News New Gondola Transportation - Disney Skyliner -

[mmascari]

The omnimover concept basically consists of
- linked 'trucks' in a continuous loop
- the 'seat' can be pivoted by the track to control line of sight and maintain its position over inclines/declines
- driven by the shared drive system
- the automated restraints
- automated loading

Is the first one "linked 'trucks' in a continuous loop" how they all work?

I always thought there was some chain drive mechanism underneath that all the ride vehicles were connected to. I wouldn't have thought that they were all strong enough to push/pull on each other directly. I guess you learn something new everyday after all.

The rest could be argued are true for a gondola.
- the gondola rotates through the station (in the sense that it changes orientation, the whole thing moves not just part of it, perhaps a stretch).
- the bull wheel drives the entire system, completely shared. I forget if in this implementation the station drive wheels are driven from the main line or are independent electric. That would make a difference for the sharing. They're clearly still coupled in operation, since one can't move without the other or issues occur.
- the door restrains you from getting out, and they are automated for open can close.
- Is automated loading, just loading while it's moving or something else?

Not on this list is that all vehicles move at once in unison or none move at all. While definitely true for an omnimovier, it's only mostly true for the gondola. In practical consideration, either the gondola and station cars all move in unison or not at all, but technically, if the line stops at the exact moment a car is detaching or reattaching, it would finish it's run from wire to station wheel or station to wire before stopping, not instant. It'll also be easier to remove and replace a single gondola than a single car on an omnimover (probably because of the way the trucks are linked).

 

[danlb_2000]

I love the price argument, when we already know the rates...they don't look much different than before the system. Outside the main construction outlay, the cost of operating a system like this is magnitudes lower, per person, than the bus...I just wonder what people are thinking when they say stuff like this.

The other funny thing is the height issue...completely ignoring that the monorails entering the Contemporary are actually at a higher level than the gondolas ever reach...

We don't know the rates yet. As has been discussed, they won't actually raise the rates until the system is up and running.

 

[flynnibus]

Is the first one "linked 'trucks' in a continuous loop" how they all work?

For an actual omnimover - yes. The point being, not all continuously moving looping systems are omnimovers.. we just associate that term as Disney fans with continuously loading and looping systems. Even if it's not really accurate.

See this for the original patent definition

The rest could be argued are true for a gondola.
- the gondola rotates through the station (in the sense that it changes orientation, the whole thing moves not just part of it, perhaps a stretch).
- the bull wheel drives the entire system, completely shared. I forget if in this implementation the station drive wheels are driven from the main line or are independent electric. That would make a difference for the sharing. They're clearly still coupled in operation, since one can't move without the other or issues occur.
- the door restrains you from getting out, and they are automated for open can close.
- Is automated loading, just loading while it's moving or something else?

Gondola's have a shared propulsion, and it's single 'tracked' but they simply clamp on (and off) that rope. They are not the chain itself. The orientation element is about controlling the Field of View of the rider to make them face a certain way... not about what direction the vehicle is heading in. And the restraint point is about the restraint opening/closing being driven by the track, not simply being manual or not.

Again, that is just the original definition... Disney has of course expanded upon the original design in many different ways.. from being able to move vehicles on/off the loop.. loading that doesn't need ominimovers, but still uses moving platforms.. to vehicles that can rotate on their own, etc.

It's more a kleenex vs tissue debate

 

[GoofGoof]

Yes done all of that. I think the Gondolas will be a far bigger draw than the boats and far lower capacity than the monorail. If guests paying for a resort on the Gondola find themselves waiting more than 30+ minutes for it regularly then Disney will do things to limit access, such as requiring a Magic Band linked to a hotel reservation either onsite OR at one of the hotels served by the system. Personally I hope it doesn't happen but I know how slow loading these systems can be...

When they first open there will be a draw to ride them. It will die fast once most of the regulars have done it. People don’t regularly ride the boats or momorail unless they are going to/from the parks. This will be no different. Remember there’s no AC so they will be uncomfortable 90% of the time

If people have to wait 30 minutes post Illuminations or SW Fireworks I would think that would be no worse than the buses and better on most nights. Outside of park close and possibly pre-rope drop in the morning the math just doesn’t support a wait that long. Saying it over and over isn’t going to make it any more likely. We will know soon enough. I am fairly certain they won’t add band readers to this because of capacity.

 

[kurtk]

If it has already been posted, I apologize, but if not, then I'm finally making a contribution to this thread! The video is over an hour long because it also goes into construction at CBR and Riviera.

Can someone explain to that guy the concept of editing? I want to see the status of the skyliner but don't have an hour to spare.

 

[Rich Brownn]

You should know better than anyone, Marni, that in the past the Transportation System was NOT considered complimentary, and in fact WDW transportation system "passes" were sold for a nominal amount... I think the passes were last sold in the 90s (despite no enforcement by bus drivers asking to see pass or room key).

I think he meant it was "complimentary" in the way that resorts advertise "Free HBO", etc. You don't pay extra, its included in the rate. (technically one could say the ticket books included "complimentary" transportation too)

 

[MisterPenguin]

Can someone explain to that guy the concept of editing? I want to see the status of the skyliner but don't have an hour to spare.

It was a livecast, so, he was talking to people we don't care about as he walked about. There was no new news in this one.

