News Monster Inc Land Coming to Disney's Hollywood Studios

[JackCH]

I don’t necessarily think this is accurate. I think Monsters was designed with Grand Avenue in mind. It makes sense to do that option and don’t blame them for it.

I DO BLAME THEM for doing Monsters before touching Animation Courtyard. They chose what phase one and phase two were. Monsters should have been phase two. People would have been much more forgiving if Animation Courtyard had already been replaced. The only (good) reason it makes sense to do this first is if you’re waiting on the rights for the IP you want to put into Animation Courtyard (Simpsons or Marvel). Just choosing this because it’s cheaper and can be done faster is short-sighted.

I also wouldn’t mind if they start demolition of AC simultaneously with beginning work on MI. That way, the time frame for AC will feel shorter once it is announced.

But it seems like that isn’t going to happen, so it’ll still be “an extra year” whenever they announce the AC project. Which makes no sense to me.

 

[celluloid]

Not to split too fine a hair, but Harryhausen's should technically be called "Ray's."

Yeah. We know who it is based on. (I own The 2000s box set)But no one is going to call it that for short around forums. Nor will Disney for obvious reasons.

 

[doctornick]

I don’t necessarily think this is accurate. I think Monsters was designed with Grand Avenue in mind. It makes sense to do that option and don’t blame them for it.

I DO BLAME THEM for doing Monsters before touching Animation Courtyard. They chose what phase one and phase two were. Monsters should have been phase two. People would have been much more forgiving if Animation Courtyard had already been replaced. The only (good) reason it makes sense to do this first is if you’re waiting on the rights for the IP you want to put into Animation Courtyard (Simpsons or Marvel). Just choosing this because it’s cheaper and can be done faster is short-sighted.

This is exactly where I’m at. I actually have no problems with the details of these plans. My main issue is doing this now, as opposed to tearing down Animation and building an actual substantial expansion in that area first. The part really would work best by using that are as the next place to build which can expand total offerings and improve guest flow by connecting to the RNR area

 

[GoofGoof]

I don’t necessarily think this is accurate. I think Monsters was designed with Grand Avenue in mind. It makes sense to do that option and don’t blame them for it.

I DO BLAME THEM for doing Monsters before touching Animation Courtyard. They chose what phase one and phase two were. Monsters should have been phase two. People would have been much more forgiving if Animation Courtyard had already been replaced. The only (good) reason it makes sense to do this first is if you’re waiting on the rights for the IP you want to put into Animation Courtyard (Simpsons or Marvel). Just choosing this because it’s cheaper and can be done faster is short-sighted.

From a business prospective it makes some sense though. I don’t like it, but that’s not relevant to the bean counters. Muppet Courtyard was under performing financially. The restaurants did OK probably but likely could do better. The gift shops had limited hours which tells you what you need to know. There were no LL sales generated from the area. Most of the operating and maintenance costs from the area will remain about the same except for uptick in hours for shops and of course the Door Coaster itself. So the park operations group only sees a minor increase in operating costs (salaries, upkeep, maintenance on the infrastructure) with the exception of Door Coaster but that cost exists no matter where you put the ride.

If they used AC location but kept Muppets Courtyard then they would add more to the operating budget. You would eliminate the costs of Launch Bay and anything else closed there but you would also lose the intercompany revenue generated from renting out office space to other departments. Park operations also uses some of that office space for its own employees so they would then need to potentially pay rent somewhere else if they relocate the workers. It’s not something most park fans consider but it’s a factor in how decisions are made.

The delay in starting the potential AC project probably has a lot more to do with spreading capital costs over the full decade. They were not going to spend the whole capital budget all at once and we all know Disney has a long track record of spreading projects over multiple years to manage the cash flow budget. AK is happening first and they are also stating that ground will be broken next year for MK. They are not going to demo the AC area, losing Launch Bay and possibly a show or 2 plus the office space if whatever they add isn’t going to break ground until 2027 or 2028 when some of the other projects start to wrap up. As park fans we just need to hope there’s no economic slow down or other financial issues with TWDC that results in a pull back of that capital spend. If that happens AC could be delayed indefinitely.

