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Rude Space Mt CM...AGAIN!!
- Thread starter Merlin
- Start date
AliciaLuvzDizne
Well-Known Member
:hurl:
trust me its relevant:
In Cleveland, Ohio, it's illegal to catch mice without a hunting license.
A Virginia law requires all bathtubs to be kept out in the yards, not inside the houses.
In Florida, if an elephant is left tied to a parking meter, the parking fee has to be paid just as it would for a vehicle.
so the next time i park my elephant in downtown orlando, i'll turn myself in.
(http://www.dribbleglass.com/subpages/laws7.htm)
trust me its relevant:
In Cleveland, Ohio, it's illegal to catch mice without a hunting license.
A Virginia law requires all bathtubs to be kept out in the yards, not inside the houses.
In Florida, if an elephant is left tied to a parking meter, the parking fee has to be paid just as it would for a vehicle.
so the next time i park my elephant in downtown orlando, i'll turn myself in.
(http://www.dribbleglass.com/subpages/laws7.htm)
Pixie Duster
New Member
You are absolutely right, you are a guest in our "home" and we do not want you to feel uncomfortable, it will be Firdayish before I get the address, I don't work until then..
Woody13
New Member
Originally posted by Pixie Duster
I've learn to regard Woody13's comment as either sarcasm or stupidity.
Case law, or rulings in individual cases, is as clear as a bell. The Florida Supreme Court and the U.S. Supreme Court have both reached decisions affirming people's right to refuse unwanted touching. People in the United States have rights to self determination. I'll let you parse the case law on your own.
Don't blame me. I don't make the law. If you don't like the law then petition your legislature to make changes. This is not a debate.
When you have a case based on the law, then argue the law. When you have a case based upon the facts, the argue the facts. When you have a case based upon neither, then muddy the waters.
I think you'll be "looking forward" to Woody13's reply for quite some time. The rest of us are still waiting for his other examples of how I was "guilty of SEVERAL criminal offenses". I never got a reply to that question. But it's not the first time Woody13 hasn't been able to back up a statement.
Woody13
New Member
Merlin wrote;
"At that point it occurred to me that there was a problem with this CM and unless someone did something, who knows how many guests he'd be treating this way. So I walked up to him, tapped him on the shoulder and asked him his name. He told me that his name was Mark and I could in fact see that his name tag confirmed this. So I said to him, "Well Mark, I just want to let you know that you're being really rude to your guests and we don't appreciate it." His response to this was simply "Don't grab me" (apparently he interpreted my tapping him on the shoulder as a "grab"). I let him know that I was asking for his name because at the end of the ride I intended to speak to a manager about his behavior. His response... "Good for you!""
This is a perfect example of vigilantly justice. Merlin, you should have taken your complaint to Guest Relations instead of acting in such an "eye for an eye" fashion.
All ready backed it up Merlin. However, you still don't recognize the several problems you created. While the CM was rude, your behavior was criminal in nature. Are you above the law? You need to "chill out" and reflect upon your actions. Perhaps an anger management course would help you.
LOL! I appreciate the advice and am sure it was heartfelt.
But I should probably clarify a few points:
First, the issue of riding in the front. It is honestly not simply a case of "oh boy, we GET TO ride in the front!". For both my wife and me, it is truly UNCOMFORTABLE sitting anywhere but the front on this ride. So for us it is literally the only option. Sorry to sound like wimps, but the last time we sat in the back, it wasn't simply less fun, it was extremely unpleasant. That's the reason we make this request. I understand how this request might be perceived as otherwise. And I would have been happy to explain this to the CM had I been given the opportunity. But it never got to that point. He immediately jumped to being rude about it. If he was making assumptions about the reasons behind our request, then he needs to work on his listening skills (There are training courses for this).
Second, the possibility that he may have been dealing with something in his personal life. I happen to know that Disney places a great emphasis on the concept of "onstage" versus "backstage" (I believe I may have already commented on this). But basically it means that you leave your personal issues backstage. When you're onstage, you play a role. And that role is a friendly, courteous individual....Not a person who is having trouble paying bills or was dumped by his girlfriend. Someone else on this thread mentioned the concept of "leaving the briefcase at home" when you're on vacation and that's good advice. But by the same token, when a person is at work (particularly when that work involves dealing with customers), then he/she needs to leave the personal stuff out of it. All that aside, though, this CM didn't exactly strike me as someone who was "having a bad day". Granted, I don't know him personally (and based on his behavior, he's not someone I would WANT to know), but his demeanor and attitude were more of a bullying nature than simply a person reacting to something in his personal life. As I've mentioned a number of times now, he really seemed to be on a power trip. He never indicated that he was mad or annoyed with us.
