News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[UNCgolf]

Sounds like they've decided (realized?) just dissolving it isn't going to work for a variety of reasons so they're looking for another option.

My gut feeling is that the State of Florida can't just assume control of a local municipality without any input from the landowners etc. but it would certainly be litigated, so that may be where the legal analysis goes next.

 

[LAKid53]

Sounds like they've decided (realized?) just dissolving it isn't going to work for a variety of reasons so they're looking for another option.

My gut feeling is that the State of Florida can't just assume control of a local municipality without any input from the landowners etc. but it would certainly be litigated, so that may be where the legal analysis goes next.

It can't. There's statues that clearly say both the assets and liabilities will be assumed by the counties. And the counties cannot tax Disney differently than any other property owner without...creating a special district. Is DeSantis proposing a special corporate income tax for Disney? That too, will be litigated, as unconstitutional under Florida statute.

Clearly this legislation was rushed in 3-4 days without a thorough review of state statutes. Nor any knowledge or appreciation of municipal bonds.

 

[LAKid53]

Orlando Sentinel reporting that he wants State to control RCID? Is this new?

He wants to appoint the board members. Which will need a major rewrite of statute and could potentially affect the other 1800+ special districts.

 

[LAKid53]

Well, I would say it’s having impact. There hasn’t been a political peep from Disney since this was passed. Quiet as church mice. The stockholder conference was all smiles and smiles.

While TWDC may not be making any public comments, I can guarantee their lawyers and lobbyists have a plan.

 

[ParentsOf4]

It’s possible his legal counsel have looked into this and have charted a course of action they think they can get through the Florida Supreme Court.

His team sure as heck better have a plan to navigate Florida’s complex and restrictive (for government) Constitution.

With DeSantis escalating, it’s a real possibility that Disney eventually will need to go nuclear and pursue this on First Amendment grounds.

 

[mikejs78]

I’m not sure he’s spitballing.

It’s possible his legal counsel have looked into this and have charted a course of action they think they can get through the Florida Supreme Court.

This seems like a crazy step for DeSantis. His team sure as heck better have a plan to navigate Florida’s complex and restrictive (for government) Constitution.

With DeSantis escalating, it’s a real possibility that Disney eventually will need to go nuclear and pursue this on First Amendment grounds.

I don't think he does have a plan, tbh. The fact that he's talking about it coming after the election is telling. I also don't think that he can do what he's proposing under the FL constitution..

Not to mention the fact that the legislation that was passed, as written, likely doesn't even apply to RCID.

 

[GoofGoof]

Yes, this is new. Quoting DeSantis:

“The same people who criticize me for saying you’re punishing Disney are also saying we’re going to relieve Disney of $766 million in debt? How would that be a punishment, it makes no sense that that would be the case.”​

​

“That debt will not end up going to any of these local governments, it’s not going to go to the state government either. It’s going to absolutely be dealt with with the taxpayers who are currently in that district, and we’re going to have a proposal to make sure that’s clear, and that is 100%. And we understood that.”​

“from our perspective, any local government raising taxes is unjustifiable to do that, there’s not going to be any basis to do it, because they’re not going to have any additional liabilities, and you know what, even though there are ways where you could have local communities absorb jurisdiction over Disney, after seeing them threaten to raise taxes on their citizens, we are not going to be in a situation where we’re just going to be giving them locally, control. More likely that the state will simply assume control, and make sure that we’re able to impose the law and make sure we’re collecting the taxes.”​

Gov. DeSantis announces $125M for new nurse training programs

Gov. Ron DeSantis announced two new nurse education programs and $125 million to fund them in the coming fiscal year.

www.wfla.com

This is an escalation by DeSantis as it appears he is saying that the State of Florida will take direct control over the land previously governed by RCID.

He is trying to spin this as Disney threatening to raise taxes on their citizens??? How are they Disney’s citizens? Are people really buying this? Let me get this straight. Disney speaks out against a government policy, government passes foolish law without considering the ramifications to punish them and now that they realize it creates problems his plan is to have the state seize the property. So if I put a lawn sign out supporting his opponent will he seize my house in retaliation?