 

[Moth]

You realize the “wrong sounding Muppets” bit is about Whitmire, right?

Well, yeah! But now-a-days you'd be hard pressed to find anyone outside of diehards who'd diss Whitmire like that.

 

[celluloid]

Well, yeah! But now-a-days you'd be hard pressed to find anyone outside of diehards who'd diss Whitmire like that.

And more to your point. It has declined by degrees a bridge too far.
As explained. Vogel is not even the same character.

 

[Horizons '83]

I don’t necessarily think this is accurate. I think Monsters was designed with Grand Avenue in mind. It makes sense to do that option and don’t blame them for it.

I DO BLAME THEM for doing Monsters before touching Animation Courtyard. They chose what phase one and phase two were. Monsters should have been phase two. People would have been much more forgiving if Animation Courtyard had already been replaced. The only (good) reason it makes sense to do this first is if you’re waiting on the rights for the IP you want to put into Animation Courtyard (Simpsons or Marvel). Just choosing this because it’s cheaper and can be done faster is short-sighted.

From an ops perspective this choice makes no sense. I am not a Muppets lover, though I do enjoy MuppetVision, but we are essentially gaining 1 new attraction (not high capacity) and replacing another. Had AC been chosen we would have a net 2 increase instead of 1. Not to mention destroying Jim Henson's last project. Grand Avenue is going to be a mess, whereas AC is off the main path.

 

[Nevermore525]

From an ops perspective this choice makes no sense. I am not a Muppets lover, though I do enjoy MuppetVision, but we are essentially gaining 1 new attraction (not high capacity) and replacing another. Had AC been chosen we would have a net 2 increase instead of 1. Not to mention destroying Jim Henson's last project. Grand Avenue is going to be a mess, whereas AC is off the main path.

May not have been a net 2 increase with AC. Depends on what the plan would’ve been with the Disney Jr show and Voyage of the Little Mermaid in AC. Either of those could be lost with the full renovation of AC to bring something new to that area.

Going off early concept art it seemed like both would go away for Monstropolis in AC IIRC.

 

[Marc Davis Fan]

Just some reminders:

When talking about capacity, we have to differentiate between theoretical capacity and operational capacity (the real throughput).

When thinking about how an attraction will affect crowding, we also have to look at how many people will be in the queue and on/in the attraction at a given time (minus the number of additional guests in the park due to the attraction).

For how a land will affect crowds, we should also look at how many people will be in the land at a given time who would’ve contributed to crowding elsewhere in the park (e.g., more people spending time in Monstropolis than were spending time in Muppets Courtyard), but then also take into account how it will affect crowd patterns (e.g., Monstropolis causing Grand Avenue to become a pinch-point).

My guesses are:
-For a while after opening, Monstropolis will increase attendance/crowds, which most notably might result in some potential crowd-flow issues around Grand Avenue initially.
-Once the area/coaster is no longer new, it will help distribute crowds more evenly throughout the park by pulling more people into that area than the number of people that were spending time in Muppets Courtyard, which will be a boon for overall guest experience/satisfaction with DHS relative to how they are now.

(None of the above comments are related to whether or not Montropolis should have been put here or in AC, or whether it’s enough, or even whether it’s the right addition at all. And I’m certainly not suggesting that it will solve all of the park’s capacity/crowding problems, only that it should—after a while—mitigate them to some degree relative to the current situation.)

 

[Disstevefan1]

My frustration is we are at least 5 to 7 years away from seeing any of this. In the case of the new theater show Disney does not even know what they are going to do.

I wish Disney didn’t announce things that may happen so far in advance.