Third, you mention that only dealing with 1 bad CM in 4 years isn't bad. And I agree 100%. I think that's pretty darn good. And I think that 99.9999% of the CMs I encounter at WDW are phenomenal. So does that mean I should just let this go? I don't feel that I should. You ask what I hope to accomplish by tracking down his manager as though you assume I'm out for revenge or something. That's not my goal. My goal is to do MY part to prevent other guests from encountering this type of behavior. Did you know that 68% of people who have a bad experience with an organization never complain about it? Instead, they simply take their business elsewhere. For this reason, organizations wish that they WOULD complain so that the organization has an opportunity to do something about it. That's exactly what I want to do...Give Disney the opportunity to do something about it. If I owned a business and I had 10 employees, and 9 of them were phenomenal and one of them was really rude, you can bet I would absolutely want to know about it.
Hopefully this clarifies my situation. I appreciate you sharing your opinion with me though.
You know, it's interesting that you use the term "anger management". I have been thinking that your reaction to this reminds me of that scene in the movie "Anger Management" where Adam Sandler is calmly asking for a pillow or something and the stewardess is saying, "Don't raise your voice to me sir!" LOL
That movie is a comedy and those characters are intended to be humorous because no one really acts like that in real life. I guess there ARE people who react that way though. Scary.
<i>Jerry Seinfeld to George Costanza: "We're trying to have a civilization here."</i>
TIGGER-FAN
New Member
Originally posted by Woody13
Originally posted by Pixie Duster
I've learn to regard Woody13's comment as either sarcasm or stupidity.
Case law, or rulings in individual cases, is as clear as a bell. The Florida Supreme Court and the U.S. Supreme Court have both reached decisions affirming people's right to refuse unwanted touching. People in the United States have rights to self determination. I'll let you parse the case law on your own.
Don't blame me. I don't make the law. If you don't like the law then petition your legislature to make changes. This is not a debate.
When you have a case based on the law, then argue the law. When you have a case based upon the facts, the argue the facts. When you have a case based upon neither, then muddy the waters.
Throws hands up in the air (I guess some people know more than others and want everyone else to think like them). Next time a good citizen of my county shakes my hand and thanks me for a job well done maybe I should arrest them because they "intentionaly touched me". I do not know where you live, but I can tell you one thing, I definately would not want to live their because it sounds like a police state to me. I mean why else would you act this way. All Merlin did was express a legitimate concern over his treatment by a CM. You with out having been there attack him and accuse him of being a criminal. To Merlin, do not take what this guy says to heart, he has yet to back up any of his claimed case law. THis thread has gotten way out of control.
TIGGER-FAN
New Member
:brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick:
TIGGER-FAN
New Member
You might want to take your own advice!
lebernadin
New Member
I think i left my geometry textbook in my locker. If i had it, maybe i'd be able to understand this tangent.
niteobsrvr
Well-Known Member
I sincerely hope you will follow up with your response from Disney when you get it. My suspicion is that you will receive (in order of likelyhood):
1. A form Letter that appears personalized
or
2. A form Letter that appears personalized and some free stuff.
or
3. A phone call from a Guest Relations CM
or
4. A call from ther person to who you actually adressed the letter.
I wish that system of customer inquiry response was different especially at Disney but the reality is many companies don't even get to option one anymore.
tazhughes
Member
Tigger-Fan if you had been the officer responding and closed it out you would have been wrong. You are a police officer not an officer of the court and it is not your role to interpret the law. What Merlin did was in fact a Battery and if you need a couple "big" cases to read on topic try Vosburg v. Putney (a landmark case on the issue where a child tapped another child with his foot under a desk) or White v. University of Idaho (a professor 'played piano' [ie. lightly tapped] on the back of a student and the court held the claim valid despite lack of intent to harm or offend). Now that we have established that there is some validity to Woody's claim (though I hate agreeing with him) the reality is that these claims hold up on the civil side and a judge or prosecutor (again not a police officer) will likely dismiss unless there is more to this then Merlin is telling us like the force with which he tapped. Hwever if the CM wanted to bring a civil suit there would be a line of lawyers to take up the case especially since Disney would be enjoined in this case as well. The 2 lessons here: 1.don't touch strangers especially if you and that stranger have been confrontational and 2. Police officers should not try to make decisions that should be left to court officers or juries.
no2apprentice
Well-Known Member
Those cases cited above are civil, not criminal. They also occured in a different states, not Florida. They do not apply to Florida criminal statutes. See if you can find some Florida State Appellant or State Supreme Court decisions defining battery.
And if TIGGER-FAN had responded to a situation that Merlin had described, he would have made EXACTLY the right decision by not taking any action. It's called the spirit of the law. If the letter of the law was strictly enforced, the courts and jails would be overrun, and the attorneys would be retiring at age 45.
If I had written a ticket for every violation I observed, then I would not be doing my badge any justice. What would you rather have for having a taillight out...a ticket or a verbal warning?
And if TIGGER-FAN had responded to a situation that Merlin had described, he would have made EXACTLY the right decision by not taking any action. It's called the spirit of the law. If the letter of the law was strictly enforced, the courts and jails would be overrun, and the attorneys would be retiring at age 45.
If I had written a ticket for every violation I observed, then I would not be doing my badge any justice. What would you rather have for having a taillight out...a ticket or a verbal warning?