Skull Island: Reign of Kong from construction to opening

TalkingHead

Well-Known Member
So many are going crazy over the ride system. In this case I question why did it have to be AGV? Did the trackless setup add anything to the experience?

I asked this on UO before the ride opened -- the trackless setup is only visible outside, and I assume it's not appreciably noticeable while on the ride. It's a bizarre flourish that seemingly adds nothing to the experience.

That is why we will most likely never see Universal live up to its potential without an IP holder like Warner Brothers forcing them to.

That's my fear for UOR -- it'll become known as the place with fantastic A+ Potter stuff and "really good to passable" everything else.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
That's my fear for UOR -- it'll become known as the place with fantastic A+ Potter stuff and "really good to passable" everything else.
I would say Nintendo qualifies as "an IP holder like Warner Brothers." Same with Marvel. King Kong is really the only thing that has me excited out of Universal's own stable though except Volcano Bay. Not a lot of hype for F&F and Fallon and I'm not alone in that.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
I have no doubt everything you said is true and that the original plans were more ambitious but doesn't what you describe happen to every attraction over the course of development? And while this particular version of Kong may have had cuts, isn't it also true that the ORIGINAL plans for a Kong attraction in Orlando was a much cheaper and less ambitious adaptation of the Kong 360 experience from Hollywood that was to take the place of DISASTER? In this case, no matter how you look at it, the final product as it is today is monumentally more impressive than whatever the original plans were which to me goes against a lot of what you described above. If it was all about the bottom line and delivering the minimum amount to please guests, why did they decide to allocate more money and completely change the scope of the attraction from a moderate D-ticket to a full E-ticket?
Yes cuts are a necessary part of the process. My concern is when cuts remain because of laziness, greed, and management dysfunction. When the pitch to place Kong inside Disaster occurred it was early concept so who knows where that would have ended up. Regardless, we are now getting a very lazy Fast and Furious there so six half dozen one or the other. Just as you point out that cuts don’t matter because every project goes through them, I say it doesn’t matter how much more impressive the final version is because every attraction should stand on its own merit and meet at least a certain standard regardless of where it started.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
I appreciate you coming in here. So the drivers getting nabbed did have weight to it. Huh. Also I've read on OU that a better transition to the AA Kong is supposed to be there but for whatever reason isn't being projected yet during technical rehearsals. Wait and see on that one. The bug pit really is the only scene I could see working replaced by sets and AAs. A run through the jungle would've been nice. 360 scene sounds like a blast. From the beginning the biggest thing I wanted was an AA Kong. Since I got what I wanted and I think the rest will still be great for me personally, yeah. Bring on the ride :)

Anything new on Nintendo?
Yes there were several concepts for the driver. The Kong shadow projection looked pretty good in the mock ups so I hope that made the final cut. There really isn't anything else on Nintendo I can share at the moment except to say it still looks good but we really lost a lot with the latest round of cuts from last year.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
OSHA would not approve the driver getting snatched gag because of the risk of injury. It was replaced with the scene where Kate gets snatched the big scorpion thing on film.
And I assume the high speed run through a practical jungle was cut when they decided to build Cabana Bay, because on the plot of land actually in the park, because of size constrains, that would have been impossible.
Well it wasn't really just OSHA but mainly the man responsible for most of the longer waits and lower reliability of many attractions. His MO is to knee jerk everything without a full understanding of the issues or a full background in the equipment in many cases. Because of this many worthwhile ride and show elements don't make the cut. The driver gag only required a bit of retooling and it would have been fine. Besides, if worse came to worse GMR has been doing a driver switch since the 90s. The jungle run had a great pitch and would have worked the way it was set up but it was dismissed before getting anywhere.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
I know for a fact that OSHA didn't approve the gag. A Kuka Arm with a crab claw at the end was supposed to reach into the ride vehicle and grab the driver. OSHA deemed their plan too dangerous. They found another way to do it.

And the jungle romp was never anything more than fanboi wishful speculation, even as much as saying "a 30' tall free roaming AA is going to chase your vehicle through the jungle". Does that sound even remotely like something UC would do?
I'm not referring to the Kuka version. There were many great ideas, including the jungle chase (not with a tree), that got squashed.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
We boarded the second time and i was on the far right outside.
dont do this.... you can see the top and bottoms of the screens and its just not as good.


Well, that's a drag. Couldn't they be camouflaged somehow?

Just read whylightbulb's post. Dang. Why is non-talent always in control of talent?
I feel your pain.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
I asked this on UO before the ride opened -- the trackless setup is only visible outside, and I assume it's not appreciably noticeable while on the ride. It's a bizarre flourish that seemingly adds nothing to the experience.

