Solving the WDW Capcity Problem. Ideas?

BigTxEars

Well-Known Member
Exactly. Not many people seem to realize the scope of all mm+ enables, particularly from Disney's side of things. Fast passes and additional revenue are nearly secondary. (Although I imagine someone is going to be forced to quantify the monetary gains, which will be an unenviable task as the benefits are so widespread, will take a while to materialize, and are more qualitative than quantitative) but $2billion is not that outrageous considering all the system can and will be used for.

I agree it is a powerful system, they will recoup their cost many times over. And if it moves people better we all win. WDW is not going to get less crowded, the world is "smaller" every year and the population growing. WDW trying to lessen the crowds is a losing deal, trying to move them better is much smarter and better for us IMO.
 

BigTxEars

Well-Known Member
Yes. Also some A-ticket walk-through attractions. Similar to Swiss Family Treehouse. I think part of the problem is that Fastpass means that people are out in the walkways instead of in the queues. Give them something they can do while waiting for their Fastpass time.

- Increase ticket prices. *ducks*

- Increase hours.



Should never happen. It would make planning difficult. And what if you didn't do your research and showed up for a one day visit and you can't get in. Did you see National Lampoon's Vacation?

Wally World!

:)
 

Chef Mickey

Well-Known Member
It's not a popular opinion, but I'd like to see them raise prices and use the profit to raise the quality across the board. They can't continue to fit the same amount of people in the same place and expect to keep the Disney brand quality.

You either have to do that or expand, expand, expand. Building a new park is an OK idea, but you still need to retrofit existing parks like MK to handle crowds better. I've said for 10 years the park is not aging well in terms of its space. Common areas, restaurant walk ups, etc are getting downright impossible to navigate. It truly makes the experience less enjoyable and people will start to grow tired of the cattle call.

I'm the biggest Disney apologist on this board and even I am growing weary of the same issues I see trip after trip. I'm willing to pay a lot more to make the experience more exclusive and raise the quality.
 

thomas998

Well-Known Member
Yes, building more rides. Especially, IMO, several family-friendly C-ticket dark rides in each park as soon as possible. A much wiser and cost-effective solution than blockbuster E-ticket "lands" which would increase attendance but not reduce congestion. Get people out of the walkways and into show buildings!

Beyond actually increasing capacity, how do you improve the guest experience by reducing congestion and giving the most guests the best experience possible?

On our weeklong trip last week, I saw a TON of day guests. I was at the MK Wednesday when they closed the parking lot and attendance was beyond unreal. Most day guests were stressed, exhausted and visibly upset by the crowded conditions and long lines. I suspect many onsite guests, like our family, rode our three FP+ attractions, ate a snack or pre-reserved sit-down meal, rode the train and got the heck out.

Crowded walkways, jam-packed FP entrances and insane lines for food and stand-by make touring the park less than enjoyable for everyone. High-paying resort guests feel like they get less value for their money, and day guests are left stressed, overwhelmed and less than satisfied after waiting in two-hour lines and picking up what FP+ scraps are left.

WDW is taking fantastic and long-overdue steps to alleviate crowding by expanding the MK hub, building the walkway behind Main Street, and expanding eating areas. But is it enough?

Is adding family-friendly C-tickets, especially at half-day parks such as DHS and AK, but even at the MK, a viable solution?

What about more radical solutions, such as separate days at the MK for resort guests only, and special days where only day guests can visit, allowing them a fair playing field without resort guests gobbling up all the FPs in advance?

In short, what are your ideas for giving guests across the spectrum the most fulfilling and pleasant park experience possible? Discuss!

Two ways to really deal with the crowding... rides wont really do it they will just create little areas that will hold people but considering that MK is pretty much the size it will be a ride would take up otherwise free roaming space and in its place create a queue... so as much as I like new rides it wont stop the crowding.

No to stop the crowding you have two options... reduce the number of people by raising ticket prices or give the people more space so they don't feel so crowded. To increase space you could simply ban strollers or charge people the price of admission to bring in a stroller... because the truth is a stroller doesn't hold junior 100% of the time and when junior isn't in the stroller the stroller is just parked somewhere taking up space (more space actually than junior would on his own because of the size of the average stroller). The other reality that people fail to realize is that strollers didn't used to be such a typical sight at Disney, in the 70's the typical kid used something called, dare I say it, legs - and the kid actually walked. Maybe its the reason kids nowdays are fatter than they used to be, they walked on their own.
 

Hobnail Boot

Well-Known Member
I think crowding at DHS, AK, and Epcot can be solved by adding new attractions and spreading them out a bit (no more Sunset Boulevard situations). The MK however is screwed because it's the MK. Everyone wants to go there no matter what.
 

rob0519

Well-Known Member
Sorry but I have only two answers:

1...add a crapload of new shows rides and walkthroughs.

2...build a fifth park.

That's it. Plain and simple. Anything else isn't going to solve anything without upsetting somebody.

