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- Thread starter zonguy
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Monorail Lime
Well-Known Member
Jim Hill (author of the Show Stoppers article) is a regular columnist for the weekly as well as the MousePlanet web site. So yes, he most likely has his eye on all the WDW sites. 
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
Well, I have to say that The Orlando Weekly is known for its Disney bashing. To the first article, I will gladly point out that it is written by Jim Hill. That alone should explain things. As for the 2nd article, the author, in describing how Disney supposedly lied to the state to get the control that it has seems to have forgotten that at the time, the state was bending over backwards just to get Disney in here doing anything. The whole reason that the MK got built was to appease the local state. Walt wanted his vision of EPCOT and he was willing to build a MK if it would help make it happen. The state was more interested in the tourism trade that the park would spark in central FL. Even the author of that article has benefited from Disney because without them being in FL, he wouldn’t have gotten paid for that article nor would he have been able to cash in with his *NEW* book Married to the Mouse: Walt Disney World and Orlando
They are a for profit company that will use what every resources are available to them. What’s so unusual about that? He says all of this as if Universal, or Bush Entertainment wouldn’t do the exact same thing given the opportunity.
They are a for profit company that will use what every resources are available to them. What’s so unusual about that? He says all of this as if Universal, or Bush Entertainment wouldn’t do the exact same thing given the opportunity.
I agree, they did get their booming tourism industry, and a deal is a deal. I don't have any sympathy for central FL, because there are major companies including defense contractors in this area, which benefit hugely from corporate welfare and pay little (in comparison) in taxes. Even better, they can shut down plants at will and leave town if they want to, leaving ghost towns behind them. WDW will remain where it is.
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
It was kind of late when I wrote that and I don't know that I got my point across all that well. What I was trying to say is that Florida wanted Disneyland East. The EPCOT thing was cool but it wasn't what they were truly excited about. Heck, the main reason that Disney got so much control in the beginning was because there was nothing there. No local inspector knew how to determine if a 150 foot castle made of concrete, steal and fiberglass was safe. As for the power plant and airport allowances, the orlando area was best known for it's orange groves. These were things Disney was going to need to guarantee it's growth if the surrounding area did not grow with it. People forget that Orlando is one of the largest cities in Florida today and it was almost nothing only 30 or so years ago. That's almost 100% Disney's doing. Perhaps it was a bad deal but the state and local governments had no problem agreeing to it at the time. You can't decide 30 years later that things aren't fair.
if wdw never came i dont think there would even be an orlando weekly!-it would be the cow crap weekly because if disney never came orlando would never be as big and grown-not even if universal and sea world was there-disney is blamed for all of orlandos problems-but they fail to mention that disney has made
thousands of jobs and disney is a good corporate citizen.
the disney cancer institute,they have invested lots of money in valencia community college in their food and beverage management program and many other things to needy charities including many local food banks.
so jim hill can kiss my @#!$:fork: :fork: :fork: :fork: :fork: :fork:
thousands of jobs and disney is a good corporate citizen.
the disney cancer institute,they have invested lots of money in valencia community college in their food and beverage management program and many other things to needy charities including many local food banks.
so jim hill can kiss my @#!$:fork: :fork: :fork: :fork: :fork: :fork:
Don't take this wrong, but the articles do have a point. Try rereading them with out bias, (however difficult that may be.) I do realize that Disney was probably responsible for the initial growth of Orlando, but does that mean Orlando has to kiss their @$$ forever? Keep in mind I'm not bashing Disney here... just keeping a open mind.
VashtheStampede
New Member
yes I think it does.........Disney owns all of us! HaAHAHAHAHa.
I'm am very thankful that Disney is here and such a part of CFL life....
I'm am very thankful that Disney is here and such a part of CFL life....
Well, I was walking around EPCOT this afternoon, and realized that there seems to be a lot of extra entertainment in the park this time of year. In fact, I think there probably has been every holiday season. Strange that Disney did not charge a holiday "surcharge" for these "extras", since they are heartless profiteers....:animwink:
"Try rereading them with out bias..."
I did try, really. But I'm talking mostly about the second article, and I just wanted to point out that tax deals and breaks and stuff aren't limited to The Walt Disney Co, it's not unusual for an area to make deals like that when courting businesses. So I'm not convinced that the shoe isn't on the other foot and the counties aren't always looking for the Deep Pockets to cover the cost of schools and roads and services. I don't live there, so I don't know.
I did try, really. But I'm talking mostly about the second article, and I just wanted to point out that tax deals and breaks and stuff aren't limited to The Walt Disney Co, it's not unusual for an area to make deals like that when courting businesses. So I'm not convinced that the shoe isn't on the other foot and the counties aren't always looking for the Deep Pockets to cover the cost of schools and roads and services. I don't live there, so I don't know.
