Anywhere but in a “sophisticated vaccinated” crowd.
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Proof of Vaccination or Negative COVID Test required for theme parks soon?
- Thread starter cmwade77
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John park hopper
Well-Known Member
The way Disney is pushing for the higher income guest they will soon be asking for your W-2 and recent tax return (sarcasm)
There are others, but Sweden, Norway and Denmark:
I believe some others were Taiwan, Singapore and a couple other countries in that area.
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iLikeMountains
Member
Good coverage on the subject.There are others, but Sweden, Norway and Denmark:
I believe some others were Tawaon and a couple other countries in that area.
October82
Well-Known Member
There are others, but Sweden, Norway and Denmark:
I believe some others were Taiwan, Singapore and a couple other countries in that area.
The reason these countries have been able to change their covid mitigation policies is because they've been able to control community spread through adequate vaccination, contact tracing, and testing programs. We won't follow their path towards ending further mitigation measures until community spread has ended, which is both a definite marker and nowhere close to happening.
Actually, some of these countries haven't faired any better than we have. Sorry, please read the articles out there about them. Others have fared better as well, but the point is many countries are simply saying enough is enough.
October82
Well-Known Member
You're right to point out that Singapore's relaxation of Covid restriction is causing cases to sky-rocket. The other countries are all doing better than we are, for a combination of reasons having to do with, as I said, higher vaccination rates, better testing and contact tracing regimes, mask usage and social distancing norms, etc. This stuff isn't hard.
I prefer data.
And I'm glad we aren't following that path. The virus doesn't care about your feelings, it doesn't care if you think "enough is enough".
The ironic thing, of course, is that these countries largely show that taking this seriously does mean we can go back to normalcy. Failing to take it seriously and spending your time complaining about having to, well, that just drags this mess out longer.
Attachments
Actually, we are going to have to follow the path of "enough is enough", we can't live this way forever and masks don't work and are very hard on a great number of people.
What is dragging this out longer is doing all of this masking, social distancing, etc., basically, we are ripping the band-aid off very slowly, causing a lot more pain in the long run vs. ripping it off quickly, causing a fair amount of immediate pain, but a lot less pain in the long run. In the end all of these precautions will result in far more suffering and deaths than if we didn't do it at all.
This is what the other countries have figured out and realized they were taking the wrong approach, and we are following the same, failed approach. It is time we wise up and that isn't to say we aren't taking things seriously, just that there are better approaches that don't involve all of this mess. Instead, doing things like frequent hand washing, staying home when you are sick, etc. work much better, as does gradual exposure to germs, something all of this sanitation, etc. has prevented causing a great many people to end up with weaker immune systems.
October82
Well-Known Member
When community spread ends, the pandemic ends. The easiest path to end community spread is to catch up in vaccination rate. Masks are "hard" on almost no one - if you disagree, I recommend seeing a respiratory specialist - and provably reduce cases and deaths.
Allowing unmitigated spread of Covid will not produce herd immunity. There is no historical example of a disease whose spread has ended through widespread infection. What widespread infection does is both cause hundreds of thousands to die and leads to new variants. The delta variant is a direct and predictable consequence of unmitigated spread. I get that you are tired of wearing a mask, but not wearing a mask just makes this last longer. There's no "ripping the band-aid" off, and that idea is both callous and naive.
Not repeating myself at all, these countries (aside from Singapore, which is reimposing mitigation measures as cases spike), are able to reduce mitigation because they have substantially lower case numbers, higher vaccination rates, and more testing/contact tracing infrastructure than the US. It's weird how this stuff provably works. I wonder if that's why all of the scientific and medical communities have recommended doing these things.
This is a very revealing comment. This is not how the immune system works. Not even close.
Your immune system does not "get stronger" through exposure to "germs". Respiratory viruses primarily spread through direct contact with aerosolized droplets. Surface contact transmission is rare. Masking reduces both direct spread of droplets and surface transmission. Hence why masking and hand washing are both things that you should do to reduce the spread of Covid. Exposing the population to more germs just means more sick and dead people. It doesn't mean people are better able to fight it off.
As an aside, there's a fancy word for "staying home when you are sick". I'm glad you brought it up, it's called, social distancing.
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
Cases or deaths? Singapore has about the absolute lowest death rate in the world, greatly because they closed all borders and cut themselves off from the world for an extended time, like New Zealand and Australia. (But I read that's racist, or something. Isn't it?)
Singapore has also conducted 19 Million tests, which is enough to give every citizen in their nation three or four tests per person. Singapore is a nation of only 5.7 Million people, and it's fabulously wealthy.