 

[GoofGoof]

My frustration is we are at least 5 to 7 years away from seeing any of this. In the case of the new theater show Disney does not even know what they are going to do.

I wish Disney didn’t announce things that may happen so far in advance.

I am not sure it will be that that long. When the original announcement was made the expectation was that construction for Monsters would begin in 2025. I have not seen anyone suggest otherwise more recently.

The Future of Disney Parks: Everything You Need to Know from D23 2024

The Future of Disney Parks: Everything You Need to Know from D23 2024

www.wdwmagic.com

I cannot imagine Monsters Land takes more than 3 years to build since there is not a lot of demo to do (1 gift shop and some backstage stuff) and only 1 new ride. So that puts Monsters into 2028 maybe 2029 if they really stretch things. I was assuming Tropical Americas 2027, Monsters 2028, Cars 2029 and Villians 2030. The last 2 have substantial demo and a lot more moving parts so could easily slip. Monsters should be next after AK. The Muppet overlay of RNRC shouldn’t take very long either. Depends on whether they do it before or after Monsters opens but either way everything related to Monsters/Muppets will be done sooner than 5-7 years from now.

The future, unannounced project for AC area could be 5-7 years out or could never get greenlit. Who knows. It’s all speculation right now.

 

[GoofGoof]

Just some reminders:

When talking about capacity, we have to differentiate between theoretical capacity and operational capacity (the real throughput).

When thinking about how an attraction will affect crowding, we also have to look at how many people will be in the queue and on/in the attraction at a given time (minus the number of additional guests in the park due to the attraction).

For how a land will affect crowds, we should also look at how many people will be in the land at a given time who would’ve contributed to crowding elsewhere in the park (e.g., more people spending time in Monstropolis than were spending time in Muppets Courtyard), but then also take into account how it will affect crowd patterns (e.g., Monstropolis causing Grand Avenue to become a pinch-point).

My guesses are:
-For a while after opening, Monstropolis will increase attendance/crowds, which most notably might result in some potential crowd-flow issues around Grand Avenue initially.
-Once the area/coaster is no longer new, it will help distribute crowds more evenly throughout the park by pulling more people into that area than the number of people that were spending time in Muppets Courtyard, which will be a boon for overall guest experience/satisfaction with DHS relative to how they are now.

(None of the above comments are related to whether or not Montropolis should have been put here or in AC, or whether it’s enough, or even whether it’s the right addition at all. And I’m certainly not suggesting that it will solve all of the park’s capacity/crowding problems, only that it should—after a while—mitigate them to some degree relative to the current situation.)

Your guesses seem very reasonable. One other aspect impacted is availability of LL reservations. Adding 1 additional ride to LL will likely result in better availability for other rides. This should be true across the parks as new rides come online. Soarin was a tier 1 attraction when the original FP+ came out and even now with TT closed has a tone of LL capacity due to Guardians, Rat and Frozen drawing a lot more interest.

 

[EagleScout610]

I'm wondering if they'd possibly retheme RNRC to Electric Mayhem before they shutter MuppetVision? I can't imagine RNRC would take more than a year to retheme, so if they shut it down after summer 2025, that puts Muppets closing in 2026. Prevents there being a span of no Muppets at all in DHS.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

Do we know if the Door Coaster is going to be very low in capacity versus other coasters at WDW? The LL revenue is definitely an important factor in any new park addition.

 

[TheDisneyParksfanC8]

Do we know if the Door Coaster is going to be very low in capacity versus other coasters at WDW? The LL revenue is definitely an important factor in any new park addition.

The concept art appears to show 8-10 guests. so it will be lower capacity to the other WDW coasters, but decent overall capacity depending on how frequently the trains are dispatched. But if it was too low capacity, it wouldn't be at the stage of Disney saying it will get built. Remember, Disney killed the quinjet Avengers E ticket because the capacity was below par.

 

[Epcot82Guy]

Do we know if the Door Coaster is going to be very low in capacity versus other coasters at WDW? The LL revenue is definitely an important factor in any new park addition.