Yes it has become a standard at UC now: technology comes before story and overshadows the overall experience in general. There are some nice uses of technology that do add to the Kong experience but the trackless isn’t one of them.

That's my fear for UOR -- it'll become known as the place with fantastic A+ Potter stuff and "really good to passable" everything else.
The sad part is UC still has some good talent but most of them aren’t being utilized to their potential. If the right management were in place we would be seeing some product to rival even Shanghai Pirates potentially. By the way I have already ridden that ride and let me say it is by far the most elaborate and immersive dark rides in the world. That is the proper way to integrate video technology into a dark ride environment. In most cases it is so seamless most people have a difficult time differentiating video from practical – and they didn’t even have to go 3D.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
not sure if you can or not... but nintendo... in kid zone or third gate? or both?
Rumors right now only say KidZone but they have also said it mostly focuses on Mario and Donkey Kong. Nintendo has many more characters that I wouldn't be surprised to see show up in the third park like Zelda, Pokemon, etc.
 

Jimmy Thick

Well-Known Member
Someone has already alluded to it in this thread – many in Universal Creatives’ upper and middle management are lazy and inept. Kong is the latest example of this disappointing realization. Of course not all of them are careless and riding out their high six and seven figure salaries and bonuses. Mike West is one example of a manager that cares and has the talent to back up his position. Unfortunately he has been stymied with Kong, just as he was with Simpsons and Minions. The past year we have seen an exodus of UC talent, including Lisa Nash, because they are tired of the BS. Ask Scott Trowbridge why he left UC. It wasn’t just the sweet offer from Disney that motivated him to leave his high level position. There are of course many more examples but let’s talk Kong now.

Kong had a lot of promise and could have been spectacular, what it ended up being, in my opinion, was just passable. Just as I predicted park guests love it, specifically the tunnel scene. I knew they would and therein lies the problem and the reason why we will continue to get attractions that just barely make the grade for the foreseeable future. Instead of UC and Comcast living up to a standard they set for themselves (as Disney used to do and is starting to once again in some cases), they will be lazy and deliver just enough to get by.

First, here’s the good about Kong. The queue is well executed and sets the mood (nice job Greg). The queue AAs are nice but I wouldn’t have expected anything less from Advanced Animation. They are the only domestic AA company besides Garner (handed to them on a silver platter by WDI) that have figured out how to pull off compliance software in house and really make it work. There is just enough detail in the queue to deliver an entertaining and interesting experience in anticipation for an amazing ride (if only the last part could have been delivered). I applaud the effort in installing on-board AAs for each ride vehicle. It doesn’t bother me that much that their motion is jerky and that they look like the old Sally AAs back from ET because it is something different and it works for most of the passengers past the first few rows. I love the size of the show doors into the building. Last but not least, obviously the Kong AA, just as I’ve been saying all along, is very realistic and well executed in some ways.

Now for the bad and the reasons why this attraction is only passable in my opinion. Let’s start with the fact that there are really only five (and I’m being generous here) scenes of any consequence and they are, once again, 75 percent screens. Not only did Woodbury cut much of the queue but he cut major portions of the ride as well. This is a fact, Woodbury does not “get it” and I’ll leave it at that in order to protect myself and several others. There are a few on these boards that I’ll reveal specific and personal experiences regarding working with him and others from UC but I can’t get too specific in public for obvious reasons. These cut scenes had some to do with budget but more to do with not appreciating or understanding what makes a theme park attraction stand out. To open a major dark ride attraction with just two screens, a projection tunnel/motion base, a few bats, and one large-scale animatronic is an embarrassment in my opinion.

Among the scenes that got cut: a high-speed (practical not screens) chase through the jungle, a scene where the RV breaks down and our driver gets nabbed, a detour through the insect pit with AAs etc. etc. Some of the cut scenes made it pretty far before being cut by the man that most outside of UC revere out of ignorance and those that know him and work with him fear more than anything because he has quite a temper and rules with an iron fist as opposed to a collaborative and open management style that you find more often at WDI. Some of the scenes didn’t even make it to an official pitch because they were seen as gratuitous and unnecessary. I don’t know about you but I think the high-speed chase in the middle of all those screen scenes would have been a welcome respite from the same old UC tricks and would have made the experience more complete and unique. Just two more practical scenes would have made it more complete.