Singapore = 17 Deaths Per 1 Million, 19.1 Million Covid tests, 17,718 Cases Per 1 Million
USA = 2,190 Deaths Per 1 Million, 641 Million Covid tests, 135,399 Cases Per 1 Million
Singapore = 79.4% Fully Vaccinated
USA = 55.6% Fully Vaccinated
So, in a highly tested and very wealthy city-state like Singapore newly reopening to the world, of course you are going to be able to find people with Covid. But since the vast majority of Sinagporeans are already vaccinated, those who are vaccinated can give a shrug of the shoulders and say so what?
At this point, cases are nothing to fear in highly vaccinated environments. It's nearly impossible to even go to the hospital with Covid once you are vaccinated, much less die. Especially if you aren't obese or already sickly.
Anyone who has seen the glamorous stewardesses on Singapore Airlines knows that nation is neither obese, nor sickly.
Bloomberg - Are you a robot?
www.bloomberg.com
Coronavirus Updates (COVID-19) Deaths & Cases per 1M Population | RealClearPolitics
Coronavirus Updates (COVID-19) Deaths & Cases per Population | RealClearPolitics
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George Lucas on a Bench
Well-Known Member
Stay Home! Save Lives! Or just go out and hit up Citywalk, because Coronavirus doesn't go there.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Many of us already have. I don't wear a mask in public, just like San Francisco mayor London Breed at crowded bars. And I freely socialize maskless with large groups of maskless people, just like the celebs at the Met Gala, or a former President celebrating his birthday with 500 friends at his estate on Martha's Vineyard.
And no one, not one single restaurant hostess or shopclerk or spa employee, has ever asked me to produce proof of vaccination via a fake CDC card printed off the Internet.
For the vaccinated... this Covid thing is over. Stick a fork in it.
spaldingclan
Active Member
checks this thread...sees massive misinformation from amateur facebook virologists...logs out
1HAPPYGHOSTHOST
Well-Known Member
TP2000
Well-Known Member
I will dedicate this week's Friday Data Dump to you.
Orange County continues to have no countywide mask mandate, along with San Diego County and most of SoCal outside of LA County.
Hospitalizations continue to decline, while the increasingly toothless concept of "Cases" in a well vaccinated environment slides downward even though Testing continues to increase more and more in OC.
The current hard facts as of October 1st, 2021 in Orange County...
As always, this
Orange County coronavirus tracker: Cases, vaccines, maps and more
Orange County coronavirus tracker: Cases, vaccines, maps and more The coronavirus pandemic continues to take a toll across Orange County. Here is the latest information available from the county an…
www.ocregister.com
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
As for vaccinations...
Sunshiney and upbeat San Diego County continues to lead the way for vaccinations in SoCal. Orange County and its famous housewives are a close second (C'mon ladies! Less Botox needles, more Vaccine needles!). The Inland Empire continues to lag behind.
California Statewide = 59% Fully Vaccinated
San Diego County = 64% Fully Vaccinated
Orange County = 62% Fully Vaccinated
Los Angeles County = 60% Fully Vaccinated
Riverside County = 50% Fully Vaccinated
San Bernardino County = 46% Fully Vaccinated
Los Angeles County (or Lxs Angxlxs County as the very witty @socalifornian has told the brain trust in the faculty lounge to now call it) with over 10 Million people has the latest demographic data, down to zip codes and school districts on what types of people are highly vaccinated and what types are under-vaccinated.
Lxs Angxlxs County Vaccination Demographics - September 30th, 2021
Ages 65 to 79 = 96% Vaccinated
Ages 18 to 29 = 68% Vaccinated
Asians = 81% Vaccinated
American Indians = 75% Vaccinated
Whites = 72% Vaccinated
Latinos = 62% Vaccinated
Blacks = 53% Vaccinated
The Zip Code map of Lxs Angxlxs County continues to tell the often troubling story. Affluent zips along the beaches and in the hills continue to be highly vaccinated. Working class zip codes in central LA continue to be under vaccinated.
publichealth.lacounty.gov
Sunshiney and upbeat San Diego County continues to lead the way for vaccinations in SoCal. Orange County and its famous housewives are a close second (C'mon ladies! Less Botox needles, more Vaccine needles!). The Inland Empire continues to lag behind.
California Statewide = 59% Fully Vaccinated
San Diego County = 64% Fully Vaccinated
Orange County = 62% Fully Vaccinated
Los Angeles County = 60% Fully Vaccinated
Riverside County = 50% Fully Vaccinated
San Bernardino County = 46% Fully Vaccinated
Los Angeles County (or Lxs Angxlxs County as the very witty @socalifornian has told the brain trust in the faculty lounge to now call it) with over 10 Million people has the latest demographic data, down to zip codes and school districts on what types of people are highly vaccinated and what types are under-vaccinated.
