Opinion: Toy Story Land's grand opening will be a disaster

[Kingtut]

what was the budget? do you know?

No I was being sarcastic - but if it is anything like most large projects the approved budget is only 75% of what the original concepts required. Then that amount would get reduced by small increments to 50% of what was originally envisioned. You end up with a project manager trying to determine if she/he can afford to pay for the software changes if they can reuse the lumber from shipping crates.

 

[justintheharris]

Marketing only works for an initial push. Pre-opening hype only results in lasting success if the final product delivers on the promise of the advertising. Pandora has worked because the theming is unusual and FoP is, from all reports, an exciting experience that people want to do again and again. It is unique.

Neither of the two upcoming attractions offer anything that can't be experienced at a regional theme park. Yes, TTMM will remain popular as it was well-designed and fun. Otherwise, I see Toy Story Land losing its drawing power sooner, rather than later.

I am eternally grateful that you found the words I couldn’t lol. Thank you.

 

[eliza61nyc]

No I was being sarcastic - but if it is anything like most large projects the approved budget is only 75% of what the original concepts required. Then that amount would get reduced by small increments to 50% of what was originally envisioned. You end up with a project manager trying to determine if she/he can afford to pay for the software changes if they can reuse the lumber from shipping crates.

lol, thanks Kingtut,
So I always admit that I'm not very knowledgable in the inner workings of the mouse world. I am very impressed with some of the stuff our fellow posters know. yikes.
lol, but I do know about project budgets. I work in R&D for a large chemical company, it's an annual fight. we get assigned a project that is supposed to "revolutionize" the market place, halfway through it gets cut along with the staffing and the timetable is cut in half. really!!

time will tell with Toy story land whether it will be a flop or not.

 

[justintheharris]

lol, thanks Kingtut,
So I always admit that I'm not very knowledgable in the inner workings of the mouse world. I am very impressed with some of the stuff our fellow posters know. yikes.
lol, but I do know about project budgets. I work in R&D for a large chemical company, it's an annual fight. we get assigned a project that is supposed to "revolutionize" the market place, halfway through it gets cut along with the staffing and the timetable is cut in half. really!!

time will tell with Toy story land whether it will be a flop or not.

As I said, I could be wrong. I want to be wrong. But we will indeed just have to wait and see.

 

[eliza61nyc]

As I said, I could be wrong. I want to be wrong. But we will indeed just have to wait and see.

I think by the time any such "sheen" wears off, star wars land will be open, that combined with TSL will make HS better than Epcot for sure and on equal footing with AK to the average visitor. Now I do not think the average person here will like it, you guys are really into the "technological" advances and the "uniqueness" aspect of disney and caught up in the nostalgia of the old imagineering. you'll never be happy with the direction the mouseworld is going. I would say the average visitor to the parks does not get into whether or not Disney use to have rides that no one else had, they like the IP stuff and most would still say WDW is nowhere near their local great adventures.

just me.

 

[geekza]

I would say the average visitor to the parks does not get into whether or not Disney use to have rides that no one else had, they like the IP stuff and most would still say WDW is nowhere near their local great adventures.

Aiming for "good enough" isn't what they used to be about. If you're happy with mediocrity at high prices, that's your prerogative.

 

[justintheharris]

I think by the time any such "sheen" wears off, star wars land will be open, that combined with TSL will make HS better than Epcot for sure and on equal footing with AK to the average visitor. Now I do not think the average person here will like it, you guys are really into the "technological" advances and the "uniqueness" aspect of disney and caught up in the nostalgia of the old imagineering. you'll never be happy with the direction the mouseworld is going. I would say the average visitor to the parks does not get into whether or not Disney use to have rides that no one else had, they like the IP stuff and most would still say WDW is nowhere near their local great adventures.

just me.

Well you indeed do make a point but locals are a vital part of Disney’s market. And I really have no objections to any other Disney ride currently under development

 

[MisterPenguin]

Nice!!!
So because there is precedent you excuse it irrespective of its cheapness

Your premise is awful
The warrant in your argument is totally faulty .

Don't know why you broke up my post into two parts and made two separate posts. Multiplicity of posts doesn't make your argument stronger.

I was responding to someone who was making the case that there were too few rides for a new "land" and that this few number is unprecedented. I showed how it was very much precedented. I used facts towards a specific point: too few rides!

