Muppets

FigmentJedi

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
Really, I try not to get too bogged down in "Character Sounds Wrong" stuff when it comes to long-running characters. It's just an inevitability. We have wrong sounding Disney and Looney Tunes characters after all.
 
FigmentJedi

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
disneyphilip said:
Phil12, leave poor Steve Whitmire and the other current Muppeteers alone! They're just as amazing as the old-schoolers.

Tahi, I agree with you on the Muppeteers, but disagree with you on Bret Iwan--he's a great Mickey!
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He's passable for stuff where it's the happy generic mascot Mickey, but it doesn't really work as well in settings that go beyond that like Kingdom Hearts/Epic Mickey. There's a reason they went with a different actor for the Disney Channel shorts. I'd love it if Chris became the fulltime Mickey.

Also, Wayne is a tough act to follow. If he was still alive and well for Epic Mickey and they did it with full voice in the first game, that could very well have been the best acted Mickey production ever. Like a Mickey answer to Goofy Movie and Bill's emotional range in that.
 
AEfx

AEfx

Well-Known Member
Tahu said:
Really, I try not to get too bogged down in "Character Sounds Wrong" stuff when it comes to long-running characters. It's just an inevitability. We have wrong sounding Disney and Looney Tunes characters after all.
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I'm the same, but I do have to admit than I do wonder when other folks seemingly can do them perfectly, why they don't get them.

It's like how I don't understand when I occasionally check in on Days of Our Lives (2-3x a year) I don't understand how a soap can have cast an actor that is less-than-attractive AND can't act. I'm like...can't you at least get a pretty person that can't act?
 
Brer Panther

Brer Panther

Well-Known Member
disneyphilip said:
Also, Tahu, I disagree with you on Matt Vogel as well. He's doing a FANTASTIC job performing Jerry Nelson's characters. Besides, do not forget that Jerry personally trained Matt to do those roles.
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I agree. In fact, his performance as Constantine was seriously the only thing I liked about that character.
 
Phil12

Phil12

Well-Known Member
FoozieBear said:
While some characters only evolved because of other predecessors, Kermit has always been Kermit (although he wasn't quite yet a frog at the time) Wilkins was created a few years after the Muppets became popular from their television show Sam and Friends.
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Kermit started out as a lizard and was very primitive back in the Sam and Friends days (starting 1955). Wilkins was created in 1958 for commercial spots and was evolved from the lizard (he had to be called Wilkins because it was the sponsor's name and played into the bits with Wontkins). Kermit the frog evolved along with the Wilkins character. The Wilkins commercial spots stopped in 1961 but other commercials (for various companies) featuring Wilkins and Wontkins (or Frank and Fink, or Cal and So) ran until 1969. Kermit the frog didn't appear until about 1965. He was a continual evolving character with the same voice, mannerisms and character from the original lizard, to Wilkins and then finally Kermit the frog. Both Wilkins and Kermit the frog exhibited the same cartoonish violent behavior.
 
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Matt_Black

Matt_Black

Well-Known Member
AEfx said:
I'm the same, but I do have to admit than I do wonder when other folks seemingly can do them perfectly, why they don't get them.

It's like how I don't understand when I occasionally check in on Days of Our Lives (2-3x a year) I don't understand how a soap can have cast an actor that is less-than-attractive AND can't act. I'm like...can't you at least get a pretty person that can't act?
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Let's be honest- Days of Our Lives hasn't been good since they stopped doing really crazy off-the-wall stuff like Marlena getting possessed by the Devil.
 
Phil12

Phil12

Well-Known Member
disneyphilip said:
Phil12, leave poor Steve Whitmire and the other current Muppeteers alone! They're just as amazing as the old-schoolers.

Tahi, I agree with you on the Muppeteers, but disagree with you on Bret Iwan--he's a great Mickey!
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It's OK to disagree. The Muppets have distinctive sounds that the current Muppeteers can't match. IMO they shouldn't try to emulate the old school sound if they can't get it right. They should move on to other original characters.
 
Matt_Black

Matt_Black

Well-Known Member
Phil12 said:
It's OK to disagree. The Muppets have distinctive sounds that the current Muppeteers can't match. IMO they shouldn't try to emulate the old school sound if they can't get it right. They should move on to other original characters.
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I think Muppets Tonight has proven that, with few exceptions, new Muppet characters don't exactly stand the test of time.
 
FigmentJedi

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
Phil12 said:
Kermit started out as a lizard and was very primitive back in the Sam and Friends days (starting 1955). Wilkins was created in 1958 for commercial spots and was evolved from the lizard (he had to be called Wilkins because it was the sponsor's name and played into the bits with Wontkins). Kermit the frog evolved along with the Wilkins character. The Wilkins commercial spots stopped in 1961 but other commercials (for various companies) featuring Wilkins and Wontkins (or Frank and Fink, or Cal and So) ran until 1969. Kermit the frog didn't appear until about 1965. He was a continual evolving character with the same voice, mannerisms and character from the original lizard, to Wilkins and then finally Kermit the frog. Both Wilkins and Kermit the frog exhibited the same cartoonish violent behavior.
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Again, there's no true evolutionary connection. Original Lizard Kermit and Wilkins co-existed with each other and really, Wilkins was restricted to commercials while Lizard Kermit kept going on Sam and Friends and other appearances.

Everyone just assumes they're the same because of the voice and Wilkins looking like a rounder softer Kermit.
 
Phil12

Phil12

Well-Known Member
Tahu said:
Again, there's no true evolutionary connection. Original Lizard Kermit and Wilkins co-existed with each other and really, Wilkins was restricted to commercials while Lizard Kermit kept going on Sam and Friends and other appearances.

Everyone just assumes they're the same because of the voice and Wilkins looking like a rounder softer Kermit.
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I guess that's the reason why all the kids in the metro-D.C. area of the time interchangeably used the names Kermit and Wilkins (i.e. they were one in the same as far as the kids were concerned). ;)
 
FigmentJedi

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
Phil12 said:
I guess that's the reason why all the kids in the metro-D.C. area of the time interchangeably used the names Kermit and Wilkins (i.e. they were one in the same as far as the kids were concerned). ;)
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Well educational television didn't exist yet, so I wouldn't expect dumb children to be able to tell the difference between an angular character and a curved character.
 
Phil12

Phil12

Well-Known Member
Tahu said:
Well educational television didn't exist yet, so I wouldn't expect dumb children to be able to tell the difference between an angular character and a curved character.
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On small black and white TV's with copious interference it didn't make much difference. But the voices were clear! :)
 

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