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Rumor Muppets to Take Over The Hall of Presidents

The Empress Lilly

Well-Known Member
I should have qualified my opinion by stating in recent decades. All of your examples are true, but most pre-date 1990 in development.
I was going to add that nothing since Monsters has been humorous. I think, quickly from memory. There is not much funniness in NFL, Pandora, TSL, GE...

Not in the newest park of DAK either.

That doesn't disqualify them, but the development is noteworthy.
 

MadTeacup

Well-Known Member
Even with what you mentioned, I just don’t see that having staying power in the Magic Kingdom.
I see The Muppets Present: Hall of Presidents as having more staying power than the current Hall of Presidents. There are a lot of issues with the current format. You may call it patriotism. Some view it as propaganda. Also, a stage full of animatronic slave owners does not sit well with today's audience. If the Magic Kingdom is truly about leaving the real world behind, then something as political as the Hall of Presidents really needs to find a new focus, because it's the one attraction that brings me BACK to the real world.
I'm sure the change in wording wasn't intentional
I'm not. I doubt they had to redesign the art. They probably had the old signage art still saved from four years ago. The change in that one word makes a big difference and is likely purposeful so as to not make it sound as though The Walt Disney Company endorses a specific politician.
The Muppets are irreverent and satirical. Sam Eagle's patriotism is the punchline of many a joke in their shows and movies. You laugh at him for being so patriotic, not identify or be inspired by him.

Putting them in HoP would be like if Disney made a PSA about adopting rescue puppies with Cruella de Vil because "she likes dogs".
I'm not sure we watched the same Muppets. It was mostly Sam's protection of decency that was made into the punchline, not his patriotism. The Muppets often told patriotic stories and did so with a great deal of respect. It was the meeting of personalities, not jabs at history that made the stories funny. I don't believe your Simile to be a fair comparison at all.
Starlet and Waldorf are my favorite Muppets characters. If this happens I hope they get a part!
I can't imagine them not having a presence - especially inside a theater! I'm honestly hoping this rumor has some traction.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
If the Magic Kingdom is truly about leaving the real world behind, then something as political as the Hall of Presidents really needs to find a new focus, because it's the one attraction that brings me BACK to the real world.

The park is not just about leaving the real world behind. The fantasy of Magic Kingdom includes time travel to eras past and future:

"Disneyland is dedicated to the ideals, the dreams and the hard facts that have created America"

"Here you leave the world of today and enter the worlds of yesterday, tomorrow and fantasy"

"This program is dedicated to the memory of Walt Disney" - HoP (2017-2021)

The idea that Magic Kingdom is all [cartoon] fantasy is a product of Paul Pressler-era management. Americana and American history are crucial to the park's identity; that's why every subsequent castle park until Shanghai included them to a certain degree. The Hall of Presidents was something Walt spent the last 10 years of his life trying to get made and WED saw fit to realize once they had the chance to do so. You'd be hard pressed to find a more appropriate attraction for the park.

Not everyone who enters the park is obligated to see every attraction. We've had 50 years of people being content with saying HoP is boring, skipping it, and leaving it at that. WDI does not need to fix something that isn't broken to appeal to an audience that doesn't care for it in the first place.
 
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Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
I would respect people's opinion more if they admitted they just want the show to go away completely.

No amount of Muppets or humor will change the fact that this show is about the US Presidents; whatever they were like at the time they were alive, whether or not we like them today, whether their individual legacies are deserved etc.

The only way to make it offensive to nobody is to shut it down...but we know Disney will never do that because doing so will create backlash for other reasons. It's better off to keep the intent of the attraction in place, because after half a century the attraction that was once just about American history, now has developed its own history, and is a document of the kind of experience WDW used to have. For that reason I would support revising the show to include more about the company and founder's philosophy than any third party comedic commentary. Carousel of Progress already does this and I think other attractions could too.
 

dmw

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
The only way to make it offensive to nobody is to shut it down...
The differences in the personalities and politics of our presidents should be celebrated. Why should I be offended by seeing a president for whom I did not vote? All presidents are part of our history. Our country has changed a lot over time and this show is a wonderful representation of that history. People need to stop being offended so easily.

And, I think that having the Muppets as a pre-show in the outer area would be a fun way to celebrate our history before entering the main room for the more serious presentation.