Now, if you want to make the case that a new land should have more rides, sure, go ahead. But you can't say that the number in TSL is an outlier. Both Disney and Universal pretty much put the same number of new and/or converted rides in new lands in the past decade. What criteria would you like to use to say that there should be more rides and break the precedent that has been set?

BTW, nothing in TSL is 'cheap.' It was expensive. Many argue more expensive than it needs be, but that's the same problem for Disney building lands, revamping a ride, or just about anything they do nowadays.

So, when you learn not to create a straw man argument, move goalposts, make spurious claims, and learn how to post on a message board, come on back with a response!

 

[NelsonRD]

I agree with this, but more in the sense that I do not understand why someone would spend SO MUCH MONEY on a trip to WDW before a child turns say, 6. Chances are the kid probably won't remember this (we lose most of our memories at 7, and cannot actually form memories until we are about 3 years old) so why not just wait until your child is old enough to remember & old enough to not need babying?

It is because it is not always about your children remembering. It is about the memories we get as parents. Children under 6 show the most innocent reactions to seeing the characters and the land. As kids get older, they start to question the reality of what they see. It is the same reason why we as parents do not wait until kids will remember other things, such as Santa Claus, or the Tooth Fairy.

 

[Nj4mwc]

I couldn't imagine doing Disney with an infant. That would be so stressful my goodness.

Took my son when he was 6 months old and my daughter was 3, much less stressful then them being 10 and 7, I’d kill for my son to be as well behaved now as he was at 6 months

 

[MisterPenguin]

Aiming for "good enough" isn't what they used to be about. If you're happy with mediocrity at high prices, that's your prerogative.

Any time they put in a C Ticket ride, which experts clamor for in order to 'eat crowds', then that is a "good enough" ride. That's what pretty much calling something "C Ticket" is all about.

My take is: If it's not an E-Ticket, don't bother. If you can't plus that C Ticket until it's an E, then get rid of it and put in an E-Ticket. If all rides were at the same E-Ticket level, they would all have the same drawing power, and there would be no need for FP... except for E Tickets with low capacity, which, in that case, you keep adding extra tracks or clone them. But people call me crazy for that opinion.

Anyhoo... TSL is more akin to Storybook Circus, a very family friendly park which is really for the kids. SWL will be family friendly more so for older kids and adults. Until they're all E-Tickets, this is just fine.

 

[Damon7777]

People will flock to it regardless of what it is because 1. it's new and 2. it's Toy Story. Disney knows that and that's what the marketing of the land has concentrated on.

Yes to part 1 and a 'no' to part 2


It doesn't matter what the chosen themed land is. Guests will come in big numbers if it is a full new land.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Aiming for "good enough" isn't what they used to be about. If you're happy with mediocrity at high prices, that's your prerogative.

so the problem is, that what you are saying is "subjective". now I did not go to disney during this great age in the 80's and 90's so I don't have any reference to what they use to be about. except to what folks here talk about.

Now as far as high prices? I spent 6K last year for a week at Ocean city NJ. Disney is not all that crazy expensive than any other vacation we take.
but you are right it is our prerogative. We spend our money where we see value, so far we have fabulous vacations at the world, going on great rides so I beg to differ. we are most definitely not having "mediocre" vacations.

I don't know what a "C" ticket ride is versus a "e" ticket ride. I've never gone during that period so that has absolutely no reference for me (and I would imagine a large number of wdw guest)

 

[righttrack]

We all fear a Dinoland 2. I can understand the off-the-shelf aspects but all great rides are have the underpinnings of known ride manufacturers. Disney participates in that process, does appropriate theming and usually gets it right. Safety and infrastructure is handled by the ride companies. We hope that this is an immersive Disney experience. That means everything. The guts could be something else, that matters not. I'm hoping that this one is what it should be and does right by the franchise. That park is balanced heavily towards adults and teens already and needs more age 6-60 attractions that the whole family can enjoy together. People who grew up on Toy Story want to experience it with their families as they grow, kids, parents and grandparents all need something to enjoy together. That's the spirit that Walt brought to Disneyland and WDW. I hope it works!

