a log flume ride. Animatronics enhance a ride ten fold and they have some very impressive animatronics in Frozen Ever After.

2. No, it does not have the most cohesive story, I will give you that, but they tried to take some liberties and not make it an exact re-telling of the story. Given the small space they CHOSE to use, I think it works quite well.

3. I am pretty sure they did work on the ride system but I'd have to look into it.

4. Why would you wait 40 minutes when you can use fastpass? I hardly wait 40 minutes for any of the rides but to each their own. Clearly people enjoy it or they would not wait in the line. I will also add the queue is awesome!

5. Ummm, projected face animatronics still show movement, just because they use a projection to show the facial expressions does not discredit the other movements they perform.

6. Really? You can't see the charm? Wow, I kinda feel bad for you. The scene where Olaf is dancing on ice while the frozen branches hang down over him? Using Marshmallow in that backwards scene? Even the queue with the trees and Oaken's shop is an adorable use of space and it leaps and bounds better than the dirty Norway mural and horrific movie everyone skipped in the end.

7. Well of course they didn't HAVE to use the space? Obviously. I had my doubts when they said they were going to use it too. But, looking it at it from a business perspective, I can see why they would want to replace an older ride with low guest satisfaction (total assumption on my part) with a hot ticket they wanted in the parks yesterday. Cause that is what it all comes down to anyway- they wanted Frozen in the parks as soon as possible. And they added to it by adding the meet and greet. You act as if each IP is only allowed one ride/show in the entire park (hello Beauty and the Beast: restaurant, show with Belle, stage show in DHS, musical in Epcot, Gaston's tavern, etc). If they want to add more Frozen somewhere else down the line they certainly could. Maybe they will add the Oaken sleigh ride somewhere at some point.

8. A business trying to curb their spending?!?!? Perish the thought....Everywhere else on these forums people complain how Disney spending is overly inflated (which it 100% is). Can you imagine if they had built a new Frozen ride what it would have cost? Whew....I applaud them for making a smart business decision.

Frozen Ever After is an ADORABLE ride and many love it much more than the Norway ride it replaced. I get that some people loved the Norway troll ride, but let's all stop pretending Frozen is without merit. Thank you =)

 

[NickMaio]

Okay, I'l bite...

1. Really? Well Spaceship Earth goes in a slow moving circle and yet it is the animatronics and the story that have people coming back for more (plus, it is iconic). Is Small World that impressive if you took out the animatronics? Nope, another slow boat ride down a winding path. Don't the AA's in Splash enhance the ride and provide it's charm? Yes, the drop is impressive but if you removed the AA's I seriously doubt as many people would line up for what essentially be a log flume ride. Animatronics enhance a ride ten fold and they have some very impressive animatronics in Frozen Ever After.

2. No, it does not have the most cohesive story, I will give you that, but they tried to take some liberties and not make it an exact re-telling of the story. Given the small space they CHOSE to use, I think it works quite well.

3. I am pretty sure they did work on the ride system but I'd have to look into it.

4. Why would you wait 40 minutes when you can use fastpass? I hardly wait 40 minutes for any of the rides but to each their own. Clearly people enjoy it or they would not wait in the line. I will also add the queue is awesome!

5. Ummm, projected face animatronics still show movement, just because they use a projection to show the facial expressions does not discredit the other movements they perform.

6. Really? You can't see the charm? Wow, I kinda feel bad for you. The scene where Olaf is dancing on ice while the frozen branches hang down over him? Using Marshmallow in that backwards scene? Even the queue with the trees and Oaken's shop is an adorable use of space and it leaps and bounds better than the dirty Norway mural and horrific movie everyone skipped in the end.

7. Well of course they didn't HAVE to use the space? Obviously. I had my doubts when they said they were going to use it too. But, looking it at it from a business perspective, I can see why they would want to replace an older ride with low guest satisfaction (total assumption on my part) with a hot ticket they wanted in the parks yesterday. Cause that is what it all comes down to anyway- they wanted Frozen in the parks as soon as possible. And they added to it by adding the meet and greet. You act as if each IP is only allowed one ride/show in the entire park (hello Beauty and the Beast: restaurant, show with Belle, stage show in DHS, musical in Epcot, Gaston's tavern, etc). If they want to add more Frozen somewhere else down the line they certainly could. Maybe they will add the Oaken sleigh ride somewhere at some point.

8. A business trying to curb their spending?!?!? Perish the thought....Everywhere else on these forums people complain how Disney spending is overly inflated (which it 100% is). Can you imagine if they had built a new Frozen ride what it would have cost? Whew....I applaud them for making a smart business decision.

Frozen Ever After is an ADORABLE ride and many love it much more than the Norway ride it replaced. I get that some people loved the Norway troll ride, but let's all stop pretending Frozen is without merit. Thank you =)

I love how mostly everyone's standards on the WDW forum have dropped off dramatically, I dont blame WDW anymore for cheating out on this Frozen ride
Everyone will think it is awesome no matter what they do.
How could they resist.

 

[Po'Rich]

5). Are you also considering projected face animatronics are more impressive than physical face animatronics?

May daughter and I find these "creepy." They actually detract from the ride for us.

Although, somehow, they aren't quite as creepy on 7 Dwarfs--Perhaps just done better? The ones on Frozen looks like the AA is wearing someone else's face (think bad horror movies).

