News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[Asilgrass1]

No offense (but actually yes) there are hundreds of threads to see news about the happiest place on earth. The fact is many posters do not consider this change to be good news .

Posts are being edited or deleted when they become TOO political (accepting that the whole issue is political) and posts that "attack" the Governor are weeded out - eventually.

Sorry I was busy for a couple of hours cleaning house so I couldn't clean the forum. It has happened before, and will happen again. The fact that a post is not deleted doesn't mean it is acceptable - most of the time it means I just haven't seen it yet.

I apologize if you are the moderator of this forum because I have no complaint with you. This forum is what it is and I generally stay off it because I have no desire to hear this stuff. I understand it’s concerning but I have zero dogs in this race and there is enough negativity on the news coming from all sides. I wasn’t complaining about the forum. I was complaining about the app. WDWMAGIC is an app where I go for cheerful Disney headlines, and I’m not getting that. In the last two days, 6 out of 12 headlines have concerned the CFTOD. I feel that whoever is organizing the app should strongly consider a separate space for these headlines. However, I’ve obviously wandered into a discussion where my voice is not wanted so I will happily exit.

 

[Disstevefan1]

If Disney did give them away, that would be a conflict of interests. The fact that they charged and the RCID paid and that it was all done in the open is what makes it all above-board despite how the current board wants to paint it.

Yea, there was NO conflicts of interest between RCID and WDW

 

[GrumpyFan]

A discount program would never have the same value as the benefit being removed. They could try to craft it to fill the gap between what was lost and any cash value employees are getting instead. But, it all sounds silly. Disney has a program to allow employers to provide this benefit. CFTOD is choosing not to.

True, mainly because the benefit was probably provided pre-tax or perhaps even included as a perk that would exclude it from being taxed.

Beyond that, they would need to craft who a new discount program is available too. Creating one that's specifically for "CFTOD Employees" and nobody else would likely run into the same direct employee gifting issues.

By most statutes, a discount does not equal a gift.
According to the US Dept of Labor:

Gifts​

What Is a Gift? - 5 C.F.R. § 2635.203(b) and (c)
A gift is anything that has monetary value that you obtain for less than “market value.” The gift might be tangible or intangible. A gift may include, but is not limited to, a gratuity, favor, discount, cash, gift certificate, gift card, entertainment, hospitality, loan, forbearance, or other item having monetary value. It also applies to services, training, transportation, travel, lodging, and meals. See 5 C.F.R. § 2635.203(b).

Exclusions: Some Things Are Not Gifts

Some items are excluded from the definition of gift, and you may accept them pursuant to certain specific regulatory exclusions.

• Modest items of food and non-alcoholic refreshments such as soft drinks, coffee, and donuts, not offered as part of a meal.
• Greeting cards and items of little intrinsic value such as plaques, certificates, or trophies, which are intended primarily for presentation.
• Prizes in contests open to the general public.
• Commercial discounts available to the general public or to all Government employees.
• Commercial loans, pensions, and similar benefits on terms available to the general public.
• Anything for which you pay fair market value.
• Anything that is paid for by the Government.
• Free attendance provided by the sponsor of an event to which you have been assigned to present information on behalf of the agency.

Discounts and similar benefits that are offered to the public, other groups that you belong to, or to all Government employees.

This exception includes favorable rates offered to all Federal employees even when you are off duty. It also includes favorable rates and commercial discounts offered to members of a group or class in which membership is unrelated to Federal employment.


As I mentioned before, MANY companies (theme parks, hotels, phone companies, etc.) already offer such discounts to government, military, first reponders, etc. It's not a violation.

 

[Ghost93]

I apologize if you are the moderator of this forum because I have no complaint with you. This forum is what it is and I generally stay off it because I have no desire to hear this stuff. I understand it’s concerning but I have zero dogs in this race and there is enough negativity on the news coming from all sides. I wasn’t complaining about the forum. I was complaining about the app. WDWMAGIC is an app where I go for cheerful Disney headlines, and I’m not getting that. In the last two days, 6 out of 12 headlines have concerned the CFTOD. I feel that whoever is organizing the app should strongly consider a separate space for these headlines. However, I’ve obviously wandered into a discussion where my voice is not wanted so I will happily exit.

If you don't desire to hear political stuff, why did you look at this thread at all? The subject matter is inherently political.



And while we would all love to escape from the news, the sad reality is that the Disney company IS caught up in a political storm and the situation is having a negative impact on all aspects of the company.

 

[Asilgrass1]

If you don't desire to hear political stuff, why did you look at this thread at all? The subject matter is inherently political.


And while we would all love to escape from the news, the sad reality is that the Disney company IS caught up in a political storm and the situation is having a negative impact on all aspects of the company.

I didn’t! I came here to complain about the app! I understand I made a mistake. That’s why I apologized.