The only change I would like to see in the main show is the removal of the speech by the current president. But... I could also accept a cute Muppet intro in the main room. But, no Muppets in the middle of the show - that would be a detraction, IMHO.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
You have waaaaaayyyy more faith than I do that HOP is a forever attraction. There are very few things that I think they would never remove. Hall of Presidents is no where close to that list.

I figure if Carousel of Progress has lasted this long, there's no reason to think HoP, a much more prominent attraction, would close completely any time soon. And few attraction closures would ever create an actual political or "Disney is anti-American" backlash like closing HoP (or The American Adventure).

Nearly all of MK's 1971-1980 E-tickets are still around in some form excluding 20,000 Leagues and The Mickey Mouse Revue (which didn't last long in Florida and even had its ticket status downgraded before closing). I'd like to think at this point Disney doesn't see the point in shuttering and/or replacing these larger scale attractions. Could they really come up with something more effective for this space in 2021?
 

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
I figure if Carousel of Progress has lasted this long, there's no reason to think HoP, a much more prominent attraction, would close completely any time soon. And few attraction closures would ever create an actual political or "Disney is anti-American" backlash like closing HoP (or The American Adventure).

Nearly all of MK's 1971-1980 E-tickets are still around in some form excluding 20,000 Leagues and The Mickey Mouse Revue (which didn't last long in Florida and even had its ticket status downgraded before closing). I'd like to think at this point Disney doesn't see the point in shuttering and/or replacing these larger scale attractions. Could they really come up with something more effective for this space in 2021?

I wish they would rebuild something like the Mickey Mouse Revue with updated technology. A bunch of Disney characters in one place, playing classic Disney music? I think that sounds great -- and it would probably be more successful today because attendance is so much higher.

If it was designed so they could easily change the music and sync the characters to that new music (which shouldn't be that hard; the old Showbiz Pizza animatronics can do that without too much work and newer technology should make it a much simpler task), then they could incorporate new Disney songs as well as rotate in old classics regularly. That would keep it somewhat fresh instead of being the same show every time. It would also probably need to only have the orchestra scene -- since additional scenes with specific animatronics wouldn't be so easily changed -- but they could add many more characters and instruments to that scene.

I bet it would stay busy most days at the Magic Kingdom just as something for people to do (and also as a place to get AC in the summer), especially since kids would probably enjoy it. It could also go in at DHS to add capacity to that park.
 

ppete1975

Well-Known Member
Everyone should listen to todays Mousetalgia. Hearing bob gurr talk about this attraction might remind you of what its supposed to mean.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
I wish they would rebuild something like the Mickey Mouse Revue with updated technology. A bunch of Disney characters in one place, playing classic Disney music? I think that sounds great -- and it would probably be more successful today because attendance is so much higher.

If it was designed so they could easily change the music and sync the characters to that new music (which shouldn't be that hard; the old Showbiz Pizza animatronics can do that without too much work and newer technology should make it a much simpler task), then they could incorporate new Disney songs as well as rotate in old classics regularly. That would keep it somewhat fresh instead of being the same show every time. It would also probably need to only have the orchestra scene -- since additional scenes with specific animatronics wouldn't be so easily changed -- but they could add many more characters and instruments to that scene.

I bet it would stay busy most days at the Magic Kingdom just as something for people to do (and also as a place to get AC in the summer), especially since kids would probably enjoy it. It could also go in at DHS to add capacity to that park.

As much as I wish MMR was still around, either in WDW or Tokyo Disneyland, I think PhilharMagic does a good job at being its spiritual successor and think it would be better suited to rotating or changing song selections.
 

yensidtlaw1969

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
I wish they would rebuild something like the Mickey Mouse Revue with updated technology. A bunch of Disney characters in one place, playing classic Disney music? I think that sounds great -- and it would probably be more successful today because attendance is so much higher.

If it was designed so they could easily change the music and sync the characters to that new music (which shouldn't be that hard; the old Showbiz Pizza animatronics can do that without too much work and newer technology should make it a much simpler task), then they could incorporate new Disney songs as well as rotate in old classics regularly. That would keep it somewhat fresh instead of being the same show every time. It would also probably need to only have the orchestra scene -- since additional scenes with specific animatronics wouldn't be so easily changed -- but they could add many more characters and instruments to that scene.