 

[NickMaio]

May daughter and I find these "creepy." They actually detract from the ride for us.

Although, somehow, they aren't quite as creepy on 7 Dwarfs--Perhaps just done better? The ones on Frozen looks like the AA is wearing someone else's face (think bad horror movies).

I feel they look cheap.......very cheap.
Look at the cartoon animatronics in the Beauty and the Beast dark ride.
That is what WDW should be getting, that kind of quality
Settling for mediocrity is one thing but calling it acceptable us another.

At least SSE has a cohesive story. Is it too much to ask that frozen have the same, a STORY an ADVENTURE.

Sure it has its moments, but character,charisma, and soul it lacks in spades.

 

[Brer Oswald]

Good movie. Makes no sense in a theme park.

 

[WEDway Inc & Company LLC]

Good movie. Makes no sense in a theme park.

Like other posters have said, I could see a Jazz-inspired restaurant. But no ride for sure.

 

[Brer Oswald]

Like other posters have said, I could see a Jazz-inspired restaurant. But no ride for sure.

I could see a Jazz-inspired Popcorn Bucket.

 

[WondersOfLife]

Okay, I'l bite...

1. Really? Well Spaceship Earth goes in a slow moving circle and yet it is the animatronics and the story that have people coming back for more (plus, it is iconic). Is Small World that impressive if you took out the animatronics? Nope, another slow boat ride down a winding path. Don't the AA's in Splash enhance the ride and provide it's charm? Yes, the drop is impressive but if you removed the AA's I seriously doubt as many people would line up for what essentially be a log flume ride. Animatronics enhance a ride ten fold and they have some very impressive animatronics in Frozen Ever After.

2. No, it does not have the most cohesive story, I will give you that, but they tried to take some liberties and not make it an exact re-telling of the story. Given the small space they CHOSE to use, I think it works quite well.

3. I am pretty sure they did work on the ride system but I'd have to look into it.

4. Why would you wait 40 minutes when you can use fastpass? I hardly wait 40 minutes for any of the rides but to each their own. Clearly people enjoy it or they would not wait in the line. I will also add the queue is awesome!

5. Ummm, projected face animatronics still show movement, just because they use a projection to show the facial expressions does not discredit the other movements they perform.

6. Really? You can't see the charm? Wow, I kinda feel bad for you. The scene where Olaf is dancing on ice while the frozen branches hang down over him? Using Marshmallow in that backwards scene? Even the queue with the trees and Oaken's shop is an adorable use of space and it leaps and bounds better than the dirty Norway mural and horrific movie everyone skipped in the end.

7. Well of course they didn't HAVE to use the space? Obviously. I had my doubts when they said they were going to use it too. But, looking it at it from a business perspective, I can see why they would want to replace an older ride with low guest satisfaction (total assumption on my part) with a hot ticket they wanted in the parks yesterday. Cause that is what it all comes down to anyway- they wanted Frozen in the parks as soon as possible. And they added to it by adding the meet and greet. You act as if each IP is only allowed one ride/show in the entire park (hello Beauty and the Beast: restaurant, show with Belle, stage show in DHS, musical in Epcot, Gaston's tavern, etc). If they want to add more Frozen somewhere else down the line they certainly could. Maybe they will add the Oaken sleigh ride somewhere at some point.

8. A business trying to curb their spending?!?!? Perish the thought....Everywhere else on these forums people complain how Disney spending is overly inflated (which it 100% is). Can you imagine if they had built a new Frozen ride what it would have cost? Whew....I applaud them for making a smart business decision.

Frozen Ever After is an ADORABLE ride and many love it much more than the Norway ride it replaced. I get that some people loved the Norway troll ride, but let's all stop pretending Frozen is without merit. Thank you =)

I’ll just let others continue to respond to your... interesting... responses. You’re welcome. =)

Like other posters have said, I could see a Jazz-inspired restaurant. But no ride for sure.

I am all down for this idea. I just feel like the movie was just so creative, on inside out level, that it should be presented more somewhere (where it IS deemed fitting tho, unlike Frozen).

A jazz bar would be great. Maybe some interactive Easter eggs and whatnot.

 

[ToTBellHop]

C’mon—Epcot lost its soul like 20 years ago. It’s now Metal Magic Kingdom and Soul is too mature for 3-year olds. Move along.

 

[Fox&Hound]

May daughter and I find these "creepy." They actually detract from the ride for us.

Although, somehow, they aren't quite as creepy on 7 Dwarfs--Perhaps just done better? The ones on Frozen looks like the AA is wearing someone else's face (think bad horror movies).

Haha, I can see that, actually. Anna and Elsa do look a little off, certainly not as good as the seven dwarves. I don't mind them but I understand what you are saying =)

 

[NickMaio]

C’mon—Epcot lost its soul like 20 years ago. It’s now Metal Magic Kingdom and Soul is too mature for 3-year olds. Move along.

Ya, God forbid we critique something or have a negative opinion. Move along people everything is perfect at WDW.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Ya, God forbid we critique something or have a negative opinion. Move along people everything is perfect at WDW.

Yes. Now let’s have a group clap.

 

[MisterPenguin]

View attachment 522193
Yes. Now let’s have a group clap.

22 was based off of this photo. True story.