However, as I’ve stated multiple times, the WDWMAGIC app has had 6 out of 12 headlines in two days pertaining to CFTOB. I don’t understand why this app can’t put these headlines under one banner so people who don’t want to see them don’t have to, but obviously I came to the wrong place to voice my concerns.

 

[Just JBC]

How did it take the board this long to figure out what in their employees compensation package. Sometimes I think they're phoning it in, we know one is

This has been my biggest question since the press release claiming that in 2022 they spent over 2.5 million on tickets and discounts - but then attached a bill dated 12/31/21, which was for FY Q1 2022 tickets with net 30 payment terms. Assuming quarterly billing continued, shouldn't they have know about this well before now? And why would they attach that bill rather than a more recent one?

In the 2023 budget there are a two line items that are big enough to absorb these costs. They are "employee relations" at 3.15 million and "outside fees and services" at 19.17 million. Assuming it's paid under EE relations, then nearly the entire budget is placed in admin which may give the new board the right to eliminate this perk of employment.

In watching this mornings press conference there was a statement that the firefighters union negotiated their contact and CFTOD couldn't change that. But no actual confirmation whether firefighters would keep/lose the benefit. And then later a statement that they hadn't decided what to do about retirees.

To mix metaphors, I feel like they've shown a lot of smoke and mirrors but not much fire. Either the firefighters (and possibly retirees) get to keep this perk - in which case the actual impact will be on less than 1/2 the workforce and the savings will be minimal or they don't - in which case they should have said that explicitly rather than boast about how good the union attorneys were.

 

[Asilgrass1]

This is where you should have gone to make your concerns known about the app.

Forum Help & Announcements

Help with the WDWMAGIC Forums

forums.wdwmagic.com

Thank you so much! This is useful information. I will go there right away and stay off this forum.

 

[tissandtully]

I didn’t! I came here to complain about the app! I understand I made a mistake. That’s why I apologized.

However, as I’ve stated multiple times, the WDWMAGIC app has had 6 out of 12 headlines in two days pertaining to CFTOB. I don’t understand why this app can’t put these headlines under one banner so people who don’t want to see them don’t have to, but obviously I came to the wrong place to voice my concerns.

Maybe people shouldn't be so sheltered about what's happening between govt and private businesses? It's a pretty big story and the implication if HUGE for everyone else if this doesn't go in Disney's favor.

 

[Splash4eva]

It's a cash equivalent, and at the going rate of tickets it adds up quickly. 2 adult and 2 child Incredipasses are almost $6000. But the Disney Main Entrance Pass also allows for the inclusion of a Grandparent, a kid's friend, a visiting cousin, etc. Disney charges between $184-$247 per 1-day park hopper. So another $1K for every 5ish visits you might bring someone else. When you are making $50K a year a $7000 admission benefit is the equivalent of 14% of your salary, tax free. For a middle class, blue-collar worker being able to make that happen for your family? Don't speak for them and say it's not life altering.

Again. You are missing my point. It is a luxury “perk/benefit”. Im not saying its okay for them to lose it etc. but to say its life altering to me is non sense. Losing medical or increased cost where someone needs ro choose between paying rent/food/gas etc vs medical. Thats life altering not having to decide whether one goes to Disney parks…

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

Again. You are missing my point. It is a luxury “perk/benefit”. Im not saying its okay for them to lose it etc. but to say its life altering to me is non sense. Losing medical or increased cost where someone needs ro choose between paying rent/food/gas etc vs medical. Thats life altering not having to decide whether one goes to Disney parks…

You're pushing a false narrative that anyone objecting to the loss of theme park passes isn't more concerned with losing those other benefits you cite.

One being critical of this move should not be interpreted to mean one isn't also critical of those other things.

Things that are not on topic and therefore cannot be discussed here. Don't assume anyone feels one way or the other when it comes to comparing different benefits of employment.

 

[Isamar]

Kinda surprised this apparently wasn’t covered in the union agreement as a benefit. I wonder what that thought behind that was.

This is in the copy of the agreement attached to last month’s meeting package. I’d be interested in whether this was a standard clause already used in other agreements, or was it new?

 

[GrumpyFan]

This is in the copy of the agreement attached to last month’s meeting package. I’d be interested in whether this was a standard clause already used in other agreements, or was it new?View attachment 738986

The last sentence of the first paragraph is crucial.

The contract specifically says that the prevailing rights clause does not include “benefits afforded to employees by the District as a result of its interface with Walt Disney World Co.”. It specifically says that Main Gate Passes like the ones stripped from District employees by CFTOD would not be included.
That's a real kick in the teeth for employees of the district. At least the ones who used it.

 

[flynnibus]

For instance, how would you generically describe a group that includes all the CFTOD employees but not the Orange County Tax Assessor? I'm sure Disney is plenty happy to sell the existing plan to Orange County if they want to provide passes as a benefit. But, do they really want a discount program that seems to target that guy? They don't even like that guy.