I bet it would stay busy most days at the Magic Kingdom just as something for people to do (and also as a place to get AC in the summer), especially since kids would probably enjoy it. It could also go in at DHS to add capacity to that park.
I still wish Mickey's Philharmagic were replaced with basically this - picture Maestro Mickey conducting an orchestra of Animatronic characters "playing" a selection of Disney classics that can be accompanied by in-theater "magic", as if the music is causing it to happen - Make the lights dance, Map the room with projections, send in Bubbles as they play something from Mermaid, Snow during a Frozen number, fiber optic Starlight during "When You Wish Upon A Star" . . . though ideally the show would also host some songs that don't otherwise have a home at the Magic Kingdom, ones that would lend themselves to filling the room with unique effects as they're played. Almost as if you merged The Mickey Mouse Revue and Mickey's Philharmagic and gave it a new set list. A magical theater brought to life all around you by the magic of Disney music, played by your favorite characters.
 

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
As much as I wish MMR was still around, either in WDW or Tokyo Disneyland, I think PhilharMagic does a good job at being its spiritual successor and think it would be better suited to rotating or changing song selections.

I've never actually seen Philharmagic for various reasons, so maybe you're right. I need to make sure I do next trip if it still exists, since I'm not sure when I'll be back.

With that said, isn't it mostly a screen based show with animated segments? There's just something different about seeing actual AAs of characters. I also think Disney would be more likely to update a song list with computer programmable AAs than they would to continually animate new segments for Philharmagic, although expecting Disney to do either is probably overly optimistic at this point.
 

GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member
I still wish Mickey's Philharmagic were replaced with basically this - picture Maestro Mickey conducting an orchestra of Animatronic characters "playing" a selection of Disney classics that can be accompanied by in-theater "magic", as if the music is causing it to happen - Make the lights dance, Map the room with projections, send in Bubbles as they play something from Mermaid, Snow during a Frozen number, fiber optic Starlight during "When You Wish Upon A Star" . . . though ideally the show would also host some songs that don't otherwise have a home at the Magic Kingdom, ones that would lend themselves to filling the room with unique effects as they're played. Almost as if you merged The Mickey Mouse Revue and Mickey's Philharmagic and gave it a new set list. A magical theater brought to life all around you by the magic of Disney music, played by your favorite characters.
Disney has flirted with Mickey conducting an orchestra in animations since 1942. Why not! Have a theater venue w Maestro Mickey conducting an orchestra belting out quality philharmonic music from various Disney I.P.'s. There is plenty of Disney material (music and characters) for creative minds to develop a top notch entertainment venue.
 

UNCgolf

Well-Known Member
I still wish Mickey's Philharmagic were replaced with basically this - picture Maestro Mickey conducting an orchestra of Animatronic characters "playing" a selection of Disney classics that can be accompanied by in-theater "magic", as if the music is causing it to happen - Make the lights dance, Map the room with projections, send in Bubbles as they play something from Mermaid, Snow during a Frozen number, fiber optic Starlight during "When You Wish Upon A Star" . . . though ideally the show would also host some songs that don't otherwise have a home at the Magic Kingdom, ones that would lend themselves to filling the room with unique effects as they're played. Almost as if you merged The Mickey Mouse Revue and Mickey's Philharmagic and gave it a new set list. A magical theater brought to life all around you by the magic of Disney music, played by your favorite characters.

Yes, this would be absolutely perfect. Especially if, as I said, Disney was willing to actually update it a couple of times a year (or even just once every couple of years) to rotate the music selections.
 

yensidtlaw1969

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
Disney has flirted with Mickey conducting an orchestra in animations since 1942. Why not! Have a theater venue w Maestro Mickey conducting an orchestra belting out quality philharmonic music from various Disney I.P.'s. There is plenty of Disney material (music and characters) for creative minds to develop a top notch entertainment venue.
Right? It's nearly the concept of Philharmagic, but what would happen if Donald hadn't interrupted the proceedings.

Yes, this would be absolutely perfect. Especially if, as I said, Disney was willing to actually update it a couple of times a year (or even just once every couple of years) to rotate the music selections.
Could you imagine a Holiday overlay?

I don't necessarily suspect that Disney would go for any of this - especially since Philharmagic is theoretically very easy to update and they never have . . . but it's fun to imagine.
 

