No more free drinks at All Star Sports Resort

[puntagordabob]

My thoughts on this:

I fill my 10 ounce cup (way too small) and get aprox 8 ounces of soda to allow for ice... I am REALLY thirsty (coming back to the resort after a long hot Florida day) so I essentially gulp the 8 ounces down in a few seconds...... Now I have to wait (according to previous posts) aprox 5 minutes before I can get a refill???

BIG PROBLEM IMHO

Give us bigger cups (20 ounces or more).......10 ounce cups is very small.... Having unlimited soda means unlimited refills...and that should not mean every 5 minutes and should not mean 8 ounces only... I like my big cups of (Diet Soda) something to drink....I am not abnormal in fact I am in the majority.... the current cup size is unrealistic....the 5 minute refills is unrealistic. This has always been my opinion even before the rfid and I have (always politely) mentioned this to many CMs and usually they seem to "unofficially" agree....Im tired after a fun day outside in the Florida sun...why do I need to get up and walk to the soda machine over and over to fill this little cup..... For what they pay for the soda they can offer us more realisticly sized cups AT LEAST!

 

[Kamikaze]

My thoughts on this:

I fill my 10 ounce cup (way too small) and get aprox 8 ounces of soda to allow for ice... I am REALLY thirsty (coming back to the resort after a long hot Florida day) so I essentially gulp the 8 ounces down in a few seconds...... Now I have to wait (according to previous posts) aprox 5 minutes before I can get a refill???

BIG PROBLEM IMHO

Give us bigger cups (20 ounces or more).......10 ounce cups is very small.... Having unlimited soda means unlimited refills...and that should not mean every 5 minutes and should not mean 8 ounces only... I like my big cups of (Diet Soda) something to drink....I am not abnormal in fact I am in the majority.... the current cup size is unrealistic....the 5 minute refills is unrealistic. This has always been my opinion even before the rfid and I have (always politely) mentioned this to many CMs and usually they seem to "unofficially" agree....Im tired after a fun day outside in the Florida sun...why do I need to get up and walk to the soda machine over and over to fill this little cup..... For what they pay for the soda they can offer us more realisticly sized cups AT LEAST!

The 5 minutes thing is listed on ValidFill's site, but it doesn't necessarily mean it will be enabled on the machines at WDW. Or it could be limited to 2 drinks every 5 minutes, etc.

I agree with you about the mug size, though. They used to be much larger. I have Dixie Landings mugs (the supposedly 'lifetime' ones) that can hold probably near double what the current ones do.

 

[puntagordabob]

Another good thing this may lead to that I just thought of: They should be able to leave the machines open 24/7 and even put them in other locations. If the machines only work for water without the RFID tags, whats to stop them from putting machines all over the place. I hate getting back from the parks late and the food courts are all closed so you can't get a drink. With this system, they should be able to leave them available to use all the time. Or even place a machine out by every pool (or even in every building).

I know..... depending on where your room is it is a long walk for a such a small quantity of soda..... hopefully they will place a couple of these at various locations throughout the resort.... Dreaming of course but one of these in the BLT somewhere near the two elevator locations would be awesome....as much as I love walking over to the Conempo Cafe they shut the fountains down when its closed...

 

[puntagordabob]

I agree with you about the mug size, though. They used to be much larger. I have Dixie Landings mugs (the supposedly 'lifetime' ones) that can hold probably near double what the current ones do.

I wonder how they handle that "Lifetime thing"... makes me wonder if I should look in the atic sometime to find our old Contemporary ones ....packrats so we likely have at least one hehehe.....

I also think that they should have them return to the resort specific designs plus perhaps a few random others..... and allow you to "reactivate" your RFID cup each visit for a lesser price. All these old cups.....I imagine so many of them get tossed out soon after the trip in many cases and that is just waste!

Of course if you had a choice of designs.... People (and I am one of them) would collect them... lol

 

[patricia27]

Mugs!

Way back in 1994 we bought mugs at Dixie Landings which we were told could be used for ever!! Which we do--no one has questioned us yet !! We take them to the Riverside---every year we see less guests with them!!

 

[Pioneer Hall]

My thoughts on this:

I fill my 10 ounce cup (way too small) and get aprox 8 ounces of soda to allow for ice... I am REALLY thirsty (coming back to the resort after a long hot Florida day) so I essentially gulp the 8 ounces down in a few seconds...... Now I have to wait (according to previous posts) aprox 5 minutes before I can get a refill???

BIG PROBLEM IMHO

Give us bigger cups (20 ounces or more).......10 ounce cups is very small.... Having unlimited soda means unlimited refills...and that should not mean every 5 minutes and should not mean 8 ounces only... I like my big cups of (Diet Soda) something to drink....I am not abnormal in fact I am in the majority.... the current cup size is unrealistic....the 5 minute refills is unrealistic. This has always been my opinion even before the rfid and I have (always politely) mentioned this to many CMs and usually they seem to "unofficially" agree....Im tired after a fun day outside in the Florida sun...why do I need to get up and walk to the soda machine over and over to fill this little cup..... For what they pay for the soda they can offer us more realisticly sized cups AT LEAST!

