New Fast Pass Testing at Splash Mountain?

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Mansion Butler

Active Member
Lastly, I can't say this is always true, but in my experience, whenever I see a FP queue extremely backed up with "latecomers", such as Space Mountain, this has usually been due to the ride being DOWN one or more times throughout the day, and large numbers of people not being able to ride "on time" even if they wanted to!
It can be due to down time, but, depending on the ride, it is usually because of a lot of late FP users coming at once.

Or the Cast Member inside feeling bad for the stand by line and letting too many of them in.

Right... but if I'm a 11PM fast pass holder, and you, a 10am FP holder show up both at 11:10pm. You're now making my FP wait time longer because you shouldn't be line at 11:10pm.
Not if the cast members do their job.
 
See I agree with Scuttle on this one. I usually do use late fastpasses alot when Im there, and I really have never had a problem with long fastpass lines late at night. So I for one, really dont like the idea of this..
 

mrsdanalind

Member
Hi everyone, long time reader first time poster. Ive been visiting the world since I was a kid and this struck me as odd today. We had 2:15 passes for splash mountain in frontier land and got there a little early. While waiting we noticed they were taking the passes at the fast pass return area instead of inside the mountain. At first I thought it had to be a cm mistake but a bunch of manager types were standing around collecting the passes and actually questioning people on why they were coming in with late passes.

Anyone more "in the know" have any details? It seems odd and a little dumb to collect the passes out front as anyone can duck under the ropes since the two lines are so close. Hopefully its just a test but wondering why all the questioning? Were still in the world until Tuesday so ill try to make my way back to find out more

Hope they find a way to make it better, I've done fast pass and I love it, except that there seems to be no limit to the number of passes one group can take out.. I stood in line for TSMM and when I got to the kiosk it was empty. The tour group ahead of me took 200 passes... That to me was beyond greedy and ridiculous. Did they use them all? I don't know because there was no reason to go and stand around for 2 and ahalf hours to go on the ride.
 

Mansion Butler

Active Member
Hope they find a way to make it better, I've done fast pass and I love it, except that there seems to be no limit to the number of passes one group can take out.. I stood in line for TSMM and when I got to the kiosk it was empty. The tour group ahead of me took 200 passes... That to me was beyond greedy and ridiculous. Did they use them all? I don't know because there was no reason to go and stand around for 2 and ahalf hours to go on the ride.
It's limited by how many people are in their group. It's not greedy, they are paying guests who wish to make the inclusion of a FastPass fee in their park admission worth it by getting FPs. There just happen to be a lot of them together.
 

Scuttle

Well-Known Member
The only way I would like this "new system" for fastpass is if the system gave you a 2-3 hour return window, but if you didn't make it back in time the system adds your missed fastpass for distribution later so someone else can use your fastpass later. That could make fastpass last later into the day. I'm sure they are considering such a system. But I guarantee if they change to no late arrivals then the window will be atleast 2 hours.
 

wm49rs

A naughty bit o' crumpet
Premium Member
The only way I would like this "new system" for fastpass is if the system gave you a 2-3 hour return window, but if you didn't make it back in time the system adds your missed fastpass for distribution later so someone else can use your fastpass later. That could make fastpass last later into the day. I'm sure they are considering such a system. But I guarantee if they change to no late arrivals then the window will be atleast 2 hours.

I agree that eventually this would be reasonable system for them to implement. It would give people time for other attractions (or dining), while still maintaining the FP system overall.

And I'm glad to see the OP got his money's worth in this thread....
 

Mansion Butler

Active Member
The only way I would like this "new system" for fastpass is if the system gave you a 2-3 hour return window, but if you didn't make it back in time the system adds your missed fastpass for distribution later so someone else can use your fastpass later. That could make fastpass last later into the day. I'm sure they are considering such a system. But I guarantee if they change to no late arrivals then the window will be atleast 2 hours.
That would still result in needing to up the FP ratio for a certain time bracket, so the only difference between that and letting someone just use their thing late is that a guest has been made angry because they couldn't use their thing late.
 

DonaldDoleWhip

Well-Known Member
As long as EVERY manager I've ever asked in the park tells me I am NOT "breaking any rules" by using a FP "late", I will not feel like I am doing anything "wrong" or "hurting" anyone by doing so. Their word is more binding to me about what is acceptable conduct in the parks that that of some disgruntled fans on a message board for whom everything bad in the parks can be blamed on "late" FP arrivals :rolleyes:
Agreed.

If anything, when I see the people who send one person to get in line for a ride, and then a party of 10 cuts everyone else because that one person is far ahead, I think that's way more wrong than using a late fastpass. And nobody ever complains about how that slows down the standby line.
 