Sorry, but building another park won't really help MK. It's the cornerstone of the resort. It has "The Castle". Every visitor goes there at least once if not more than once per visit. You can build all the parks you want and unless you give people a reason to NOT go to MK with all it's history and nostalgia, those crowds aren't going anywhere.

If there is any land that can still be used to expand MK, TDO may want to start looking at how use it to put more people in the park.
 

rct247

Well-Known Member
Here's the thing. Any additions to the other three parks are still going to be bad for Magic Kingdom who is struggling the most with capacity. While we have made fun of getting excited over new restrooms and the Hub project, those are the things that they needed to do to ensure that when they do add Avatarland and other additions that MK will be able to take it. There in also lies the problem, why does MK attract so many and the other parks don't. The other 3 parks need to get on par with Magic Kingdom. It's obviously a tug of war.

One thing I think it will ultimately come down to is building a resort in South America and improving Disneyland Paris Resort. WDW sees so many visitors from South America. While it is great for our economy, building a resort closer to that market may help with crowds here at WDW. Even improving Disneyland Paris and especially the Walt Disney Studios Park may just encourage more Europeans that what they have is great and good enough to visit. WDW does get guests from Tokyo, but not as much because they already have a great set of parks.

When it does come to rides, we need more PeopleMovers and PeopleEaters things that will get them in and get them out all with continuous loading, minimal stops, but yet still a great attraction and story. Horizons was a perfect example. It has an amazing capacity. Other things do make a difference such as the extremely long load & unload area at Harry Potter. The extra long length ensures that there is more time to board resulting in less stops to keep things moving for everyone. It doesn't matter what "ticket" these new attractions are, so long as they have capacity in mind.

They also need to get rid of or update under-performers. The parks have some areas that really could use something new to help eat up some crowds. Stitch's Great Escape, Carousel of Progress, Tom Sawyer's Island, Hall of Presidents, Country Bear Jamboree, Tiki Room, Swiss Family Treehouse, Ellen's Energy Adventure, Circle of Life, Captain EO, Journey into Imagination, Impression de France, Reflections of China, American Idol Experience, Sounds Dangerous, Magic of Disney Animation, & the Backlot Tour can all hold more people, but don't attraction lots of crowds for various reasons. Not all of these need to be changed, but some could benefit from it.

Less clutter is another thing that can help solve capacity issues. Look in the parks and you'll see lots of excess merchandise and food carts. Yes, these are all money makers, but they are also blocking pathways, causing bottlenecks, making crowded conditions more chaotic. There are plenty of untapped dining locations to help with snack stands and there are also plenty of gift shops.

More organization is another big thing. Storybook Circus has this thinking in mind. Wide paths, stroller parking that is tucked away but designed into the plan, lots of places to sit, added ride capacity, huge gift shop location, and great theming. It will still feel crowded on a busy day, but they kept crowds in mind.

Continue to make upgrades to infrastructure by expanding walkways, improving restroom/restaurant/merchandise facilities, and finding ways to organize guest traffic flow without a) it gets to the point where all guests feel like herded cattle and b) that that park pathways turn into litteral roads complete with stop lights, traffic signs, and designated directional traffic lanes.
 

rangerbob

Well-Known Member
They have already started on their plan. Bulldoze the trees down and add more concrete.

I know that it is only for the parades and fireworks viewing though.

I was there last week also and the worst spot that I encountered was the area between Stitch Great Mistake and Monster Inc area. That area is sooo crowded and impossible to get through without knocking into somebody.
 

morningstar

Well-Known Member
Two ways to really deal with the crowding... rides wont really do it they will just create little areas that will hold people but considering that MK is pretty much the size it will be a ride would take up otherwise free roaming space and in its place create a queue... so as much as I like new rides it wont stop the crowding.

As I was saying I think Fastpass got people out of the queues. My impression was that there are a lot of standy queues with their serpentine sections roped off most of the time. Not easy, but they could demolish the section of building that these are in, and replace with a small ride or walkthrough, thus increasing attractions without decreasing space.
 

Cubfan300

Active Member
DHS is our family's favorite park, and part of the capacity problem can be solved by adding a couple more rides, but the capacity eating shows, LMA/Indy/BLT, have a staleness issue. We loved seeing them the first time, enough so to experience each a second time, but now have no interest in seeing them again. DW rolls her eyes at a mention of seeing LMA at all. But, if the shows changed slightly from year to year, there would probably be renewed interest in attending, thus "eating up" some of the crowds on site. Backlot Tour has to be the most disappointing. The potential to change up exhibits, add guest/celebrity tour guides, and actually see the old studios would intrigue this movie/tv loving family all the more.
 

Kevo

Member
With 42,000 acres, Walt Disney World is not short of space.
With the parks globally churning out $2.2 billion in profit they aren't short of cash.
For (a guess) 95% of the time, the parks aren't at capacity.
Do they expand the 4 parks in any REAL sense? No.

So my question is:
Is there really a problem with capacity?

