News New Gondola Transportation - Disney Skyliner -

[kthomas105]

The issues of loading scooters and wheelchairs, the throughput numbers, and the detachable gondolas have all been covered multiple times in this thread. There's even a video of a wheelchair loading into an existing gondola.

And I wouldn't hold your breath for multiple loading platforms, that would increase the complexity (and cost) of the system more then it really needs. Don't get me wrong, I think it'd be pretty cool and would prevent an occasional slow down or stop, but I just don't expect it to happen. And I don't think the building footprints look large enough to have multiple platforms in them.

No breath holding here! I realize they would most likely go with the most cost efficient and maintenance friendly system available but using a multiple loading platform system really would make the system more efficient for riders and much safer especially for those loading wheelchairs or scooters. Maybe I can convince the decision makers for the "expansion plans".

 

[EdC]

We've seen Disney also move security checkpoints to the monorail resorts. I'd imagine you can expect the same thing with those getting on the gondolas. Once you're on, you've been cleared. Yet another way to differentiate versus how 'magical' that experience is elsewhere.

 

[frankc]

If you wanted to travel east - west, say from Disney Springs to DAK with stops in between and also with monorail and gondola interchanges, what system would you use?

Hypothetically speaking of course.

Right now the monorail and gondola do not intersect so hypothetically I would guess a circular route from DS to CBT to CSR to AKP to AKL back to Epcot and DS. I would also guess about 12 miles round trip which would require something moving 35+ MPH. Put me down for some kind of light rail.

 

[HauntedPirate]

We've seen Disney also move security checkpoints to the monorail resorts. I'd imagine you can expect the same thing with those getting on the gondolas. Once you're on, you've been cleared. Yet another way to differentiate versus how 'magical' that experience is elsewhere.

Well, except if you're going to Epcot. You still get the "pleasure" of going thru security twice at Epcot if you stay at a monorail resort.

 

[Kamikaze]

As a matter of fact I have first hand experience. Trains are supposed to be in and out in a minute and a half give or take 30-60 seconds for ECV's or slow loaders.

360 x 3 = 1080
1080 x 2 =2160 since each train will reach the station twice in an hour
That's 2160 theoretical guests per hour with 3 trains.

4 trains will be higher, but that math is more complicated than the 3 train numbers so I choose not to do them.

You need to look at how many times a gondola car will reach the station, and what kind of cycle times it will be. For that same loop I would guess somewhere around 30-40 minute full cycle time. If each gondola holds 20 passengers, and there are 60 gondolas on the system with 30 minute cycle that is roughly 1 gondola every minute. That means those 20 passengers need to disembark in 60 seconds regardless of if there is an ecv or wheelchair which take longer.
60 x 20 = 1200 guests per cycle
2 cycles at 30 minutes a cycle equals 2400 guests per hour
Yes that is more than 3 trains, but we can add another train, 2 trains, 3 trains, w/e. The gondola is theoretically fixed so what you build with is what you are stuck with.
Unless I'm way off with my math, and please correct me if I'm wrong, the gondolas are not more efficient at moving guests over the same distance as the monorail.

Needs to be an apples to apples comparison, and what I have done here is as close as I can come up with.

*edit* sorry if I derailed the thread further, I just like accurate information be delivered.

What the heck are you talking about? The monorail capacity is much, much higher than 2160 per hour per line.

 

[Figment2005]

What the heck are you talking about? The monorail capacity is much, much higher than 2160 per hour per line.

Show me your math then.

 

[Kamikaze]

Show me your math then.

No reason to.

http://www.wdwmagic.com/transportation/monorail.htm

Capacity
Nearly 7,000 guests per direction, per hour. On a typical day, more than 150,000 guests use monorail transportation.

Just admit your argument is based on 'I like the monorail!' and we can be done with this.

 

[Figment2005]

No reason to.

http://www.wdwmagic.com/transportation/monorail.htm

Capacity
Nearly 7,000 guests per direction, per hour. On a typical day, more than 150,000 guests use monorail transportation.

That doesn't make sense. Each train can carry 360 people every 10 minutes. That would be 6 train loads per hour, hence 2160 per hour for 3 train operation.

@wdwmagic Just curious how you obtained 7k per hour for the monorail.

 

[Kamikaze]

That doesn't make sense. Each train can carry 360 people every 10 minutes. That would be 6 train loads per hour, hence 2160 per hour for 3 train operation.

@wdwmagic Just curious how you obtained 7k per hour for the monorail.

I had a much longer post about how bad your math and argument was the first time, but I deleted it to be nice. But dude, come on.