BigThunderMatt

Well-Known Member
I think that's way more wrong than using a late fastpass. And nobody ever complains about how that slows down the standby line.

Nobody ever complains about it, period. And they should. I used to work at Cedar Point and the policy there was, no matter what your reason, be it bathroom, food, or otherwise, if you left the line or left your party to get in line and hold a spot for them, you or them had to start back at the end when you rejoined the line. If you passed by ANYONE, it was grounds for immediate removal from the park.

Some people might say that if you have small children that need to go to the bathroom at the last minute, you just can't control it. Well that's when you need to step up and be an appropriate parent and ask BEFORE you get in line, if they need to use the bathroom, or better yet, if you know it's going to be a long wait, MAKE them go. Make sure everyone in your party is together BEFORE getting in line and you have everything you need with you before getting in line. Nothing annoys me more than these people that freak out that if they have to wait any longer than RIGHT NOW to get in line that the standby wait is going to jump 3 hours in the time it takes for them to have their entire party go in at once and just expect everyone to be cool with their party catching up to them, be it 2 or 20 extra people.

Guest Service needs to go out the window. The people that cut need to get tossed out of the park or at the very least, the line they're in. The party being dissatisfied about the issue at hand pales in comparison to the amount of people they surely tick off when they cut in front of them.
 

Siege898

New Member
Let's think about this mathematically...

Let's say for example that we are talking about a random E-ticket attraction that has FP at MK (doesn't really matter which one for this argument).

Now, its a standard summer day and the park is open from 9am-11pm. So, we have 14 hours of ride/park operation.

We need to figure out the number of fastpasses that are distributed. Ruling out most of the first hour, and most of the last hour of the day, we're left with about 12-12.5 hours of FP distribution during a day. To round things off, let's just say 12 hours of FP distribution.

As a conservative estimate, let's say that about 80 FPs are set to be
distributed per 5 minute time slot during the day. However, in practice, this is the maximum number of FPs distributed. For an attraction like TSM, all FPs could be distributed. However, especially in the offpeak hours, the FP time may rollover without distributing all 80 FPs. So again, as an average, let's say that about 70 of these 80 FPs are actually distributed per 5 minute window.

This leaves us with...10080 FPs distributed during the day for our attraction.

Most people do not take advantage of the system and use their FP at the proper time. Let's say this happens with roughly 80% of FPs. (If they don't use it within the hour, they are at least close enough. Within an hour).

That leaves 2000 FPs out there. There are also people that may never use their FPs, but we'll just say that there are 2000 people that actually use their FP late.

Now, we have a 14 hour day. But realistically, if you're using your FP late, we probably only have a 10 hour window of late FP usage. So that comes out to roughly 200 people per hour. So, therefore, every hour, (after about 1pm or so), we expect that there are 200 people using their fastpass drastically late (2+ hours).

Obviously, this is a rough average. There will peaks and valleys in this distribution throughout the day depending on park events. One of the most popular times happens to be right after the fireworks (ESPECIALLY at Space). So during the hour immediately following the fireworks, we'll say 400 people use their fastpass late.

As an estimate for the average OHRC, let's use 1600. Some are lower (TSM), and some are higher (Splash).

We can now calculate how much longer the standby line would be due to these late arrivals. Assuming all 400 people came to use their late FP AT ONCE, the standby line would be only 15 min longer.

For our average of 200 late FP users, the standby line is only about 7 min longer due to late FP users. (Assuming they came all at once)

In practice, they aren't going to come all at once, so the effect on the standby line would be even lower (unless the line is greater than an hour).

For example, based on our average, if Attraction X has a 30 minute wait, we can expect only a 3 min increase due to late FP usage.

Therefore, we have learned that the net effect of late FP usage is trivial. This is why Disney has chosen to not argue with the guests for the last several years. It simply isn't worth the argument.

If FP pre-planning were done, the number of FPs distributed would probably go up and therefore the effect would be higher. At that point, Disney may begin to enforce its policy.
 

peter11435

Well-Known Member
In fact, the back of the ticket says "May only be used on the date issued. Cannot accept early arrivals". It doesn't say ANYTHING about you can't be "late".

To be fair the first thing printed on the back of the fast pass says: "Please enter the Fastpass entrance at the attraction between the times noted on the other side."
 

draybook

Well-Known Member
To be fair the first thing printed on the back of the fast pass says: "Please enter the Fastpass entrance at the attraction between the times noted on the other side."


And yet it says nothing about not being admitted at a later time. There's no grey area here people, it's in the print, and we all know that in this day and age it's all about wording.
 

travelskip

Member
Tokyo has always enforced the times. Never saw an issue while I was there...

Oh, and there was a 30-45 min wait to get a FP at Monsters Inc and a 3-4 hour wait for standby all day. Everyone was still orderly and smiling.