If Disney spent an extra $1bn in expanding WDW, what would they gain?
To recover that kind of cash in a 3 year period, they would need to rake in an extra $1m per day!
Wow, an additional 50,000 park guests a day spending $200 each? Really?
An 18m+ extra visitors to WDW a year? Really?


My answer is
No, there isn't a capacity problem at WDW (not in Disney's eyes, and that's what counts!)
 
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neoshinok

Well-Known Member
At MK in particular, they need to utilize MM+ to get more people into the attractions that are running far below capacity. In between your FP+ reservations or when you're looking at/modifying your FP+, they could add a banner saying 'No wait at Hall of Presidents' etc.

Many regulars skip less popular attractions out of habit, many first time visitors are unaware certain attractions exist. I would personally rather be in any attraction (aside from Stitch) than wandering aimlessly in the heat waiting for my next FP+.

Better utilization of capacity at HoP, CBJ, Tiki Room, CoP and, during certain times, Philharmagic would take people off of pathways and give them a bit of rest in the AC. This could improve guest satisfaction through less crowded walkways, less exhausted/heat stricken guests, and more attractions experienced.
 

Kevo

Member
Make people take an intelligence test before being allowed to purchase tickets...

That should cull the riffraff.


*Ducks and runs*

Hmmm,
I've seen some of the most disgusting people on the planet staying in the Grand Floridian.

*Power to youngsters that didn't stand a chance*
 

AllydoesDisney

Well-Known Member
Here's the thing. Any additions to the other three parks are still going to be bad for Magic Kingdom who is struggling the most with capacity. While we have made fun of getting excited over new restrooms and the Hub project, those are the things that they needed to do to ensure that when they do add Avatarland and other additions that MK will be able to take it. There in also lies the problem, why does MK attract so many and the other parks don't. The other 3 parks need to get on par with Magic Kingdom. It's obviously a tug of war.

One thing I think it will ultimately come down to is building a resort in South America and improving Disneyland Paris Resort. WDW sees so many visitors from South America. While it is great for our economy, building a resort closer to that market may help with crowds here at WDW. Even improving Disneyland Paris and especially the Walt Disney Studios Park may just encourage more Europeans that what they have is great and good enough to visit. WDW does get guests from Tokyo, but not as much because they already have a great set of parks.

When it does come to rides, we need more PeopleMovers and PeopleEaters things that will get them in and get them out all with continuous loading, minimal stops, but yet still a great attraction and story. Horizons was a perfect example. It has an amazing capacity. Other things do make a difference such as the extremely long load & unload area at Harry Potter. The extra long length ensures that there is more time to board resulting in less stops to keep things moving for everyone. It doesn't matter what "ticket" these new attractions are, so long as they have capacity in mind.

They also need to get rid of or update under-performers. The parks have some areas that really could use something new to help eat up some crowds. Stitch's Great Escape, Carousel of Progress, Tom Sawyer's Island, Hall of Presidents, Country Bear Jamboree, Tiki Room, Swiss Family Treehouse, Ellen's Energy Adventure, Circle of Life, Captain EO, Journey into Imagination, Impression de France, Reflections of China, American Idol Experience, Sounds Dangerous, Magic of Disney Animation, & the Backlot Tour can all hold more people, but don't attraction lots of crowds for various reasons. Not all of these need to be changed, but some could benefit from it.

Less clutter is another thing that can help solve capacity issues. Look in the parks and you'll see lots of excess merchandise and food carts. Yes, these are all money makers, but they are also blocking pathways, causing bottlenecks, making crowded conditions more chaotic. There are plenty of untapped dining locations to help with snack stands and there are also plenty of gift shops.

More organization is another big thing. Storybook Circus has this thinking in mind. Wide paths, stroller parking that is tucked away but designed into the plan, lots of places to sit, added ride capacity, huge gift shop location, and great theming. It will still feel crowded on a busy day, but they kept crowds in mind.

Continue to make upgrades to infrastructure by expanding walkways, improving restroom/restaurant/merchandise facilities, and finding ways to organize guest traffic flow without a) it gets to the point where all guests feel like herded cattle and b) that that park pathways turn into litteral roads complete with stop lights, traffic signs, and designated directional traffic lanes.
I think this is one of the best answers.

I thought Disney was going to lose a lot of business when Harry Potter world was built. But that didn't last long now did it?
 

KCheatle

Well-Known Member
I think Disney was on to something with the Dumbo ride play area, the Winnie the Pooh line, and the Haunted Mansion line. The thing that makes me the most perturbed in a busy place is waiting in line. I don't mind waiting. I mind waiting in line. It gets hot, you don't feel like you're making any progress, your legs hurt, your kids drive you crazy because they just voice all the things you're already feeling, but not voicing, there's nowhere to sit down, etc. I think the park on a crowded day would be much more enjoyable for all if Disney continued to incorporate these interactive play areas so that the inevitable waiting in line is much more enjoyable for all.
 

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