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On layoffs, very bad attendance, and Iger's legacy being one of disgrace

𝙲𝚊𝚜𝚝𝙰𝚂𝚝𝚘𝚗𝚎

Senior Director of Disney Genie*
Premium Member
WDW is careening towards bankruptcy. The parent company is too.
I was with you until this. If you look through the last several public filings, there’s simply no way this is true. They are, at a bare minimum, assuming absolutely no revenue from parks and movies at all, at least 18 months from bankruptcy, and if they can secure some additional loans, probably more like several years. And again that’s assuming no revenue at all from parks and movies.
I've already started to notice a SMALL dip in DVC resale contract prices. I wonder how those prices will be affected...
Have you glanced at the direct DVC sales? Disney sold less than 1/10 of their normal average of the last 30 days. this despite the best incentives they’ve offered in at least a few years.
I believe we are already in that situation. No one here would pay rack rate for a room. Since Disney has pulled all non-AP discounts, there is no way to justify those resort prices. They are charging $180.00 per night night for POP in the middle of this mess. That is not a demand driven price; that is just hubris.
Especially since they pulled all of the on-site benefits. Why wouldn’t I just stay at the Fairfield right now?
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
OKW and SS are over 700 a night for a studio. They would drop the price if they wanted people there. They don’t. As I said in another thread, if your willing to pay those prices they will take you in. Most wont and I think for now as they figure out what the next move is, they are fine with it.
$700 per night to lay my head down for a few hours at night is not even logical to me.
 

John park hopper

Well-Known Member
My intent is not to be political as this is the fault of both parties. The government can't continue to print money(buy their own debt) with nothing to back it up with other than their word they will pay the interest. Trillions of dollars in national debt and no way to pay it off-- IMO a major dollar devaluation is coming, along with a major recession and inflation. Covid virus is the least of Disney's worries in the near future. Vacation spending will be the first thing to go
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
Oh man. I have logged in, written drafts, deleted them, and swore I would never do this. Yet here I am. And I'm ready to start some ****.

The Walt Disney Company is about to experience some of the deepest layoffs I have ever witnessed in my adult life. I would call attention to the 2002 and 2009 layoffs after those respective crises. Those separations from the company were orderly. Often via generous voluntary packages. Hell, to his credit, Al Weiss was militant about never laying off a CM against their will after 9/11. I respect that. He was basically a dumbass otherwise.

In 2009, there was a similar "orderly" exit of excess personnel. However, much of this labor was brought back remarkably fast as Disney's business was in far better shape in 2009.

We also have other, smaller layoffs that hit project teams at WDI. These are bull**** layoffs. Flim Flam. Just some accounting tricks. Almost everyone is brought back.

Well, these days are no more. What you are about to see from WDC will be shocking and it will permanently change their business forever. The bloat is about to be gone. The mediocrity that's failed upward all our lives is about to be purged. A new company is emerging.

And no, Bob Chapek is no hero. But he does recognize the value in taking out the trash.

Now, lets talk about attendance at WDW. It's effing bad. Its Hard Rock Park bad. It's Dubai bad. Its the worst attendance in the history of the resort. Epcot is lucky to hit 2500 a day and usually is only hosting a few hundred at a time. Magic Kingdom is tormentingly under performing. There is simply no demand to fill the park out even to its limited capacity. The other two parks are also in dire straits, but due to their smaller size, there are certain days they can make a go of it. And yet still, the resort business is the iceberg and WDW Parks are the titanic. This will not end well.

The situation is dire. Unsustainable. WDW parks will be dropping to five day weeks soon. They will likely not be alone in this practice.

And that brings me to Bob Iger. Mr. Chairman. Mr. Gotta Put Yoda on His Wife's Dress to Bury Some Search Engine Leads. That guy. It is my pleasure to announce that he will be soon tossed on his ***. In disgrace. His sins, his poor judgement, his poor treatment of subordinates. His malicious temper and outrageous displays of "toxic masculinity" as the kids call it. All this and more is coming out. Good riddance.

I guess we gotta blame somebody other than the CCP. There is no way TWDC or any other company could been prepared for COVID. I was at EPCOT in November before COVID and it was so JAMMED PACKED with guests I could not get to a food booth to buy a $7 snack which I would have gladly done had it not been so JAMMED PACKED with guests.
 

crawale

Well-Known Member
Can you speculate on why attendance is so low? Anecdotally I know of four separate parties who cancelled trips due to the one park per day limit and the reservation system.

Expecting people to pay thousands and only get into the parks guaranteed for 3 days of their trip is lunacy. If they want people in the parks, OPEN the parks and resorts. This is not Ebola.

I'm simply not convinced the low attendance is due to covid. I've seen too many packed with people places.
Not just entry to the parks. Dining has been slashed - tiny menus but same exhorbitant prices. No advantage to stay in the parks - previously you could book fast passes which would guarantee you could ride the rides you wished - now you might pay thousands and not even be able to ride what you want. Hotels with pools closed - why would you pay thousands to stay at the Beach Club when you can't use the pool? OK - some may not want to return to the parks but for those who do Disney has so cut back on entertainment, fireworks - in fact all the things that one would visit Disney for. Are they offering half price tickets and half price resorts for half the value they are giving - no they are not.
 

M:SpilotISTC12

Well-Known Member
Woah blast from the past! Where is Grizz and Nim?

This whole situation is so sad to hear. The worst part is that this financial situation could have been averted if management made better decisions with acquiring IPs. Pricing in the parks has been a disaster and is obviously well documented. At the end of the day the Bobs will make it through this just fine, it's the laid off employees and fans that will hurt the most.
 