The Vekoma suspended family is pretty low output in the standard model. Around 700-750 per hour based on installed versions. We're assuming they are making enhancements like the dual elevator lift and a longer custom layout. But I would assume that can only increase it so much.

Tron is about 1650-1700 per hour for reference.

 

[celluloid]

The concept art appears to show 8-10 guests.

Longer trains than that

 

[Brer Panther]

He was considered for a cameo in Haunted Mansion, but since they don’t have an active puppet he would have to be rebuilt. Which would have been too expensive for that project. On top of that, Bean doesn’t have a performer currently due to Whitmire’s “departure.”

Even before Steve got kicked out, we haven't seen Bean since an online short from around 2007.

The Family Guy wrong sounding Muppets bit rings eternal. It's hard for people to get attached to an IP if they all feel the main character feels "wrong".

Only for the Muppets, it seems. Didn't hurt the DuckTales reboot, the Mario movie, the Chip 'n' Dale movie, the first Space Jam, the Chris Pratt Garfield movie, literally any Scooby-Doo production with Matthew Lillard lending his voice to it, or Jellystone!. I think the only reason people complain about the Muppets "sounding wrong" is that stupid Family Guy joke - I never see anyone complain that Scrooge "sounds wrong" in the DuckTales reboot even though David Tennant doesn't sound anything like Alan Young.

And for what it's worth, Seth MacFarlane's Muppet impressions are far, far worse than Matt Vogel's Kermit. You can't listen to this and tell me this weird fusion of the bear from The Cleveland Show and a bad Marvin the Martian impression sounds like Kermit at all:

​

Vogel hasn’t had any opportunity to get a handle on Kermit.

He did have the live shows at the Hollywood Bowl and the O2. You can find videos of those online.

If there's one thing that's important to a character, it's the voice.

And the folks in Hollywood don't seem to understand that. Which is how we get, again, Chris Pratt as Garfield or John Mulaney and Andy Samberg as Chip and Dale.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I am not sure it will be that that long. When the original announcement was made the expectation was that construction for Monsters would begin in 2025. I have not seen anyone suggest otherwise more recently.

The Future of Disney Parks: Everything You Need to Know from D23 2024

The Future of Disney Parks: Everything You Need to Know from D23 2024

www.wdwmagic.com

I cannot imagine Monsters Land takes more than 3 years to build since there is not a lot of demo to do (1 gift shop and some backstage stuff) and only 1 new ride. So that puts Monsters into 2028 maybe 2029 if they really stretch things. I was assuming Tropical Americas 2027, Monsters 2028, Cars 2029 and Villians 2030. The last 2 have substantial demo and a lot more moving parts so could easily slip. Monsters should be next after AK. The Muppet overlay of RNRC shouldn’t take very long either. Depends on whether they do it before or after Monsters opens but either way everything related to Monsters/Muppets will be done sooner than 5-7 years from now.

The future, unannounced project for AC area could be 5-7 years out or could never get greenlit. Who knows. It’s all speculation right now.

Let’s see what happens. I personally have no faith they can to anything in a timely manner, I remember it felt like it took forever for Pandora and of course we all know how long it took for the EPCOT mistake to be completed ( I know, pandemic, bla, bla, bla)

I am happy to be wrong on this one. It’s going to take at least three years from (starting some time in 2025?) to find out.

 

[osian]

So...assuming Mama Melrose becomes Harryhausen's....

Considering all the rumours flying around, for my recent trip a month ago I made a point of grabbing a reservation at Mama Melrose as it was somewhere I hadn't got to yet. I thought it was a lovely restaurant and I had a great meal.

I'm not familiar with the movie franchise, so I looked it up and apparently Harryhausen's is a sushi restaurant, pan-Asian generally.

So are we expecting this in the new Monstropolis land, that what was Italian before now becomes Asian?