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[DCLcruiser]

Strange World and Lightyear and Encanto. You can argue they never lost the company money thanks to ancillary(strange world definitely did) but they are underperformers by far of what they should have been. This is why Sing 2, PussnBoots and Mario have all. smashed them.

The Willow seires, yeah I don't get why they picked that cult following either, has been on Disney Plus for less than a year and is going deleted completey.

Also, who cares about the fallacy of other businesses doing it? Disney is its own goal too. They are not healthy.

SW and Lightyear were sabotaged by politics and fear mongering. Not because they were bad movies. Encanto, is one of the most popular current IP. It looks like it brought it more than it's budget, perhaps global?

Willow, I haven't seen. I am slightly too young for the original.

Other businesses exist in the same world, with similar problems. The economy is uncertain, streamers are struggling to overcome their budgets, etc. It is not unreasonable to view DIS vs peers in the current climate, not within a vacuum.

 

[MisterPenguin]

In the last quarter, TWDC net profited $1.2B. For the *quarter.*

At that rate, TWDC will net profit $4.8B per year.

In ten years, that's $48B.

That's enough to easily invest $17B in capex at WDW, buy out Comcast's stake in Hulu for $10B and have $21B left over. {$31B if you add in the current cash on hand.}

And that's with D+ currently throwing a deficit, which will continue to decrease until it's throwing a surplus sometime next year.

 

[celluloid]

Highly unlikely - probably more to do with royalty arrangements, or future promotions, or similar. Storage space is basically like water to them. Expensive when viewing the whole - but basically free by the cup.

You think Harmonious Live had a lot of royalties to pay?

What about Willow? A show that was just produced. Are they that fearful of the writer strike?

Pennies and drops in the bucket are how executives keep their bonuses and companies healthy.

 

[celluloid]

In the last quarter, TWDC net profited $1.2B. For the *quarter.*

At that rate, TWDC will net profit $4.8B per year.

In ten years, that's $48B.

That's enough to easily invest $17B in capex at WDW, buy out Comcast's stake in Hulu for $10B and have $21B left over. {$31B if you add in the current cash on hand.}

And that's with D+ currently throwing a deficit, which will continue to decrease until it's throwing a surplus sometime next year.

17 to WDW
10 B to Comcast

Let's give 2 billion to Disney Plus to be generous.

That would be
23 left over to DL, HK DL, Shanghai DL, DL Paris.

Not to mention investment for other ventures and divisons.

I see, so Disney is going to become one of those 501c3 deals. ;-)

 

[flynnibus]

You think Harmonious Live had a lot of royalties to pay?

What about Willow? A show that was just produced. Are they that fearful of the writer strike?

Pennies and drops in the bucket are how executives keep their bonuses and companies healthy.

I'm just responding to the idea that pulling a dozen shows is somehow going to be about saving storage costs... It's probably more about productizing and focus. Dunno.. it's highly unlikely to be technical issue and more about strategy or liabilities.

 

[celluloid]

I'm just responding to the idea that pulling a dozen shows is somehow going to be about saving storage costs... It's probably more about productizing and focus. Dunno.. it's highly unlikely to be technical issue and more about strategy or liabilities.

Why is it mutually exclusive?
It is quite expensive to host material for millions of people to be able to watch.


Whatever it is, it is not a sign of healthy business.

 

[flynnibus]

Why is it mutually exclusive?
It is quite expensive to host material for millions of people to be able to watch.

It's expensive to build a network to do so - yes. It's not expensive to add one more show to it... nor do you really save anything for pulling one off. The expensive portion is the live and caching layers... not the layered storage behind it.

Youtube is taking in more new hours of video every MINUTE than Disney is looking to pull here

Whatever it is, it is not a sign of healthy business.

Adapting is the sign of leadership - what you should be scared of is people who drive the car into the wall.

 

[mikejs78]

It is quite expensive to host material for millions of people to be able to watch.

No, it's not expensive at all. Hosting is cheap.

I did read somewhere else that Harmonious did have royalty issues - maybe with the musicians, outside firms that helped with the show, etc.