You do it like the state did... "For people who drive, or ride on yellow or red fire fighting vehicles that are specifically tasked with servicing more than one county, that start with the letter O"

 

[flynnibus]

Again. You are missing my point. It is a luxury “perk/benefit”. Im not saying its okay for them to lose it etc. but to say its life altering to me is non sense. Losing medical or increased cost where someone needs ro choose between paying rent/food/gas etc vs medical. Thats life altering not having to decide whether one goes to Disney parks…

How about people that get free tuition for themselves or family due to their employment? You're not gonna not eat or die because you don't have free tuition, but it's a crazy valuable benefit that would probably be a key decision point in working at employer A vs B. Kinda like district employees and FRs who chose to work for the district... vs somewhere else.

 

[Unbanshee]

This is in the copy of the agreement attached to last month’s meeting package. I’d be interested in whether this was a standard clause already used in other agreements, or was it new?View attachment 738986

From here

Reedy Creek Firefighter Contract Clause Specifically Enabled Oversight District the Ability to Strip Away Theme Park Passes

A closer look at the provision in the recently signed union contract that allows the removal of Annual Passes for Disney World firefighters

blogmickey.com

 

[JAB]

Perhaps not, but I still think Disney could (should?) create a discount program for them and it wouldn't violate any kind of legal, benefit s policies or ethics programs. Many companies offer these for specific sectors of employment including government, teachers, first responders, residents, etc.

If the firefighters got their new contract, and Disney offered to compensate them for their lost passes with discounts, they'd sort of get to have their cake and eat it, too, which is maybe not the message Disney wants to send. The situation feels like "You made your bed, now lie in it." If I were Disney, I'd want them to feel the sting of their hasty decision to back CFTOD, assuming that they would be better to work with than RCID. If they start to feel that CFTOD is worse to deal with than RCID was, that works in Disney's favor. In addition, I'm not sure Disney would offer a discount large enough to compensate for the lost benefit, since it would likely have to be offered to all firefighters, not just RCFD to avoid the appearance of impropriety.

 

[Stripes]

The last sentence of the first paragraph is crucial.

The contract specifically says that the prevailing rights clause does not include “benefits afforded to employees by the District as a result of its interface with Walt Disney World Co.”. It specifically says that Main Gate Passes like the ones stripped from District employees by CFTOD would not be included.
That's a real kick in the teeth for employees of the district. At least the ones who used it.

I suppose many of the firefighters will be upset with their union considering it was this new agreement that paved the way for CFTOD to get rid of the benefits.

Without this agreement, CFTOD would be bound by their prior union contract to continue paying for the park benefits.

I’m sure some firefighters wanted to work for RCID specifically for the park perks so that has to hurt.

I wonder if Disney will give the retired firefighters that had 15 years of service the benefits anyway. Now that they’re retired, I don’t think that would run afoul of any laws.

 

[Splash4eva]

How about people that get free tuition for themselves or family due to their employment? You're not gonna not eat or die because you don't have free tuition, but it's a crazy valuable benefit that would probably be a key decision point in working at employer A vs B. Kinda like district employees and FRs who chose to work for the district... vs somewhere else.

Again you are comparing a free tuition which is far from a “luxury” as free theme park tickets and if im not mistaken they are still handing money out for tickets correct? Based on what i have read in this thread? Goes back to one of my original post tho. If you dont like it. You find another job or you can choose to accept it. Sadly in this environment most people dont have the capacity to just quit/find another better paying job because unfortunately there are not that many around

 

[flynnibus]

Again you are comparing a free tuition which is far from a “luxury” as free theme park tickets and if im not mistaken they are still handing money out for tickets correct? Based on what i have read in this thread? Goes back to one of my original post tho. If you dont like it. You find another job or you can choose to accept it. Sadly in this environment most people dont have the capacity to just quit/find another better paying job because unfortunately there are not that many around

I'm responding to your point that it's not like it's life or death... so whats the big deal. That argument is weak. Benefits make up generally 30% of any regular employee's compensation package. They are not insignificant, nor are they immaterial to a decision in where people work. Even if the benefit is a 'luxury' or just a perk.

So yes, if you don't like it, just get another job. But to focus on that alone is to conveniently ignore the decision process that was made when the employee decided to work there, and the reasoning for why the perk is being removed now.

So congrats to you.. yes, you can make any employment topic a "just leave" point, but it doesn't make the rest of the conversation irrelevant, nor does it justify you ignoring the impact it had previously. Including people who just went through a major contract renegotiation with an assumption that the decades long perk was still in play.... because the other side kept reiterating to you how public safety is the #1 topic for the district.

Well now they learned it's not #1, #1 is trying to stick it to disney.

 

[Disstevefan1]

The litigation with Disney will cost CFTOD (aka the taxpayers) 4.5 Million dollars in FY24.

The litigation costs are just under 2 million for FY23.

Some lawyers are getting rich from this useless fight.

As we see with the way Disney spends money on its failing movies, this is barely noticeable to them.