 

[geekza]

so the problem is, that what you are saying is "subjective". now I did not go to disney during this great age in the 80's and 90's so I don't have any reference to what they use to be about. except to what folks here talk about.

Now as far as high prices? I spent 6K last year for a week at Ocean city NJ. Disney is not all that crazy expensive than any other vacation we take.
but you are right it is our prerogative. We spend our money where we see value, so far we have fabulous vacations at the world, going on great rides so I beg to differ. we are most definitely not having "mediocre" vacations.

I don't know what a "C" ticket ride is versus a "e" ticket ride. I've never gone during that period so that has absolutely no reference for me (and I would imagine a large number of wdw guest)

Correct, so you don't know what you're missing. I'm glad you feel that modern-day WDW is a great value for the money and enjoy it.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Wait...



OK, now I think that's out of my system.

Predictions are like opinions - except pretty much pointless.

Negative predictions about new Disney "anythings" are like...pointless pointlessness based on next to nothing. With that said...

Toy Story Midway Mania is undoubtedly one of the greatest attractions ever created

Really?

So I guess if you were shooting at screens while on the slinky-dog coaster, that would be great?

I agree with the OP. I am not really excited about the new land.

I'm not making special plans to visit because of it, either, but there's a long way between that and OP's "disaster" scenario. I just figure I'm not the target market for it, to each their own, I'll be at the Tune-In Lounge which always makes HS a full-day park for me. I'll check out the slinky-dog coaster when the lines are short or I get a FP, with hopefully an appropriate level of expectation.

I predict TSL will be as big a "disaster" as The Last Jedi. (See, it's just as easy to go snarky - or positive - as doom and gloom.)

One more:

 

[Bob Harlem]

There's not even a kid's play area in DHS now since they took out the Honey I shrunk the kids play area, so nothing really the little ones can do except shows. The fact this is missing from Toy Story land is crazy.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Correct, so you don't know what you're missing. I'm glad you feel that modern-day WDW is a great value for the money and enjoy it.

Thanks. The way I look at it is I have 3 options
1) go and enjoy what wdw has to offer today.
2) dont go because I don't think the value is there
3) go and bemoan the fact that Disney is no longer as good as it was 30 years ago.

I've never been one to sing the "back in my day" blues

 

[Goofyernmost]

Aiming for "good enough" isn't what they used to be about. If you're happy with mediocrity at high prices, that's your prerogative.

The good enough is only in the minds of a few that for whatever reason think they know exactly what everyone wants, because that's what they want. They also judge that what they want is the right thing without a single thought that Disney might even know what they are doing. Of course, it hasn't opened yet so who knows, they might be right, but, really the compass of what was good enough as opposed to great died in 1966. It can be said that a lot of what he thought was great, was awful and didn't fly. He, however, due to the fact that he was "Walt Disney" could level it and build something else without everyone second guessing it. In other words, the public, as a whole, will make the determination about what is good and what is mediocrity not a poster on a discussion board that has never run a theme park.

Some of the other things that people think about might even be as simple as the huge plastic toys that didn't just materialize out of thin air. Those were designed and built by extremely good artists and artisans. The detail, the production time and the creativity of those alone are worth admiring if we weren't so wrapped up in make believe expectations.

 

[DisneyDoctor]

The good enough is only in the minds of a few that for whatever reason think they know exactly what everyone wants, because that's what they want. They also judge that what they want is the right thing without a single thought that Disney might even know what they are doing. Of course, it hasn't opened yet so who knows, they might be right, but, really the compass of what was good enough as opposed to great died in 1966. It can be said that a lot of what he thought was great, was awful and didn't fly. He, however, due to the fact that he was "Walt Disney" could level it and build something else without everyone second guessing it. In other words, the public, as a whole, will make the determination about what is good and what is mediocrity not a poster on a discussion board that has never run a theme park.

Some of the other things that people think about might even be as simple as the huge plastic toys that didn't just materialize out of thin air. Those were designed and built by extremely good artists and artisans. The detail, the production time and the creativity of those alone are worth admiring if we weren't so wrapped up in make believe expectations.

I especially love that last point you made about the level of detail and creativity that was undoubtedly included in the new land. I could enjoy walking around WDW riding no rides and simply enjoying the immense detail and creativity that has gone into each park. I don't anticipate Toy Story Land being an exception to this.