I agree with the refill time, and I would be willing to bet that a lot of the guests in the test group might feel the same. When (I say when because I feel that it is inevitable) this program goes resort wide we might see them do away with the refill time limit.

 

[Brian Noble]

This is where the argument falls apart. You have no proof that they would have purchased a beverage

They probably wouldn't buy one every single time. In fact, they almost certainly would not. It is very likely that the mug scofflaws are taking much more soda now than they would buy if they could no longer get free soda any time they wanted.

However, some fraction of them *will* buy a resort mug if this system is implemented at their resort for their next visit. Some other fraction of them will not buy a mug, but will buy one, or two, or three sodas over the course of their visit. At that point it is a simple numbers game. If the increased revenue from these "new" mug/drink purchases outweighs the cost of the new system, it will be implemented resort-wide in a heartbeat. If it does not, then it won't. Simple as that.

Most people will not be troubled by the five minute thing. How often now do you see people (who aren't sharing a mug) fill it, pound it, and fill it again, all within five minutes? I don't know about you, but I almost never see this at the beverage stations. Usually, people come up, fill their mugs, and walk away to do whatever is next on their agenda. You can get around the sip-and-top-off-problem by allowing "a fill" to be slightly more than the cup holds---and that's programmable per the company's web site. And, given Disney's fanaticism about measuring every little thing, I'm sure that one thing they are doing with the test is playing with the fill size, re-fill interval, etc. to see what works and what doesn't.

 

[Pioneer Hall]

They probably wouldn't buy one every single time. In fact, they almost certainly would not. It is very likely that the mug scofflaws are taking much more soda now than they would buy if they could no longer get free soda any time they wanted.

However, some fraction of them *will* buy a resort mug if this system is implemented at their resort for their next visit. Some other fraction of them will not buy a mug, but will buy one, or two, or three sodas over the course of their visit. At that point it is a simple numbers game. If the increased revenue from these "new" mug/drink purchases outweighs the cost of the new system, it will be implemented resort-wide in a heartbeat. If it does not, then it won't. Simple as that.

Most people will not be troubled by the five minute thing. How often now do you see people (who aren't sharing a mug) fill it, pound it, and fill it again, all within five minutes? I don't know about you, but I almost never see this at the beverage stations. Usually, people come up, fill their mugs, and walk away to do whatever is next on their agenda. You can get around the sip-and-top-off-problem by allowing "a fill" to be slightly more than the cup holds---and that's programmable per the company's web site. And, given Disney's fanaticism about measuring every little thing, I'm sure that one thing they are doing with the test is playing with the fill size, re-fill interval, etc. to see what works and what doesn't.

I usually see this at the end of the night when a lot of people have just gotten back from the parks. A lot of people will fill their mug, drink maybe half, and then fill it up again to take it back to their room. I'm certainly included in this group and I have seen many others as well.

 

[PlaneJane]

This is a long thread and I didn't read every post, so has anyone mentioned the hacking of an RFID chip, that would allow you to have a mug that had unlimited refills no matter what?

 

[Kamikaze]

This is a long thread and I didn't read every post, so has anyone mentioned the hacking of an RFID chip, that would allow you to have a mug that had unlimited refills not matter what?

No one has mentioned it. 'Override' tags were mentioned, however.

It depends on how the system was handled. Hacking of the chips would be a minor issue on Disney's end, and not something they'd concern themselves with.

 

[scpergj]

No one has mentioned it. 'Override' tags were mentioned, however.

It depends on how the system was handled. Hacking of the chips would be a minor issue on Disney's end, and not something they'd concern themselves with.

Most likely the date(s) would not be encoded on the RFID chip, but an ID. You would then have to hack the server in order to override the dates on the RFID chip.

To allow for additional chips, the reader would then just need to read whatever chips it could on the mug, then select the latest date from the database given the selected ID's (pretty easy to do).

 

[PlaneJane]

They are going to also have to put a warning on the mugs, saying not to microwave them. Unless you like flaming mugs

 

[Kamikaze]

They are going to also have to put a warning on the mugs, saying not to microwave them. Unless you like flaming mugs

Good point. ValidFill's site says that some cups are dishwasher safe and some are not, but they are not microwave safe. I don't know if they differentiate between mugs and cups, however.

 

[puntagordabob]

Most people will not be troubled by the five minute thing. How often now do you see people (who aren't sharing a mug) fill it, pound it, and fill it again, all within five minutes? I don't know about you, but I almost never see this at the beverage stations. Usually, people come up, fill their mugs, and walk away to do whatever is next on their agenda..