Jon81uk

Well-Known Member
No advantage to stay in the parks - previously you could book fast passes which would guarantee you could ride the rides you wished - now you might pay thousands and not even be able to ride what you want.

FastPass never guaranteed that you could ride what you want, there was still always operational issues that can stop you getting on rides, all it meant is a shorter wait time. You can still ride all the rides you want, just join the line.
The only ride in the parks you probably won't get on is Rise of the Resistance, everything else is there at the end of a line.
 

DznyGrlSD

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
Welcome back! And to the others too.

As you said, attendance is low. Very. One example is a park that is capped at less than a quarter of the norm. And then on the day half the reservations it had didn’t show.

Is Disney going to start doing anything about the no-shows. Especially from the AP bucket?
 

Nubs70

Well-Known Member
Reflecting on employment losses leading to a smaller pool of potential customers.

Covid unemployment resulted in losses:
5x 9/11 that rebounded quickly.
2x 2007-2009 financial crisis. These job losses played out over a degree of time.
Covid job losses were hard, fast, and immediate.

If 9/11 and the Financial Crisis had an impact on WDW. The Covid impact will be much more severe in both severity and duration.

Customers simply do not have the financial means/security nor acceptable health risk to go to WDW.

As much as we hoped for a quick recovery, this recovery will take much longer than anything seen before.

The pre Covid business model is no longer viable.
 

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
Can you speculate on why attendance is so low? Anecdotally I know of four separate parties who cancelled trips due to the one park per day limit and the reservation system.

Expecting people to pay thousands and only get into the parks guaranteed for 3 days of their trip is lunacy. If they want people in the parks, OPEN the parks and resorts. This is not Ebola.

I'm simply not convinced the low attendance is due to covid. I've seen too many packed with people places.

It is indeed COVID. There are travel bans still in place, so folks outside the US can't come, we still have the two week quarantine required when you return from a trip to FL, the poor folks that want to vacation from NY to FL (to name one) must quarantine two weeks when then enter FL then when they return to NY must again quarantine for two weeks. Not everyone works from home and can do that.
 

celluloid

Well-Known Member
Woah blast from the past! Where is Grizz and Nim?

This whole situation is so sad to hear. The worst part is that this financial situation could have been averted if management made better decisions with acquiring IPs. Pricing in the parks has been a disaster and is obviously well documented. At the end of the day the Bobs will make it through this just fine, it's the laid off employees and fans that will hurt the most.
and the business model shifted to adding to that perfect storm, letting the parks rest on their laurals for so long while making upcharge events of crowds a large portion of income.
 

WDW Pro

Well-Known Member
The situation is dire. Unsustainable. WDW parks will be dropping to five day weeks soon. They will likely not be alone in this practice.

So I was going to make a thread about this, but I'll just put it here. There are several options being discussed with a decision due soon.

1. MK and MK resorts open only (most dire)
2. Rotating AK and DHS days open
3. Making Epcot an afternoon only park
4. Temporarily shutting down Future World entirely

I don't know of any plans at the moment to close all parks two days a week. It could be true, I just haven't heard that until this thread.
 

FullSailDan

Well-Known Member
I was with you until this. If you look through the last several public filings, there’s simply no way this is true. They are, at a bare minimum, assuming absolutely no revenue from parks and movies at all, at least 18 months from bankruptcy, and if they can secure some additional loans, probably more like several years. And again that’s assuming no revenue at all from parks and movies.

18 months is nothing for a company like Disney and assumes they have no large expenditures. A company like Disney needs to spend to stay relevant. We all give it hell for the tie ins and infusion of IP, but that marketing machine is exactly what keeps people interacting with their brand and eventually booking a trip, buying dvc, etc. No, they are not teetering like JCPenney is, but retail is a whole different animal that is 100% season to season profitability.
 

robhedin

Well-Known Member
Not just entry to the parks. Dining has been slashed - tiny menus but same exhorbitant prices. No advantage to stay in the parks - previously you could book fast passes which would guarantee you could ride the rides you wished - now you might pay thousands and not even be able to ride what you want. Hotels with pools closed - why would you pay thousands to stay at the Beach Club when you can't use the pool? OK - some may not want to return to the parks but for those who do Disney has so cut back on entertainment, fireworks - in fact all the things that one would visit Disney for. Are they offering half price tickets and half price resorts for half the value they are giving - no they are not.
As long as the attraction is operating, being able to ride everything isn't a problem -- except for RotR. Generally you can ride things multiple times - all thanks (?) to the current low attendance.

I didn't think they had opened the Beach Club yet and had delayed it indefinitely (The DVC there is, but I believe their pool is open).

Even so, I've gone down in July and am going down again in August, but don't see the value in paying the premium for Disney Hotels at their current prices given the current state of things. I'll gladly spend money in the parks on food and "things" but then I'll be going to restaurants outside the parks for dinner if the parks are closing at 6-7p.
 

Dave Z

Well-Known Member
Hey I’ve been back for two hours, I’m not gonna tear into anyone like the old days. I’ve changed. I look at the world differently. Medication and therapy are good things as well as other life changing issues.

I came to grips that I’m pretty much Stuck at home for the rest of the year with occasional special trips to drive thru McDonalds. It’s like I’m 5 again only with color TV and the internet.

I have no juicy gossip but I leave you with the experience we learned from 9/11 - if dirt hasn’t moved on a project? Don’t expect it to happen. Assume it’s been cancelled. Best Hope is that things get shifted to FY22.
do stop by on the forums miss you, I work in the food industry and I agree with you on this, we push our trip out to 11/21 may be later......
 

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