It's just how they are used to doing it. Adaptability.
 

David S.

Member
Sorry, the post I was responding to was deleted. In the spirit of cooperating with the moderation, I will remove the content of my post... and thank you ;)
 

Krack

Active Member
And yet it says nothing about not being admitted at a later time. There's no grey area here people, it's in the print, and we all know that in this day and age it's all about wording.

When I was a cop, I almost always said "please put your hands on top of your head" before handcuffing someone. I may have said please, but that doesn't mean it was an optional request.
 

The Mom

Moderator
Premium Member
And yet it says nothing about not being admitted at a later time. There's no grey area here people, it's in the print, and we all know that in this day and age it's all about wording.

I guess it's a matter of interpretation? I would interpret "between the times listed" to mean exactly that, not that it meant I could show up anytime after the last time listed. I don't have to read "no admittance at a later time" to come to that conclusion, and I would consider the fact that another reasonable person (you along with many others, including, apparently, CMs) could read the same ticket and come to a different conclusion means that it is a grey area. :shrug:

But I'm not going to lose any sleep worrying about how others interpret what is written on their FP, nor do I consider them unintelligent or some sort of criminal for doing so. ;)
 

David S.

Member
Right... but if I'm a 11PM fast pass holder, and you, a 10am FP holder show up both at 11:10pm. You're now making my FP wait time longer because you shouldn't be line at 11:10pm.

While you not getting in the FP line on time may benefit the Standy By line, it hurts the FP line when you do.

But by me being "late," the people who had FPs during the "window" I was "supposed" to use it for and would have been in back of me got on one person earlier than they would have.

That's why I think it all evens out. And think of how you benefit when any FPs during or before your window end up not being used AT ALL, "on time" OR "late". This gets you on the ride quicker as well, as many go unused. The times you benefit from people being late or not using their pass at all are numerous, they are just difficult to notice as they are more "intangible" than when you feel a "late" FP user has caused you a delay.

And even if there are a few times when a "late" FP user causes you to get on the ride a few minutes later than you THINK you would have, IMO this is a winning trade-off for the knowledge that you, too, can have the greater flexibility of being able to use them, at your convenience, anytime after the first time. The time you'll save on less backtracking alone will make it well worth it!
 

G00fyDad

Well-Known Member
nor do I consider them unintelligent or some sort of criminal for doing so. ;)

Allow me to put it another way since everyone keeps saying that I am calling them criminals. (The inamtes I work with were the easiest example of the thought process I could think of quickly) This same mentality comes from the guards at the desk (not criminals) that will contantly think everyone needs to follow the law, except them. They run stop signs, turn right on a red when it is posted not to, they do not use signals, etc... because they see the rules as beneath them. That is the point I was trying to make.

To be more specific, those that will say that there is nothing saying that you must return before the end time on a FP.... well, when driving there are no signs posted saying you have to use a turn signal either but you're supposed to aren't you?
 

David S.

Member
I guess it's a matter of interpretation? I would interpret "between the times listed" to mean exactly that, not that it meant I could show up anytime after the last time listed. I don't have to read "no admittance at a later time" to come to that conclusion, and I would consider the fact that another reasonable person (you along with many others, including, apparently, CMs) could read the same ticket and come to a different conclusion means that it is a grey area. :shrug:

But I'm not going to lose any sleep worrying about how others interpret what is written on their FP, nor do I consider them unintelligent or some sort of criminal for doing so. ;)

Thanks! ;)

For what it's worth, I just want to clarify here (since much of what I wrote was part of a removed conversation, and I am NOT objecting to that - you did me a BIG favor by ending that conversation! :)

But I want to clarify that the ONLY reason I ever became comfortable with using them "late", was because I was told not only by every CM I ever asked, but every MANAGER I've ever asked as well, that their policy was to accept them anytime between the first time printed on the ticket and park close, and that they considered the one hour window a "guideline" and not a "rule".

This was something I found out when I first began using the system in 2006, not in the context of asking a manager for "special treatment" as some were saying, but in friendly chats with them where I was just trying to learn the ins and outs of the system as a "newbie". And in numerous park visits in the 5.5 years since then, I have never been told or experienced anything that contradicted this.

Had I been told this was not allowed I would have accepted and abided by it, but the overall tone was always one of permissiveness and "we only look at the first time".

It was never my intention to "break any rules" or be branded a "rule breaker", nor did I see the "rules" as "beneath me", because I was always told that there was no "rule" that you had to use it in that window. And I knew that the same system that allowed me to do this allowed it for everyone else as well, so I was NEVER looking for, or thought I was entitled to, "special treatment".

Just wanted to clarify that ;)
 
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