News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[peter11435]

The legislature can’t just ignore the state constitution.

Correct.

Although they seem to be inclined to ignore the US constitution

 

[Nubs70]

I respectfully suggest you research Scott Randolph’s political career, particularly regarding one of the causes he is most passionate about.

I’ve already had one post deleted that documents this. I have no desire to have another one deleted.

You , of all people, had a post deleted???

 

[peter11435]

I disagree. I think that media outlets have an obligation to present both sides of the issue. If they think that the other side's take on it is lacking, report it anyway and let the readers/viewers decide.

Where I agree wholeheartedly is that this should have never been an issue, and the issue of the debt/tax burden should have been addressed as part of the initial proposal.

I agree that media should present both sides. But in this case one side is just yelling “I have a plan” without stating what that plan is or even giving an indication that there really is a plan.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I disagree. I think that media outlets have an obligation to present both sides of the issue. If they think that the other side's take on it is lacking, report it anyway and let the readers/viewers decide. By ignoring the other side's take because they find it lacking, they are being biased.

Where I agree wholeheartedly is that this should have never been an issue, and the issue of the debt/tax burden should have been addressed as part of the initial proposal.

Nothing is not a side. There is nothing to present. The governor has not presented a plan. The governor has no authority to unilaterally implement a plan. When something is actually done then it can be presented.

 

[JoeCamel]

I agree that media should present both sides. But in this case one side is just yelling “I have a plan” without stating what that plan is or even giving an indication that there really is a plan.

File it with the healthcare plan

 

[Brian]

Nothing is not a side. There is nothing to present. The governor has not presented a plan. The governor has no authority to unilaterally implement a plan.

If the governor's office were silent on the matter, it would be nothing. That's not the case - the governor's office has repeatedly stated that they will ensure that county taxpayers will not be hit with Disney's debt/tax obligations, likely by way of a new special district. That is not nothing. One sentence would do, in my opinion: "Governor DeSantis has said that he will work to ensure county taxpayers will not see their taxes increase as a result of this legislation."

Under law, the governor has no authority to unilaterally implement a plan, however, the reality on the ground is that when Gov. DeSantis wants something, the legislature (controlled by his party) will almost always get it done for him.

 

[GimpYancIent]

The dollars can’t lie. They may try to spin the story but if attendance is down and hotel bookings are down and margins for the parks segment is down they won’t be able to hide it. The problem is we will be comparing Q3 2022 (Apr-Jun) to Q3 2021. With Covid restrictions still an issue in 2021 and also Easter being April 4 in 2021 putting part of the popular Spring Break week in Q2 it’s going to be impossible to see the impact of this on public numbers. The 2022 numbers will show huge increases year over year. So it may take another year to look at impacts on statistics and even then if there is a drop we won’t know if it’s people boycotting woke Disney or people avoiding lightning lane or because of a recession or other factor.

I am pretty sure that when the Q3 numbers come out in July they will be really, really good for the parks segment.

You are not wrong but this is definitely a we shall see.

 

[peter11435]

If the governor's office were silent on the matter, it would be nothing. That's not the case - the governor's office has repeatedly stated that they will ensure that county taxpayers will not be hit with Disney's debt/tax obligations, likely by way of a new special district. That is not nothing. One sentence would do, in my opinion: "Governor DeSantis has said that he will work to ensure county taxpayers will not see their taxes increase as a result of this legislation."

Under law, the governor has no authority to unilaterally implement a plan, however, the reality on the ground is that when Gov. DeSantis wants something, the legislature (controlled by his party) will almost always get it done for him.

The governor and legislature have no authority to create a new special district if the people it effects do not agree to it.

 

[lazyboy97o]

If the governor's office were silent on the matter, it would be nothing. That's not the case - the governor's office has repeatedly stated that they will ensure that county taxpayers will not be hit with Disney's debt/tax obligations, likely by way of a new special district. That is not nothing.

Under law, the governor has no authority to unilaterally implement a plan, however, the reality on the ground is that when Gov. DeSantis wants something, the legislature (controlled by his party) will almost always get it done for him.

The governor and his office have made a number of outright false statements regarding the situation. The entire argument is a series of lies, including ones that contradict the very need for a plan.

There was absolutely no talk of a plan until it started being publicized that the taxes would fall to the counties. The time for a plan to be introduced was with the legislation. Implementing new legislation will now require another special session that will still cost the tax payers.

 

[Brian]

The governor and legislature have no authority to create a new special district if the people it effects do not agree to it.

We shouldn't pretend that Disney isn't interested in maintaining as much of their current arrangement as possible. It's not like they are going to object to the creation of a new special district if it benefits them, which it certainly will.

There was absolutely no talk of a plan until it started being publicized that the taxes would fall to the counties. The time for a plan to be introduced was with the legislation. Implementing new legislation will now require another special session that will still cost the tax payers.

You're right about that. It was handled horribly.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

I do not believe attendance at any Disney Property has anything to do with either the right or left or middle of the political spectrum. An awesome amount of reasons for seeking entertainment though. Cost / experience are the two big drivers effecting decisions to go or not go not some social cause.

Funny you say this because last time i was at Disney last year my wife and i were laughing as a man with a trump hat walked by.. followed by a family of 4 with the mom wearing a shirt that said old white men should not be regulating a womans body. In summary.. Disney fans come from all areas of the political spectrum. It always will be that way. With all the differences we all have, Disney is still one place most agree is a place for good memories.

 

[lazyboy97o]

We shouldn't pretend that Disney isn't interested in maintaining as much of their current arrangement as possible. It's not like they are going to object to the creation of a new special district if it benefits them, which it certainly will.