The Empress Lilly

Well-Known Member
I see The Muppets Present: Hall of Presidents as having more staying power than the current Hall of Presidents. There are a lot of issues with the current format. You may call it patriotism. Some view it as propaganda. Also, a stage full of animatronic slave owners does not sit well with today's audience.
Only Americans would be offended by the mere sight of US presidents. But WDW attracts many international visitors too.

Imagine visiting the UK as a foreign visitor, only to discover that the Hall of Prime Ministers has been shuttered for a Spitting Image satirical puppet show. What cultural poverty. All just because a few Britons get their knickers in a twist over the mere sight of Thatcher and Churchill, and people from all over the world hoping to be immersed into British history a bit be damned.
 

MadTeacup

Well-Known Member
The park is not just about leaving the real world behind. The fantasy of Magic Kingdom includes time travel to eras past and future:

"Disneyland is dedicated to the ideals, the dreams and the hard facts that have created America"

"Here you leave the world of today and enter the worlds of yesterday, tomorrow and fantasy"

"This program is dedicated to the memory of Walt Disney" - HoP (2017-2021)

The idea that Magic Kingdom is all [cartoon] fantasy is a product of Paul Pressler-era management. Americana and American history are crucial to the park's identity; that's why every subsequent castle park until Shanghai included them to a certain degree. The Hall of Presidents was something Walt spent the last 10 years of his life trying to get made and WED saw fit to realize once they had the chance to do so. You'd be hard pressed to find a more appropriate attraction for the park.

Not everyone who enters the park is obligated to see every attraction. We've had 50 years of people being content with saying HoP is boring, skipping it, and leaving it at that. WDI does not need to fix something that isn't broken to appeal to an audience that doesn't care for it in the first place.
Then let me rephrase: Hall of Presidents is too much of a current events style of attraction for Magic Kingdom because it also takes place in the present. I just never thought it fit after they started including the Presidents' speeches.

I don't believe that Magic Kingdom should be strictly cartoon-ey , but the idea that attractions set in the real world are set in the past and future still puts them in the fantasy realm. I get that HoP brings a bunch of dead guys back to life, but it still gets too current at times.

I vehemently hate the "nobody is required to ride/see and attraction" argument. That is not a reason to avoid making changes that correlate to the society of today. WDI does need fix things that ARE broken and Hall of Presidents has reached broken status for many people who DO care for it. I enjoy HoP, but I also acknowledge that it needs fixed. It is polarizing and it mostly features a version of history that glorifies the men represented on that stage - whether they deserve it or not.
I would respect people's opinion more if they admitted they just want the show to go away completely.

No amount of Muppets or humor will change the fact that this show is about the US Presidents; whatever they were like at the time they were alive, whether or not we like them today, whether their individual legacies are deserved etc.

The only way to make it offensive to nobody is to shut it down...but we know Disney will never do that because doing so will create backlash for other reasons. It's better off to keep the intent of the attraction in place, because after half a century the attraction that was once just about American history, now has developed its own history, and is a document of the kind of experience WDW used to have. For that reason I would support revising the show to include more about the company and founder's philosophy than any third party comedic commentary. Carousel of Progress already does this and I think other attractions could too.
Maybe, just maybe, we actually don't want the show to go away completely. Crazy idea, I know.

I don't want the show to be about anything other than the US Presidents. I do want the story they tell to be more well rounded and less divisive. If it comes down to not updating the attraction, Disney WILL shut it down. I'm not so sure that simply adding a Walt Disney disclaimer to the show will fix the problems with it.
I figure if Carousel of Progress has lasted this long, there's no reason to think HoP, a much more prominent attraction, would close completely any time soon. And few attraction closures would ever create an actual political or "Disney is anti-American" backlash like closing HoP (or The American Adventure).

Nearly all of MK's 1971-1980 E-tickets are still around in some form excluding 20,000 Leagues and The Mickey Mouse Revue (which didn't last long in Florida and even had its ticket status downgraded before closing). I'd like to think at this point Disney doesn't see the point in shuttering and/or replacing these larger scale attractions. Could they really come up with something more effective for this space in 2021?
How do you mean more prominent? Carousel of Progress is more popular, more well-known, and has higher guest satisfaction, I believe. Again, without the right update in place I could EASILY see them closing this attraction. The "Anti-American" backlash from closing it would not be as bad as keeping the current version of the show.
 

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