360 guests per train. 1 train every 3 minutes. Thats 20 pickups. 360 x (60/3) Thats 7200 guests. But you insist thats its less than 2 minutes. So that would be 30 pickups, or 360 x (60/2) for 10,800 guests per hour. Why do I have to help you make your bad argument?

 

[Kamikaze]

If you wanted to travel east - west, say from Disney Springs to DAK with stops in between and also with monorail and gondola interchanges, what system would you use?

Hypothetically speaking of course.

Light rail is their logical choice.

 

[Figment2005]

I had a much longer post about how bad your math and argument was the first time, but I deleted it to be nice. But dude, come on.

360 guests per train. 1 train every 3 minutes. Thats 20 pickups. Thats 7200 guests. But you insist thats its less than 2 minutes. So that would be 30 pickups, or 10,800 guests per hour. Why do I have to help you make your bad argument?

Lets say this. Red, Blue, and Black are operating on the express beam. Each individual train is NOT being loaded every 2 minutes. Red will be loaded every 10 minutes, Blue will be loaded every 10 minutes, and Black will be loaded every 10 minutes. 2 minutes at TTC, 3 minutes to MK in travel, 2 minutes unloading/loading at MK, 3 minutes traveling back to TTC. My math is solid. I've seen official numbers and they max around 4100 per hour with 4 trains under optimal conditions.

 

[JoeCamel]

Gee I really wish this was a Gondola construction thread

 

[MisterPenguin]

If you wanted to travel east - west, say from Disney Springs to DAK with stops in between and also with monorail and gondola interchanges, what system would you use?

Hypothetically speaking of course.

Levitate. Let the earth turn beneath me. Though, going from AKL to DS would take 23 hours.

Or, pull up the Disney Autonomous Transportation app and call up a vehicle for pick-up.

 

[MisterPenguin]

How do you figure?
Wouldn't this be completely dependent on the number of gondolas in service on the line?

With a bus, the time between vehicle arrivals is such that loading an accessability device makes no difference to the overall capacity or speed of the service. A gondola system would likely be the opposite, as is often seen in many rides.

The slow moving load/unload gondolas in the stations don't stop for accessibility vehicles... you just wheel right on.

The extra time for load accessibility vehicles for buses would not be a slow down for buses if they stopped at specific bus stop at specific times and kept a rigid arrival/departure schedule which baked in time for accessibility vehicles. But the Disney buses generally just keep moving on a loop. And every slow-load will reduce the number of loops that bus will make.

 

[orky8]

If you wanted to travel east - west, say from Disney Springs to DAK with stops in between and also with monorail and gondola interchanges, what system would you use?

Hypothetically speaking of course.

I'd be looking for a train-like transportation that is elevated and travels on a single rail.

 

[Creathir]

If you wanted to travel east - west, say from Disney Springs to DAK with stops in between and also with monorail and gondola interchanges, what system would you use?

Hypothetically speaking of course.

PRT?

Seriously, it would be the most flexible and cost the least.

Light rail is EXPENSIVE.
PRT.


Start at DS, hit TL.

PRT would allow for spurs to interface with the Epcot monorail station and still have a simple layout.

It would be able to ride next to Buena Vista Dr and have bridges over other roadways and the numerous waterways which would be inexpensive.

Boardwalk gondola turning station will be the transfer point for the gondola.

It then can hit CSR, BB, a spur to ASR, with the main line heading to AK and finishing up at AKL and KV.

 

[Goob]

I have a feeling that PRT's are being heavily looked at by Disney.

 

[Creathir]

I have a feeling that PRT's are being heavily looked at by Disney.

Me too.

 

[Bairstow]

The slow moving load/unload gondolas in the stations don't stop for accessibility vehicles... you just wheel right on.

That seems unlikely and highly dangerous.

The extra time for load accessibility vehicles for buses would not be a slow down for buses if they stopped at specific bus stop at specific times and kept a rigid arrival/departure schedule which baked in time for accessibility vehicles. But the Disney buses generally just keep moving on a loop. And every slow-load will reduce the number of loops that bus will make.

Only if a slow-load took so long that it overlapped with the arrive/loiter/leave time of the bus behind it, which is unlikely and can be easily compensated by having the next bus loiter slightly longer or less, depending on where the other vehicles are in the rotation. During most of the day, the buses are operating at a fraction of their capacity, which makes the timing of their circuits highly elastic. There's even greater flexibility when you factor in the capability for the dispatchers to allocate more or fewer buses to the routes, depending on need, which Disney actively does.

 

[Creathir]

Here is a crappy sketch from my iPhone...