Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Yet people still crowd around the lagoon each night to watch it and have for the past 11 months. , you're a funny one, marni.
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News Reflections of Earth confirmed to be replaced by Harmonious
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
Horizons '83
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
Fixed that for you
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Horizons pfp, cute
Actually, you've worked up the fact checker crowd. There are those who've seen the less than stellar guest reviews. You blithely say everyone loves it with no proof.Looks like I've offended the Illuminations crowd again. I quite enjoy seeing people get worked up over a dead firework show
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Everyone that I know outside of the internet that has seen the show has had nothing but positive to things about it (family and friends). My schools orchestra, chorus, and band groups got to go in March and all most of them could talk about was Harmonious.
Clearly more people enjoy the show than the Epcot boomers are willing to admit.
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Also it's funny how ya'll hate how data-driven Chapek is but when Marni does it it's cool
Clearly you still don't have access to internal polls and reject the results when it's reported to you. You rely instead on anecdotal evidence of 'people you know.' The people you know are not a representative sample of all guests.
It's clear you don't understand how polling works.
Also it's funny how ya'll hate how data-driven Chapek is but when Marni does it it's cool
Data is data. I don't hate or love what is factual when it is presented as: Here's the facts.
It's people with an emotional response to the significance of that data who will ignore or twist it to make it say what they want to say.
Martin isn't "data driven." It's clear you don't know that that means. It means making decisions based on the actual data. Martin's not in a position to make decisions about Disney based on the facts he receives.
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
You want to talk about facts so let's talk facts. Illuminations isn't coming back and whining about it is not gonna change that. Tag me when there are plans to retire Harmonious to bring back the globe show.
Who's making the argument that Illuminations is coming back? Please quote them, otherwise people might think you just make stuff up!!
mattpeto
Well-Known Member
It is my understanding that Illuminations didn't have good survey results either FWIW.
Epcot82Guy
Well-Known Member
So this is a great example of Disney Data.
It actually had solid numbers still, let alone for a show of its age. It was declining (though somewhat slowly). And the complaints (the middle section mostly) were clear as I understood.
Plus, the correct comparison would be I:ROE in 1999-2000 to Harmonious today. That is not even a question in Illuminations significant favor.
Again, taking something at the end with 9 years after it's expected run time against surveys for a brand new show with a massive budget and advertising budget isn't the best data science, I would argue. The ROI with maintenance and operations vs development, build and operations shifts the calculation dramatically. To be fair, it should have been a brand new, redone I:ROE with Harmonious budget vs what we got. I know that's impossible, but that would properly control for variables. But corporate data isn't always about scientific and true results.
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
...what are you even talking about?
The point is that Harmonious isn't doing very well in guest surveys and so it's likely going to change. Illuminations is essentially irrelevant to the discussion.
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
No matter how much Harmonious changes ya'll will complain . The happiest place on earth has the unhappiest fanbase on earth.
mousekedoc
Premium Member
I think these discussions bring to the surface a frustration we all have.
Disney World in the past was a destination you arrived to with little to no planning. You walked in and at every turn there was something unique and entertaining. It was magical for that reason. Now, everything has to be planned. It’s a pressure cooker to get it all in. And Disney is spending money but In ways that disappoint many. The Epcot night time spectacular is a pristine example. Who wants a bunch of ugly black barges in the middle of the park? Does it have unique elements, or is it rehashed shlock?
I LOVED Illuminations. Harmonious?
I liked Malstrom, but my daughter LOVES Frozen. My wife LOVES Ratatouille. The parks are changing for bad and good. I’m going to enjoy the good.
For the $, it’s still cheaper, per hour, than going to an NHL or NFL game. It’s still a good value, relative to the cost of other forms of entertainment.
And for the love of God, will someone please do something with nighttime entertainment at Animal Kingdom.
Disney World in the past was a destination you arrived to with little to no planning. You walked in and at every turn there was something unique and entertaining. It was magical for that reason. Now, everything has to be planned. It’s a pressure cooker to get it all in. And Disney is spending money but In ways that disappoint many. The Epcot night time spectacular is a pristine example. Who wants a bunch of ugly black barges in the middle of the park? Does it have unique elements, or is it rehashed shlock?
I LOVED Illuminations. Harmonious?
I liked Malstrom, but my daughter LOVES Frozen. My wife LOVES Ratatouille. The parks are changing for bad and good. I’m going to enjoy the good.
For the $, it’s still cheaper, per hour, than going to an NHL or NFL game. It’s still a good value, relative to the cost of other forms of entertainment.
And for the love of God, will someone please do something with nighttime entertainment at Animal Kingdom.
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
What's your point? What people say on this forum doesn't matter; Disney's internal guest surveys absolutely do matter.
You're the one claiming everyone except people on this forum love the show.
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Be honest with yourself, if Harmonious was hated as you and the others pretend it is, do you really think Disney would have ignored that. Let's take Enchantment. That show has gone through plenty of changes because of how much the show flopped originally. Laser effects have been modified/added, musical sequences changed, pyro changed/improved, whole 2 minute segment of show is added, new narration.
The most change Harmonious has had was some rearranged pyro and fountain sequence changes for Coco.
On top of that it's clear Disney themselves favor Harmonious for marketing and that's for a reason. Enchantment didn't get a Disney+ special. That alone is telling. A hated show doesn't get a Disney+ special. People favor Harmonious over Enchantment and they know that. Enchantment needed lots of change because people genuinely do hate that show (or at least did in the past). Even people who hate Harmonious prefer it to Enchantment.
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Now if Disney ends up completely revamping Harmonious into a new show and that's the reason no major changes have been made to Harmonious, then I will admit my previous point is wrong.
BatStang2000
Active Member
For the record and for the thousandth time. Disney Land is the happiest place on earth. Walt Disney World is the most magical place on earth. Or so it is advertised, anyway.
Vinnie Mac
Well-Known Member
Well recently they've both shared the title of most expensive place on earth so there's that.
mattpeto
Well-Known Member
I tend to feel like AK will prioritize attractions before putting a nighttime show back but I hope I’m wrong.