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
That’s just it. It’s ok to say it was a bad deal but it’s the counties’/states fault for agreeing to it to begin with. Why should Disney offer to pay tens of millions more a year? Because they are nice? Everyone seems to forget that we are talking about a for-profit company. That’s why it costs $50 to get in the parks and why you pay $2.50 for a soda and why the rooms aren’t free… As for the first article, I’ll stop reading Jim Hills articles without biased the day he stops writing them with biased. This is, after all, the one that tried to suggest that Disney might make their fifth gait a Lego Land.
Originally posted by MrPromey
That’s just it. It’s ok to say it was a bad deal but it’s the counties’/states fault for agreeing to it to begin with. Why should Disney offer to pay tens of millions more a year? Because they are nice? Everyone seems to forget that we are talking about a for-profit company. That’s why it costs $50 to get in the parks and why you pay $2.50 for a soda and why the rooms aren’t free… As for the first article, I’ll stop reading Jim Hills articles without biased the day he stops writing them with biased. This is, after all, the one that tried to suggest that Disney might make their fifth gait a Lego Land.
i agree 100% mr.P
disney is a for profit corporation.as a corporation the number 1 priority is to increase shareholder value. why does everyone bash disney for doing what any other compnay would do if they had the chance????i have no problem paying 2.50 for a soda-after all i back the mouse 100%
MrPromey
Well-Known Member
What’s funny is that I find myself having to use this argument (it’s a company, not a non-profit organization) with people who are Disney fanatics that get upset when they think Disney’s being cheap in the parks. We have to remember on some level that it really is a company. They make movies and offer relaxing vacations. Disney is not some sort of religion. It’s strange that this simple obvious observation works in both directions, isn’t it?
you hit the nail on the head!
i have freinds who are in mgt for disney-in consumer products and disney interactive and they too at first didnt realize disney would be a regular company-with pros and cons like meetings,paychecks,written warnings,cutbacks,time clocks, and sometimes jerky bosses.
as much as some hate eisner lately they have to realize he is the one who has his loyalties to the thousands who are stockholders and to the board of directors like any other big company and he better show something on the bottom line
I don't think that this problem is unique to Disney and the Orlando area, especially the problems faced when development covers/impacts more than one county! We are starting to face this in NE Florida. Duval county,and others, bent over backwards (or forward, depending on your point of view) to bring the Mayo Clinic here several years ago (I'm just going to use this as one example) Part of the deal was to remove all tolls on an East-West freeway that ran from the city to the beach. When I first started using it, it took 20 mins to get there; now the morning commute for people going to town from the beach is over an hour. When the tolls were removed, massive development began toward the beaches, in the next county. These people pay taxes, etc in the other county,but work in Duval, and use our roads, police, etc. They also draw their water from the same source as the "older" developments, so water has become an issue. It is also an a major issue in central (Orlando) Florida...the latest report estimates they will deplete their current supplies in 5 years, 15 years earlier than originally predicted.
Anyways, rapid growth is a problem in all of Florida, not just Orlando. Things that seemed like great ideas to boost the economy 20 or 30 years ago are turning into nightmares! It's unfair to blame the company for the shortsightedness of past county planners. The fact is, who really could have acurately predicted the impact Disney would have on the area? Without the "high living" economy of the 80s and 90s, the resort area might have failed completely; certainly it would not have expanded the way it has. People had disposable income, so they came in droves. They will come again as soon as things improve.
Anyways, rapid growth is a problem in all of Florida, not just Orlando. Things that seemed like great ideas to boost the economy 20 or 30 years ago are turning into nightmares! It's unfair to blame the company for the shortsightedness of past county planners. The fact is, who really could have acurately predicted the impact Disney would have on the area? Without the "high living" economy of the 80s and 90s, the resort area might have failed completely; certainly it would not have expanded the way it has. People had disposable income, so they came in droves. They will come again as soon as things improve.
Anyways, rapid growth is a problem in all of Florida, not just Orlando.
I can imagine. You also have half of our state's citizens there during the winter months. And in the spring they come home by the plane-loads. They are called 'snowbirds' and when I grow up I want to be one of them.
I can imagine. You also have half of our state's citizens there during the winter months.
And in the spring they come home by the plane-loads. They are called 'snowbirds' and when I grow up I want to be one of them.
I'm afraid the Floridian reaction to growth is pretty typical of human nature. Poor, out of the way counties go all out to attract businesses(with "sweet" deals), new residents, etc., then later complain about those same tax breaks, and overcrowding. It's similar to the celebrities who spend years trying to be famous, then complain because they are recognized everywhere and have no privacy! Be careful what you wish for, you might get it!!