 

[GoofGoof]

It can't. There's statues that clearly say both the assets and liabilities will be assumed by the counties. And the counties cannot tax Disney differently than any other property owner without...creating a special district. Is DeSantis proposing a special corporate income tax for Disney? That too, will be litigated, as unconstitutional under Florida statute.

Clearly this legislation was rushed in 3-4 days without a thorough review of state statutes. Nor any knowledge or appreciation of municipal bonds.

Remember too that RCID had an exception that allowed them to assess taxes above the legal rate limit.

 

[LAKid53]

Remember too that RCID had an exception that allowed them to assess taxes above the legal rate limit.

Because, as a special district, they can.

 

[lazyboy97o]

It’s possible his legal counsel have looked into this and have charted a course of action they think they can get through the Florida Supreme Court.


With DeSantis escalating, it’s a real possibility that Disney eventually will need to go nuclear and pursue this on First Amendment grounds.

The whole purpose of state control is to him up the District’s business which still runs afoul of the State’s pledge to the bond holders.

That he isn’t talking the specifics of which laws Disney is not following shows he is winging it. If the problem was Disney somehow not following a law then the solution would be to address the scope and application of those laws.

 

[LAKid53]

He is trying to spin this as Disney threatening to raise taxes on their citizens??? How are they Disney’s citizens? Are people really buying this? Let me get this straight. Disney speaks out against a government policy, government passes foolish law without considering the ramifications to punish them and now that they realize it creates problems his plan is to have the state seize the property. So if I put a lawn sign out supporting his opponent will he seize my house in retaliation?

Property taxes are limited by law on a percent of assessed value, after homestead exemption for residential property. Not sure what DeSantis is saying. Reedy Creek doesn't own all of the 43 square miles that comprises WDW.

 

[LAKid53]

It’s possible his legal counsel have looked into this and have charted a course of action they think they can get through the Florida Supreme Court.

His team sure as heck better have a plan to navigate Florida’s complex and restrictive (for government) Constitution.

With DeSantis escalating, it’s a real possibility that Disney eventually will need to go nuclear and pursue this on First Amendment grounds.

The Attorney General is going to have to defend his actions in (1) state district court then (2) state district court of appeals and (3) finally state supreme court.

Unfortunately, tax payers will foot the entire bill.

 

[LAKid53]

Apologies to @DCBaker it's an Orlando Sentinel quote that was posted:


So, if I'm following here:
- The passed law dissolves the district.
- But he wants to make the state responsible for the district instead
- - Is the plan to change from dissolving the district to the state taking over the district instead?
- - Is the plan to keep the dissolution, but then the state takes over the counties?

I would assume the governing law and people subject to it who currently have the power to select their government will have something to say about the state taking it over to spite one of the taxpayers within the boarders.

He's referred to it as "Disney's debt", but it's not really. It's "RCID's debt". Debt RCID already pays by taxing within it's boarders. So, now he wants to take over and increase those taxes for just some of the groups within the boarders?

Did I follow that or miss something?

As the state coming in and taking over a local government because they don't like what one of groups under that jurisdiction is saying is quite the platform. Maybe he'll take over for Miami City or the Keys next.


Nah, he's not going to seize your house that's to obvious. He's going to dissolve and take over your local government that you pay taxes to and vote on representation. Then, deny you that representation because of the take over. Finally, pass new taxing rules using the authority of the dissolved but taken over government (not sure how both of those can be true, just go with it) to punish you and everyone else within the boarders. Just trying to seize your house would be to obviously bad.

Assuming this plan is even possible, and if it is actually implemented. How will any government within FL ever do business, borrow money, or attract new companies again? The precedent will be the state can take over at any time and change the rules if they don't like you.

No, you've got it right. However, it will require major changes to Florida statute that could be subsequently struck down as unconstitutional. More importantly, what he's proposing will require an amendment to the Florida Constitution...first will be abolishment of the Home Rule Powers Act and effectively gut Chapter 166 of the Florida Statutes. This requires a vote by Floridians.