Other shows like Willow, maybe they think they can make more farming it out to another streaming service like Pluto TV or something.

 

[celluloid]

Youtube is taking in more new hours of video every MINUTE than Disney is looking to pull here

Big differences here is that most of Youtube's content is user created, and they give pennies of ad revenue to them.
Youtube has around 2.5 billion per Disney's steady 118 million worldwide. youtube makes over 10 billion a year. They can afford it and don't have to make tough decisions because business is very healthy.

Adapting is the sign of leadership - what you should be scared of is people who drive the car into the wall.

Adapting is a sign of leadership. It does not mean that business is healthy.

 

[GoofGoof]

No one said nothoing. I said status quo. I expect a theme park to get a new atraction every two years and every other to be a large scale ticketed attraction, rather than a retheme or use of one that it replaced and shares a building. The most visited theme park in the world got two ground to open built rides in the last decade. No debate about it. ha.

The point is they say investing 17 billion because it sounds like good PR, but it is status quo.

Some of your list go past a decade too. So your list is a little inflated.

For example, Tron opened this year. Little Mermaid opened in 2012.

Toy Story Mania opened in 2008. I don't think a track capacity expansion is fair to say as a list of new things in what one would think, but it is there.


Not even going into all the closures and reductions.

If you think that costs will go down and executives to front of the line and contactors will accept less pay, than yeah, we could get some neat stuff.

They just don't know how anymore.

I think you are splitting hairs a bit. LM opened Nov 2012 and Tron opened April 2023 so 10 years and 6 months apart and only because Covid delayed Tron which should have been open for the 50th. They are saying $17B in the next decade which is a rough estimate of time. I don’t think they mean exactly 10 years from now.

I agree that $17B is not an increase over the last decade. After inflation it’s about exactly what was spent. I made the list to show exactly what we got for that amount of money. It wasn’t to debate what was a new ride vs a refurbishment or what they should have spent. Money spent is money spent so $100M for a new ride from the ground up or $100M to retheme Splash Mountain is the same $100M spent. Adding a 2nd dumbo or another track to TSMM still costs money. It’s part of what we got for the $15B spent. I probably left off some stuff too like another theater for Soarin and failed stuff like Harmonius or Rivers of Light. My point is the $17B represents a run rate based on the last decade but that isn’t getting nothing. They will likely close stuff too, but that has no bearing on what will be added for the $17B.

So in the last decade (10 years and 6 months )it was 4 new lands (2 rides in each land): FLE, Pandora, Galaxy’s Edge and Toy Story Land plus 2 headliner rides in EPCOT and 1 in MK and some capacity additions like TSMM and Soarin and rethemes with Frozen and Great Mickey Ride. They also doubled Disney Springs and built the skyliner and a bunch of DVC resorts. So if we get the status quo from the last decade which we agree is what the $17B represents then we should get something similar in the next 10 years. Anyone expecting more will likely be disappointed. This is about the most we can expect.

 

[peter11435]

In the last quarter, TWDC net profited $1.2B. For the *quarter.*

At that rate, TWDC will net profit $4.8B per year.

In ten years, that's $48B.

That's enough to easily invest $17B in capex at WDW, buy out Comcast's stake in Hulu for $10B and have $21B left over. {$31B if you add in the current cash on hand.}

And that's with D+ currently throwing a deficit, which will continue to decrease until it's throwing a surplus sometime next year.

And don’t forget that profit was already after cap ex was taken out.

 

[celluloid]

I think you are splitting hairs a bit. LM opened Nov 2012 and Tron opened April 2023 so 10 years and 6 months apart and only because Covid delayed Tron which should have been open for the 50th. They are saying $17B in the next decade which is a rough estimate of time. I don’t think they mean exactly 10 years from now.

Ten years is ten years.

Covid did not slow down Tron. It was a choice. Theme Parks still opened things on time as soon as Covid was done. The thing was not cycling until well after.

They should mean it. Ten years to 11 years at 17 billion dollars is quite substantially less for each of the ten that came before it.