Lxs Angxlxs County Vaccination Demographics - September 30th, 2021
Ages 65 to 79 = 96% Vaccinated
Ages 18 to 29 = 68% Vaccinated
Asians = 81% Vaccinated
American Indians = 75% Vaccinated
Whites = 72% Vaccinated
Latinos = 62% Vaccinated
Blacks = 53% Vaccinated
The Zip Code map of Lxs Angxlxs County continues to tell the often troubling story. Affluent zips along the beaches and in the hills continue to be highly vaccinated. Working class zip codes in central LA continue to be under vaccinated.
LA County COVID-19 Vaccine Dashboard - LA County Department of Public Health
publichealth.lacounty.gov
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Disney Irish
Premium Member
As for vaccinations...
Sunshiney and upbeat San Diego County continues to lead the way for vaccinations in SoCal. Orange County and its famous housewives are a close second (C'mon ladies! Less Botox needles, more Vaccine needles!). The Inland Empire continues to lag behind.
California Statewide = 58% Fully Vaccinated
San Diego County = 64% Fully Vaccinated
Orange County = 62% Fully Vaccinated
Los Angeles County = 60% Fully Vaccinated
Riverside County = 50% Fully Vaccinated
San Bernardino County = 46% Fully Vaccinated
Los Angeles County (or Lxs Angxlxs County as the very witty @socalifornian has told the brain trust in the faculty lounge to now call it) with over 10 Million people has the latest demographic data, down to zip codes and school districts on what types of people are highly vaccinated and what types are under-vaccinated.
Lxs Angxlxs County Vaccination Demographics - September 30th, 2021
Ages 65 to 79 = 96% Vaccinated
Ages 18 to 29 = 68% Vaccinated
Asians = 81% Vaccinated
American Indian = 75% Vaccinated
Whites = 72% Vaccinated
Latinos = 62% Vaccinated
Blacks = 53% Vaccinated
The Zip Code map of Lxs Angxlxs County continues to tell the often troubling story. Affluent zips along the beaches and in the hills continue to be highly vaccinated. Working class zip codes in central LA continue to be under vaccinated.
View attachment 590520
LA County COVID-19 Vaccine Dashboard - LA County Department of Public Health
Just a point of correction:
Its actually 59% fully vaccinated in California not 58%, and that is only if you include ages 0-11 who are not eligible currently to receive the vaccine.
If you take the current vaccine eligible population of 12 and over, its actually 69.2% fully vaccinated in California.
COVID Data Tracker
CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.
covid.cdc.gov
For some reason you keep including the ineligible in your "weekly"
Dear Prudence
Well-Known Member
Truly, though. As someone who had to actually research what was in the vaccines (I am allergic to two of the ones readily available in the US), I had to track down the one I could take-- I can't mention it or take it seriously because of Facebook virologists. The same people who eat TV dinners/cheese from a spray can/Twinkies, check-in their locations on social media wherever they go, are worried about microchips and "what's in the vaccines." If you ever ate those little pixie stix at Halloween, I wouldn't be worried about what's in a vaccine. I've never stopped wearing my mask(s). If you don't want to have to share proof of vaccination, don't go. I am vaccinated, I just don't want to go through the hassle of having to prove it. Indoor places where I live are asking for proof of vaccination, and, frankly, I still don't feel that comfortable going out yet (even though I just went to Disneyland lol lol lol)
Dear Prudence
Well-Known Member
They also have universal health care and safety nets for their citizens. They also don't have anywhere near the level of narcissism Americans seem to have.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
According to the California Department of Public Health via the links I included above, the current statewide full vaccination rate (both Pfizer/Moderna shots, or one J&J shot) in California is 58.6%.
Because it's Friday and I like you, we'll round that up to 59%!
If you take the current vaccine eligible population of 12 and over, its actually 69.2% fully vaccinated in California.
COVID Data Tracker
CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.covid.cdc.gov
For some reason you keep including the ineligible in your "weekly"rantinformation dump. Which you can't if you truly want to give a complete picture of where this state stands, which you've been told before.
You need to ask to speak to the manager in Sacramento, not me.
Your issue appears to be with the California Department of Public Health and county agencies like the Los Angeles County Department of Public Health. They primarily use the data based on Californians of all ages, not just 12 and above.
It does get confusing because there's a few million Californians under age 12, but Sacramento and the various County governments often don't use them in their statistics. But then once in awhile, they'll use the entire state population as a point of reference. Like most government work, it's messy.
What's nice is that all of the information I offer here in this thread comes from the same primary sources;
California Department of Public Health
LA County Department of Public Health
Orange County Health Care Agency
That's a constant. It doesn't really change. And I always include the links for the truly bored.
Although apparently directly quoting and cut-and-pasting the information those official California government agencies provide is considered "Facebook Misinformation" by some here who take some weird issue with the official data. That just makes me chuckle endlessly!
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