 

[LAKid53]

Apologies to @DCBaker it's an Orlando Sentinel quote that was posted:


So, if I'm following here:
- The passed law dissolves the district.
- But he wants to make the state responsible for the district instead
- - Is the plan to change from dissolving the district to the state taking over the district instead?
- - Is the plan to keep the dissolution, but then the state takes over the counties?

I would assume the governing law and people subject to it who currently have the power to select their government will have something to say about the state taking it over to spite one of the taxpayers within the boarders.

He's referred to it as "Disney's debt", but it's not really. It's "RCID's debt". Debt RCID already pays by taxing within it's boarders. So, now he wants to take over and increase those taxes for just some of the groups within the boarders?

Did I follow that or miss something?

As the state coming in and taking over a local government because they don't like what one of groups under that jurisdiction is saying is quite the platform. Maybe he'll take over for Miami City or the Keys next.


Nah, he's not going to seize your house that's to obvious. He's going to dissolve and take over your local government that you pay taxes to and vote on representation. Then, deny you that representation because of the take over. Finally, pass new taxing rules using the authority of the dissolved but taken over government (not sure how both of those can be true, just go with it) to punish you and everyone else within the boarders. Just trying to seize your house would be to obviously bad.

Assuming this plan is even possible, and if it is actually implemented. How will any government within FL ever do business, borrow money, or attract new companies again? The precedent will be the state can take over at any time and change the rules if they don't like you.

Except the state can't just take over at any time.

 

[Vacationeer]

I think Disney definitely holds the upper ground for battle. Desantis has to talk, at minimum explain some details about plans moving forward. Disney doesn’t need to say peep. The more Desantis divulges, the more opportunities Disney gets for choosing their strategy.

 

[mmascari]

Except the state can't just take over at any time.

I agree that I've never seen any local government structure where the state can just take over at any time, just because they feel like it.

But, that's still essentially what he said isn't it?


At some point, probably in August or September, some political opponent (or PAC) is going to point out how all of this is bad for every governing authority and company in FL. It's not going to be Disney that runs those ads, it'll be someone else.

 

[lazyboy97o]

So, if I'm following here:
- The passed law dissolves the district.
- But he wants to make the state responsible for the district instead
- - Is the plan to change from dissolving the district to the state taking over the district instead?
- - Is the plan to keep the dissolution, but then the state takes over the counties?

I imagine the plan would be to create a new district as mentioned in the dissolution law.

The Attorney General is going to have to defend his actions in (1) state district court then (2) state district court of appeals and (3) finally state supreme court.

Unfortunately, tax payers will foot the entire bill.

This needs to be repeated Ed over and over again. This isn’t just theater and grand standing. It’s real. There are costs.

 

[GoofGoof]

That article today, with direct quotes, confirms the Governor’s plan is to have the state take over the district. There were some here claiming that was “fake news” and made up by the opposition. Crazy times we are living in.

 

[LAKid53]

I imagine the plan would be to create a new district as mentioned in the dissolution law.

Which under existing Florida law, has to be created by the Legislature as the district will cover more than one county and thus would be an INDEPENDENT district under statute. And the governing board would be elected by the district's residents. Unless the governor and state legislature plans on gutting most of Chapter 190, F.S.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I agree that I've never seen any local government structure where the state can just take over at any time, just because they feel like it.

But, that's still essentially what he said isn't it?


At some point, probably in August or September, some political opponent (or PAC) is going to point out how all of this is bad for every governing authority and company in FL. It's not going to be Disney that runs those ads, it'll be someone else.

Here in NJ, there have been instances where the state had to take over control of some school districts - but that was because the school districts were managing their finances so poorly that it was harming the students. It is also allowed for in such situations under NJ laws. Neither of those apply to RCID, so it seems like DeSantis is voluntarily providing more evidence that he and the legislature rushed this through without considering the legality or the consequences