If you want to play the split the hairs outlook on it. Magic Kingdom only has had two(three of you count LM) ground up attractions in the last decade. And only netted one since 1998, with other venues still shuttered without a replacement.

If you want to play the splitting hairs outlook on finances, ten years more stretched to about 11 means they are spending the same or less budget than the last ten years.

The point being I agree. The status quo is nothing to get excited about if you are disappointed or only slightly happy with the last ten.

 

[GoofGoof]

Ten years is ten years.

Covid did not slow down Tron. It was a choice. Theme Parks still opened things on time as soon as Covid was done. The thing was not cycling until well after.

They should mean it. Ten years to 11 years at 17 billion dollars is quite substantially less for each of the ten that came before it.

If you want to play the split the hairs outlook on it. Magic Kingdom only has had two(three of you count LM) ground up attractions in the last decade. And only netted one since 1998, with other venues still shuttered without a replacement.

If you want to play the splitting hairs outlook on finances, ten years more stretched to about 11 means they are spending the same or less budget than the last ten years.

Dude you are completely missing the point. I am not trying to argue anything about whether what they spent was good, bad or indifferent. Tron absolutely was delayed Because of Covid. Construction slowed and that’s a fact, but isn’t really relevant either so take it off the list if that makes you feel better or if you want to ignore LM since it opened more than 10 years ago do that. Who cares it doesn’t change the point either. How many rides MK netted since 1998 is irrelevant too. I am not trying to argue that Disney spent enough at WDW. The point is that spending $17B over 10 years gets you upkeep and some new stuff too. Maybe it’s new lands, new stand alone rides, refurbs of existing rides, new shopping, new resorts or new transportation. Looking at the last 10 years gives you an idea of what we could get for that money.

People are arguing that because $17B is around what was spent the last decade adjusted for inflation that its just PR spin for Disney to talk about spending that money in the next decade but imagine if Rick Scott pulled the same act that DeSantis is pulling now back in 2012 and Disney decided to halt spending on new projects at WDW back then. We would not have FLE, Pandora, Galaxy’s Edge, Toy Story Land, Tron, Guardians, Rat Ride, the skyliner, any of the rethemed or expanded rides or any of the DVC resorts opened in that time. That is what is “at risk” if Disney paused a portion of their $17B in spending. There’s no way to pause it all since a chunk of that money will be used for major maintenance and upkeep of existing attractions too.

 

[celluloid]

Dude you are completely missing the point. I am not trying to argue anything about whether what they spent was good, bad or indifferent. Tron absolutely was delayed Because of Covid. Construction slowed and that’s a fact, but isn’t really relevant either so take it off the list if that makes you feel better or if you want to ignore LM since it opened more than 10 years ago do that. Who cares it doesn’t change the point either. How many rides MK netted since 1998 is irrelevant too. I am not trying to argue that Disney spent enough at WDW. The point is that spending $17B over 10 years gets you upkeep and some new stuff too. Maybe it’s new lands, new stand alone rides, refurbs of existing rides, new shopping, new resorts or new transportation. Looking at the last 10 years gives you an idea of what we could get for that money.

I have yet to see you having one. You just keep posting like someone said nothing is coming.
Not sure what else would be discussed. No one ever said it gets you nothing.
With current leadership and costs, at best, it will get you status quo. I have said that since my first post. You are the one that has quoted and keep saying it is not nothing?

Do you know what the term means in the context I used? Maybe you think it means nothing new, but it means nothing changed from pace of the last ten.

At the end of the day, guest impact is what matters. And clearly, with Cosmic Rewind, as fun as it is, being the most expensive theme park attraction, they have ever budgeted, proves that they can't spend it as well.

 

[scottieRoss]

I have yet to see you having one. You just keep posting like someone said nothing is coming.
Not sure what else would be discussed. No one ever said it gets you nothing.
With current leadership and costs, at best, it will get you status quo. I have said that since my first post. You are the one that has quoted and keep saying it is not nothing?