LOL we must be going at different times then as I see this all the time especially in the afternoon or evening by Guests who usually have just returned to the resort out of the Florida sun (especially in Summer when it is as my brother says "Africa Hot" though I think his comment was likely thinking of the Sahara :lol: ) .....

Also for the record I drink diet soda like a Camel on "empty" when I come back from the parks... Sometimes I can very quickly go through 16 ounces of soda (that is TWO refills!!!!) before my thirst is quenched and I have cooled down.... then I have a third refill to go. Since the sign says "Unlimited Refills" I do NOT consider this abuse of the system....PERIOD. I am not sure how any rational reason could be given on here to argue against my point on this.

They are going to also have to put a warning on the mugs, saying not to microwave them. Unless you like flaming mugs

Would hot chocolate or coffee cause them harm? Never considered that until you said that....after all they are insulated and all BUT I assume the RFIDs are within the insulated wall and heat would be more intense in there right?

 

[Master Yoda]

Would hot chocolate or coffee cause them harm? Never considered that until you said that....after all they are insulated and all BUT I assume the RFIDs are within the insulated wall and heat would be more intense in there right?

The problem with microwaving is not the heat it is the rather violent reaction microwaves have on metal. The heat from a beverage should not be a problem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCVmSKS_LRw

 

[Pioneer Hall]

LOL we must be going at different times then as I see this all the time especially in the afternoon or evening by Guests who usually have just returned to the resort out of the Florida sun (especially in Summer when it is as my brother says "Africa Hot" though I think his comment was likely thinking of the Sahara :lol: ) .....

Also for the record I drink diet soda like a Camel on "empty" when I come back from the parks... Sometimes I can very quickly go through 16 ounces of soda (that is TWO refills!!!!) before my thirst is quenched and I have cooled down.... then I have a third refill to go. Since the sign says "Unlimited Refills" I do NOT consider this abuse of the system....PERIOD. I am not sure how any rational reason could be given on here to argue against my point on this.



Would hot chocolate or coffee cause them harm? Never considered that until you said that....after all they are insulated and all BUT I assume the RFIDs are within the insulated wall and heat would be more intense in there right?

I think it has to do more with the waves going through the chip that causes them to ignite. Similar to what happens with aluminum foil...you can heat it up just fine, but don't put it in the microwave.

 

[flynnibus]

Also for the record I drink diet soda like a Camel on "empty" when I come back from the parks... Sometimes I can very quickly go through 16 ounces of soda (that is TWO refills!!!!) before my thirst is quenched and I have cooled down.... then I have a third refill to go. Since the sign says "Unlimited Refills" I do NOT consider this abuse of the system....PERIOD. I am not sure how any rational reason could be given on here to argue against my point on this.

because the buffer timer is intended to keep someone from using the mug to refill OTHER cups which WOULD be abuse of the system.

it was already stated in other coverage on the system, that their is a timer to fill the mug... it's not 'one shot' and then done. There is a timer window to fill the mug.. during which you could chug and refill again... after which there is a refill timer (the mentioned 5 min timer) which must expire before the cycle can be repeated.

The system has a window to start and finish your 'refill' and its not tied to a single fill.

 

[flynnibus]

This is a long thread and I didn't read every post, so has anyone mentioned the hacking of an RFID chip, that would allow you to have a mug that had unlimited refills no matter what?

The RFID chip is like a serial number... not a brain chip. The chip itself doesn't really know anything.. it's just an identity, that unless authorized in the system, doesn't do anything.

So 'hacking' would mean either cloning existing IDs, or hacking Disney's servers.

What we don't know is if Disney 'activates' each cup at POS... or if there is a 'first time used' expiration system used.

 

[flynnibus]

Yeah, and I think it's fine they may be doing it. To me, it's funny that they are so concerned about losing a few bucks on soda, they may implement such a system on a wide scale basis. I mean, RFID chips on disposable paper cups seems crazy expensive. It just doesn't seem worth it. There are so many other things at WDW that need much more attention than this.

It's not about the cost of the soda - it's about the loss of sales. Soda is a very high margin item. So losing a $10 dollar sale in soda takes a lot more revenue somewhere else to make up.

It's about losing sales, not losing soda inventory.

 

[Kamikaze]

The RFID chip is like a serial number... not a brain chip. The chip itself doesn't really know anything.. it's just an identity, that unless authorized in the system, doesn't do anything.

So 'hacking' would mean either cloning existing IDs, or hacking Disney's servers.

What we don't know is if Disney 'activates' each cup at POS... or if there is a 'first time used' expiration system used.

If the RFID tag stores the number of refills or end date (as it says it does as described on ValidFill's site, you can theoretically add new refills or extend the end date with a RFID writer.