How about, even with what they had to work with, a little variety. Why couldn’t the first two screens show a different scenario and characters for each driver? Maybe the tunnel could have randomly had Kong either be hostile or friendly followed by the AA angry or friendly (as he is now). Than we also have the execution issues. Why, after all these years of imagery technology advancement do we still have a black wall at the bottom of the tunnel screens? Take a look at Comcast’s own corporate headquarters lobby for an example of extremely hi definition LED panels that could have been installed on those walls to further immerse us in the scene as opposed to taking us right out of the illusion. The transition from tunnel to Kong AA is also not executed well. There is no reason why we should be seeing blank screen when they could have flown in a foliage assembly covering frame and screen during the transition and flown above or below during projection sequence for example.

So many are going crazy over the ride system. In this case I question why did it have to be AGV? Did the trackless setup add anything to the experience? The nice scenery in the Kong AA scene goes underappreciated because the audience is wearing the 3D glasses. These are some of the criticisms that to me make this just an “ok” ride. So many missed opportunities and so many cuts make it a disappointment in my book. Yes the guests love it and yes many in the fan community also love it. That is why we will most likely never see Universal live up to its potential without an IP holder like Warner Brothers forcing them to.

Mark Woodbury is the best in the business and trumps any and anyone at Disney. To call him this mad slasher of budgets is rude and does not do the man justice.

Plus they still have Robert Ward on retainer.

Jimmy Thick- That's that.
 

CJR

Well-Known Member
Rumors right now only say KidZone but they have also said it mostly focuses on Mario and Donkey Kong. Nintendo has many more characters that I wouldn't be surprised to see show up in the third park like Zelda, Pokemon, etc.

I know this is a Kong thread, but I had to say, if they don't use Zelda in the third park, I hope they'll use it to overhaul LC. I know it's small space, but it's way better than nothing, and would possibly allow them to keep Mythos.

Back to Kong, it's a solid addition to IoA. I know people are tired of the glasses, I am too, but at least this is only one of two rides at the IoA that require them. Everything else that does is at the studios. It's an exception to me, as this park needed another indoor attraction and this is it. Could it have been better? Probably, but it's still solid for the average guest. I know it's easy to group both parks together, but when you split them up, this ride really helps IoA become more balanced (still a ways to go though, imo).
 

cheezbat

Well-Known Member
I know this is a Kong thread, but I had to say, if they don't use Zelda in the third park, I hope they'll use it to overhaul LC. I know it's small space, but it's way better than nothing, and would possibly allow them to keep Mythos.

Back to Kong, it's a solid addition to IoA. I know people are tired of the glasses, I am too, but at least this is only one of two rides at the IoA that require them. Everything else that does is at the studios. It's an exception to me, as this park needed another indoor attraction and this is it. Could it have been better? Probably, but it's still solid for the average guest. I know it's easy to group both parks together, but when you split them up, this ride really helps IoA become more balanced (still a ways to go though, imo).
Totally agree. Kong is a ride that fits well in IOA. Two 3-D rides aren't bad. And there's only 3 screen based attractions in the park.

As for Studios, I think it's time to start gutting some older 3-D screen attractions for some more practical rides with sets and animatronics. Way too much overuse of screens and 3-D.
 

whylightbulb

Well-Known Member
Mark Woodbury is the best in the business and trumps any and anyone at Disney. To call him this mad slasher of budgets is rude and does not do the man justice.

Plus they still have Robert Ward on retainer.

Jimmy Thick- That's that.
He certainly is no dummy. When they first offered him the job and he turned it down because he hated theme parks he quickly changed his mind when they told him what the salary would be. Unfortunately he still hates theme parks and doesn't understand what they are.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Totally agree. Kong is a ride that fits well in IOA. Two 3-D rides aren't bad. And there's only 3 screen based attractions in the park.

As for Studios, I think it's time to start gutting some older 3-D screen attractions for some more practical rides with sets and animatronics. Way too much overuse of screens and 3-D.
No complaints from me if Shrek went away for the Secret Life of Pets dark ride rumored for USH. That and Nintendo would be a nice balance if rumors hold true. I just want F&F and Fallon to actually be good.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Shrek 4D is, IMO, the absolute worst attraction in Orlando and I can't wait to see it go.
Definitely. It's a DVD bonus feature blown up into an attraction. Shameful.
Did they finally close Stitch's Great Escape, or are you just getting my hopes up?

I could see them closing Shrek if Dreamworks gets expanded on elsewhere on property. Until then, it's likely staying put.
Close Shrek, go all out in third park :)
 

dweezil78

Well-Known Member
I just want F&F and Fallon to actually be good.

If F&F is the same main 360 part as we have here at USH, it's pretty underwhelming compared to Kong -- much in the same way Transformers doesn't hold a candle to Spider-Man (IMO). The setup scene is ridiculously cheesy and the 360 tunnel is more of the same, but far too frenetic and all over the place to really feel immersed by it.
 

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