News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

Wendy Pleakley

Well-Known Member
Again, we have to stop thinking about this issue in isolation. If it were some one off sideshow then maybe we could keep believing “Maybe they’re just lying.” But it’s not. It’s the centerpiece of a larger, multifaceted push that includes not just this but an assortment of other policies and legislation.

And why would they not at least try to stop projects or interfere is some other way? What do they lose if they at least give it a go?


And that’s all well and good, and he is free to say that work toward that goal as a person. He is absolutely not allowed to use the power of the state to try and force such change.

“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.”
-C. S. Lewis
Of course, but concerns about the bigger picture aren’t allowed here because it’s political.

Which is certainly the prerogative of this site, however it reminds me of the situation Disney found themselves in from the start.

How does one justify being silent in a clear cut case of right and wrong…
 

drnilescrane

Well-Known Member
How does one justify being silent in a clear cut case of right and wrong…
Because when the business as a whole is experiencing secular changes maybe the small amount of brand and political capital you have available to you is better used elsewhere.

Especially when dealing with a small minded despot who has nothing better to do than punch back.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
People need to pay closer attention to what DeSantis is actually saying about this, because he's being particularly slimy when it comes to Disney and taxes.

DeSantis has issued statements such as this:

Disney is going to pay its fair share of taxes and Disney is going to honor the debt.​

And this:

ensures that Disney pays its debts and fair share of taxes.​

Note that there is no claim that Disney has not already been paying their "fair share of taxes", only that DeSantis is going to make sure that Disney does so going forward. DeSantis is using words to complain about a problem that does not exist.

DeSantis is playing with words to mislead the uninformed into thinking that Disney is not already paying their fair share of taxes in central Florida.
And keep In mind his comment about paying their fair share of taxes was in reference to the original plan where the district was to be dissolved. The average person reading that assumes that Disney when it had RCID did not pay its fair share of taxes but Ron is fixing that now. It was lie when he said it and it came back to bite him when he changed the plan and didn’t dissolve the district. So now anyone who believed the original statement (so believed that with a special tax district Disney got a tax break) thinks he caved and let Disney keep their special district with a big tax break. People in his own party, including a special neighbor he is soon to be at odds with, are sure to point that out to anyone who will listen.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
The Jedi are to woke. ;)
Jar jar was definitely woke…..cancel him first :cool:

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flynnibus

Premium Member
Politicians are allowed to lie for “campaign speech”. They do it all the time.

Many on this board, especially those who despise DeSantis, say he’s doing this to raise funds for his presidential run.

All DeSantis’ attorneys have to say in front of a judge is, “All those public statements were to gain favor with the Republican electorate. Really, the Governor is genuinely worried that RCID gave Disney an unfair advantage over its competition in central Florida.”

Until the first evidence that there was any private negotiating happening and the same demands come up... then it's clear that it's not just show, but part of the program.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member

What kinds of decisions will DeSantis’ cronies possibly make regarding Disney?
“I’m concerned that we’re solving a problem that isn’t serious, or doesn’t really exist," Lepinski said.

Hrmm.. anyone heard that one before? :)
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
I don't get to vote for the Building Official in charge of the building department where I live but said official has power over permitting for my home. I can't sue over it because nobody gets to vote for who fills that position.
You are glossing over key distinctions - It's not a requirement that any gov agency with authority over you be elected... but for certain types, there is, including those with taxing authority.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
You are glossing over key distinctions - It's not a requirement that any gov agency with authority over you be elected... but for certain types, there is, including those with taxing authority.
When we talked about this a gazillion pages back someone posted a link to a database of FL special districts where you could filter on different criteria. When we filtered on government appointed board and authority to assess tax there were very few examples. Of the ones that did exist they all had government appointed boards that required the board members to be landowners of the district. Simple concept of no taxation without representation. These were non profits like regional medical centers and appeared to be structured that way to avoid the cost and hassle of running an election for the seats. We found no example of a special district with a board appointed by the Government that had taxing authority and allowed board members from outside the district. This one would be a first.
 

BuzzedPotatoHead89

Well-Known Member
Just a few court cases easily becomes more expensive over doing it now and avoiding the whole thing. The fallacy of appeasement is that it makes things easier in the long run when it’s always cheaper and easier to act sooner than later.
I don’t necessarily disagree, as I said several pages back in a likely deleted post relenting that this is likely a strategic mistake.

But I do think the Disney BoD/shareholders, senior leadership team, and TDO are likely to go in and presume that they are dealing with rational actors on the new RCID that they can either peel off or presumably work with. I just feel Corporate America is so conflict averse these days from a legal and enterprise risk management perspective, so this is predictable if not unfortunate.

If they bring suit I would assume they would want to make sure they have an iron clad case with damages to prove. One would hope though that they are navigating and organizing to apply pressure behind the scenes to assume they have a functional governing majority on the board.
 

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
My point is you never know what you’ll get with judges, all it takes is one judge that has a different interpretation of the law and you lose. There’s been numerous “slam dunk” cases that were lost. Freedom of religion shall not be infringed… but often is and legally can be in certain situations according to the courts, second amendment rights shall not be infringed… but often are and legally can be according to the courts.

Often cases go one way, then change on appeal to a higher court, then change again on appeal to a higher court, and then change again at the highest court. Same facts, same laws, just different interpretations of the law.
 
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mmascari

Well-Known Member
Lets say you are hired by the government
The state didn’t hire Disney, they govern the entities within RCID. That’s not the same.

If there was a FL activity that hired Disney to do something. Say a conference, hotel stays, state employee park night, or something else where the state was contracting with Disney to do something, then sure, the state could cancel that contract. Those contracts are the state doing business, not governing. They are not the same.

Although, there was a recent PA case that went the other way and said the state could not use a viewpoint as a condition of contracting. That felt like a bad decision.
 

scottieRoss

Well-Known Member
If Disney finds the situation untennable, they have recourse.
They would sue the State in Federal Court. The State does not have souvereign immunity in cases of violations of Constitutional rights so they can not escape that way. They can sue for damages (none yet) and request an injunction prohibiting the state from enforcing the section of the new law that changed the selection of the Board. Remember, despite everyone repeating it, they did not select the Board, they voted for the board consisting of landowners in the District. They voted at the rate of 1 vote per acre owned.
The Cause of Action would be the State of Florida and Ron Desantis in his official capacity along with the State Legistlature have violated their First Amendment rights by stifling their right to free speech under the First Amendment along with the Due Process clause for taking action in retribution to their exercise of their First Amendment rights. And violation of the Due Process clause by removing their right to vote for their local government.
 

Tom P.

Well-Known Member
Until the first evidence that there was any private negotiating happening and the same demands come up... then it's clear that it's not just show, but part of the program.
Political speech is protected extremely broadly, perhaps moreso than any other form of speech. Lying has been expressly ruled to be covered by the First Amendment in the context of free speech when it comes to politics. That's why there is no such thing as a false advertising charge for political ads. It is, therefore, very difficult to go into court and argue the "motivation" of a politician's actions, even if they have made clear public statements like DeSantis did. Prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he wasn't just lying to appease his base. You can't.
 

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