 

[larryz]

...(technically one could say the ticket books included "complimentary" transportation too)

Ah, but it wasn't. Some of the early ticket media detailed the exact amount being collected for the WED Transportation Systems co.

 

[sndral]

Can some one explain to me how the Epcot line is not going to be slowed down by the need to load/unload ECVs, including multiples in some groups, at Riviera? The fact that all the other stations have the double bull wheel set up and Riviera does not just screams bottleneck to me.

 

[nickys]

Can some one explain to me how the Epcot line is not going to be slowed down by the need to load/unload ECVs, including multiples in some groups, at Riviera? The fact that all the other stations have the double bull wheel set up and Riviera does not just screams bottleneck to me.

We don’t know yet.

The most likely option I can think of is that when the cabins go through the detach / attach process here, that secondary cable will move slower than the other stations. So that people have even more time to load and unload. It’ll be at a crawling pace rather than walking pace.

The only reason we know how it works at the terminal stations is because @Lift Blog was able to explain it to us. It is an innovative system.

The Emirates line in London is the only gondola system I’ve ridden. Just the one bull wheel, no stopping. I saw wheelchairs and a scooter boarding there no issue. They walked them to the point at the top of the bend and they boarded there, whilst the rest of us just got on along the straight platform. None of those groups I watched needed it stopped. Are scooter users in the U.K. any better at driving them forward through a door? I doubt it! So it will work like every other system in the world works.

And if necessary, they will be able to stop it. Is this the end of the world? Will it ruin anyone’s day if it takes a minute longer?

 

[MisterPenguin]

Can some one explain to me how the Epcot line is not going to be slowed down by the need to load/unload ECVs, including multiples in some groups, at Riviera? The fact that all the other stations have the double bull wheel set up and Riviera does not just screams bottleneck to me.

Because, ordinarily, without a second pull-off for ECVs, ECVs should have no problem getting in and out of a gondola. The pull-offs on the other stations is just gravy.

 

[Bender123]

When they first open there will be a draw to ride them. It will die fast once most of the regulars have done it. People don’t regularly ride the boats or momorail unless they are going to/from the parks. This will be no different. Remember there’s no AC so they will be uncomfortable 90% of the time

If people have to wait 30 minutes post Illuminations or SW Fireworks I would think that would be no worse than the buses and better on most nights. Outside of park close and possibly pre-rope drop in the morning the math just doesn’t support a wait that long. Saying it over and over isn’t going to make it any more likely. We will know soon enough. I am fairly certain they won’t add band readers to this because of capacity.

Also...the idea the gondola is lower capacity in the quote you are commenting on is simply inaccurate. At worst, they are similar capacity and at best, they are higher. The monorail actually has a fairly low batch process capacity of around 220-250 people per dispatch (varies depending on its makeup. At the best of times, there is about a five minutes pacing between trains with a three minute cycle time. That's juuuust under 2000 people per hour, assuming that there is no slow down at any loading point, the trains are packed full, dispatch is flowing smoothly, etc... Doesn't that number sound familiar?

This whole discussion would be a lot better if people stopped acting like real world examples of this technology don't already exist.

 

[NormC]

Gondola will handle twice the people of the monorail. 4500 people per hour is spec for the system but rumor is Disney may be placing more cabins to reach 5000.

 

[danlb_2000]

Gondola will handle twice the people of the monorail. 4500 people per hour is spec for the system but rumor is Disney may be placing more cabins to reach 5000.

What is the capacity of the monorail?

 

[NormC]

Good question. According to the post I was replying to he said about 2000.

 

[Doug Means]

The omnimover concept basically consists of
- linked 'trucks' in a continuous loop
- the 'seat' can be pivoted by the track to control line of sight and maintain its position over inclines/declines
- driven by the shared drive system
- the automated restraints
- automated loading

While we all remember and cherish the system more for the continuous loading and speed... it's main purpose/innovation was the fact it was able to control the FOV of the passengers and position from the track itself.

Obviously in the lay for Disney, we focus on the 'continuous movement' angle more than anything as that's the thing that stands out the most to casual observers

Isn't a Omnimover just a flat escalator or moving sidewalk with seats?

 

[Bender123]

Good question. According to the post I was replying to he said about 2000.

They are listed at "360" maximum in designa nd operational specs, but that's also assuming average sized people, packed in, no scooters, strollers, bags, etc...More realistic on a normal trip is likely closer to 250 per train. Assuming the system is clipping along, loads are smooth as butter and the trains are running at 250 people, its around 2000 people per hour that can be moved from a point. Its not nearly as efficient as people think it is...It was originally made for a significantly lower load.

 

[bunnyman]

Can some one explain to me how the Epcot line is not going to be slowed down by the need to load/unload ECVs, including multiples in some groups, at Riviera? The fact that all the other stations have the double bull wheel set up and Riviera does not just screams bottleneck to me.

As a skier, its done all the time. As I understand, when the gondola grips detach from the cable and travel separately around the wheel, they're able to remove/add cabins. I've seen them add in a cargo cabin to bring supplies up to a peak lodge, and it doesn't interrupt the rest of the loading process.

 

[MisterPenguin]

What is the capacity of the monorail?

A European monorail or an African monorail?

 

[Doug Means]

A European monorail or an African monorail?

wouldn't this be an Americanized Monorail