Do you know what the term means in the context I used? Maybe you think it means nothing new, but it means nothing changed from pace of the last ten.

At the end of the day, guest impact is what matters. And clearly, with Cosmic Rewind, as fun as it is, being the most expensive theme park attraction, they have ever budgeted, proves that they can't spend it as well.

Dude,
You have done nothing but ramble, misstate things, and give wrong interpretations. You have continued to post that Disney is in a bad financial position and that is not correct. The only thing that is down is the stock price and that has no bearing on financial results.
But almost any person in the United States would be happy with an over 6 Billion Dollar profit. There is nothing to spin. The dollards do not lie.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Thaetrical underhwelming performances, closing a hotel, ceasing operations on operated dining options and and removing content from your streaming service does not exactly give confidence that it is rolling in.

You can have cash reserved, but you have to keep it coming back.

That interactive hotel failed because it was bad judgement on Disney's part. Somehow they thought that there were a lot of highly wealthy people that were also over the top Star Wars fans. There aren't and many of the biggest fans are not financially able to pay the rate no matter how much they liked the idea. It was ego that was unconnected to common sense that created the failure. That will not affect or stop the thousands of "others" from continuing to go to the parks.

Whatever reason they had for deciding not to continue with the Lake Nona plan is also not connected to the people that pay the fee to get into the parks. It has been presented on every news outlet I have seen to be connected with the current Disney/Florida culture war. I don't think that was the only reason, but the timing couldn't have been better. That, however, will not affect the people from continuing to go to the parks. If anything is going to do that it will be high ticket costs, park reservations, Genie and Lightening Lane. That's what stopped me. I only pay attention to the other stuff because I find it interesting not that I think Disney is in any trouble and I can pick sides over who is going to win.

Spoiler: And the winner is....

Disney

 

[GoofGoof]

I have yet to see you having one. You just keep posting like someone said nothing is coming.
Not sure what else would be discussed. No one ever said it gets you nothing.
With current leadership and costs, at best, it will get you status quo. I have said that since my first post. You are the one that has quoted and keep saying it is not nothing?

Do you know what the term means in the context I used? Maybe you think it means nothing new, but it means nothing changed from pace of the last ten.

At the end of the day, guest impact is what matters. And clearly, with Cosmic Rewind, as fun as it is, being the most expensive theme park attraction, they have ever budgeted, proves that they can't spend it as well.

In the first post you made that I quoted you questioned how earnest the statement was that Disney was planning to spend $17B over the next decade in response to someone pointing out that Disney has $48B in debt. I was pointing out that it wasn’t far fetched to assume they would sincerely plan to spend that money at WDW since it’s about what was spent the last decade adjusted for inflation but that as park fans we most likely would be disappointed at what that gets us. I then pointed out that even though a chunk will be spent on upkeep, it’s still not “nothing new”. Then I laid out what that money was spent on in the last decade as an example of what the equivalent money got us. I never implied you said nothing was coming.

 

[Stripes]

I personally think the 13,000 employees figure is more insightful than the $17 billion figure.

Anyone know how many cast members WDW had in 2013?

The Epic Universe project including hotels and additional transportation employees is apparently 14,000 new Universal employees.

 

[Figgy1]

I personally think the 13,000 employees figure is more insightful than the $17 billion figure.

Anyone know how many cast members WDW had in 2013?

The Epic Universe project including hotels and additional transportation employees is apparently 14,000.

@lentesta @marni1971 and a few others may have those figures

 

[MagicHappens1971]

I personally think the 13,000 employees figure is more insightful than the $17 billion figure.

Anyone know how many cast members WDW had in 2013?

The Epic Universe project including hotels and additional transportation employees is apparently 14,000.

It is insightful, and I’m going to assume they meant new operational roles in the parks, not including construction/temp employees.

This article details jobs created during the construction and aftermath of Galaxy’s Edge. It says that Galaxy’s Edge created 1,700 new operational jobs at Disneyland. Link

It’ll be interesting to see what the future holds, I hope they announce something soon.