Disney is not going to accept even more taxes, especially ones imposed for no other purpose than penance.

You're right about that. It was handled horribly.

So you’d be okay with “Governor DeSantis has said that he will work to ensure county taxpayers will not see their taxes increase as a result of this legislation, but has so far not shared his plan. This will require another special session done at extra tax payer expense if it is to be accomplished.”?

 

[peter11435]

We shouldn't pretend that Disney isn't interested in maintaining as much of their current arrangement as possible. It's not like they are going to object to the creation of a new special district if it benefits them, which it certainly will.


You're right about that. It was handled horribly.

The key words there are “if it benefits them.”

You are correct that disney would want to maintain their current arrangement if possible. The same legislature that unnecessarily caused all of this mess is the one that now will be attempting to fix it. The state of Florida is not going to offer up a deal that does not benefit them. And Disney is not going to accept a deal that does not benefit Disney.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

If the governor's office were silent on the matter, it would be nothing. That's not the case - the governor's office has repeatedly stated that they will ensure that county taxpayers will not be hit with Disney's debt/tax obligations, likely by way of a new special district. That is not nothing. One sentence would do, in my opinion: "Governor DeSantis has said that he will work to ensure county taxpayers will not see their taxes increase as a result of this legislation."

Even a statement like that should tell people how absurd this situation is. The government has rushed through legislation with potentially massive impacts on taxation in the affected regions because... the state's biggest employer said something they didn't like? Now they will pledge to figure out how to deal with all the potential negative side effects of this move that were not considered when they actually drafted and passed the legislation. It just highlights how little thought was put into the move, regardless of what justifications DeSantis and his supporters are coming up with after the fact.

Sounds like a bunch of spiteful children running Florida.

 

[GimpYancIent]

The key words there are “if it benefits them.”

You are correct that disney would want to maintain their current arrangement if possible. The same legislature that unnecessarily caused all of this mess is the one that now will be attempting to fix it. The state of Florida is not going to offer up a deal that does not benefit them. And Disney is not going to accept a deal that does not benefit Disney.

As multitudes of attorneys gather to the sound of Summon The Heroes playing in the background.

 

[Brian]

Disney is not going to accept even more taxes, especially ones imposed for no other purpose than penance.

So you’d be okay with “Governor DeSantis has said that he will work to ensure county taxpayers will not see their taxes increase as a result of this legislation. This will require another special session done at extra tax payer expense if it is to be accomplished.”?

Yes. I don't think it's unreasonable or biased to report that special sessions cost taxpayer money. I would just hope that if DeSantis were a Democrat, those same sentences would be used verbatim.

The key words there are “if it benefits them.”

You are correct that disney would want to maintain their current arrangement if possible. The same legislature that unnecessarily caused all of this mess is the one that now will be attempting to fix it. The state of Florida is not going to offer up a deal that does not benefit them. And Disney is not going to accept a deal that does not benefit Disney.

What I wouldn't pay to be a fly on the wall at those negotiations.

Even a statement like that should tell people how absurd this situation is. The government has rushed through a policy with potentially massive impacts on taxation in the affected regions because... the state's biggest employer said something they didn't like? Now they will pledge to figure out how to deal with all the potential negative side effects of this move that were not considered when they actually drafted a passed the legislation.

Sounds like a bunch of spiteful children running Florida.

Though I agree with your conclusion, my point is that it's not for the "journalism class" to decide. Their job is to report both sides of the issue without bias and let the reader/viewer decide for themselves. Now, if the reader/viewer has half a brain, they will come to the same conclusion as you and I.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Though I agree with your conclusion, my point is that it's not for the "journalism class" to decide. Their job is to report both sides of the issue without bias and letting the reader/viewer decide for themselves. Now, if the reader/viewer has half a brain, they will come to the same conclusion as you and I.

Every statement should not just be repeated as fact. That’s how you create far bigger problems because you end up repeating and given credence to lies. If the governor actually has a plan and he wants people to report that he has a plan, then he should present the plan. There is nothing difficult about that. It is just that simple. Otherwise he just has a girlfriend in Canada.

 

[Brian]

Every statement should not just be repeated as fact. That’s how you create far bigger problems because you end up repeating and given credence to lies. If the governor actually has a plan and he wants people to report that he has a plan, then he should present the plan. There is nothing difficult about that. It is just that simple. Otherwise he just has a girlfriend in Canada.

Respectfully, I'll agree to disagree.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Respectfully, I'll agree to disagree.

So the governor’s outright false claim that Disney didn’t get building permits should just be repeated as fact? His claims that they didn’t pay taxes should just be repeated as fact? If Randolph starts making outlandish claims about DeSantis trying to get more taxes that he can misappropriate for himself those should just be repeated as fact? Please, you’re making excuses and you know it.

Give us one good reason for this plan to remain secret.

 

[Brian]

So the governor’s outright false claim that Disney didn’t get building permits should just be repeated as fact? His claims that they didn’t pay taxes should just be repeated as fact? If Randolph starts making outlandish claims about DeSantis those should just be repeated as fact?

No. The claim should be presented, and if there are any facts to back up or refute the claim, they should be presented alongside it. Just like the example you gave wherein the hypothetical report says that Gov. DeSantis plans to work with the legislature to avoid the tax burden, requiring a special session at taxpayer expense.

It's sad that journalism is so far gone that basic tenants of it have to be explained. A media outlet refusing to mention that the governor's office will work to ensure that county taxpayers aren't hit with Disney's obligations is emblematic of the problem with journalism - most of them are partisan hacks.

If you're trying to get me to admit that journalists should be allowed to report their stories based on who they deem to be credible, don't bother. Their standard of credibility has been proven to be garbage.