Monorail Accident

[hardcard]

MAPO overrides HAVE to be in place for the safety checks performed routinely throughout the day (Brake tests, mapo warning tests, etc)..

Thought process here.. If the train threw a MAPO warning for an overrun, and the CM overroad the warning, then they were NOT incapacitated when it happened..

Again, I know it's taboo to point fingers at the recently deceased, but we MAY (and I stress MAY) be dealing with someone who either did something VERY foolish accidentally, or did something foolish deliberately..


There is reason that a pilot is only allowed 3 overruns (E-Brakes) in their CAREER before they are banned from the trains for life... Because it's easier to NOT have overruns, than to have them..


AND also, FYI.. the MAPO overun button is at the top of the console, and is still part of the original control system, not the new 'glass cockpit' modifications.. So, you are talking about 38 years of proven technology..


Not to be a zealot here, and blame the unfortunate CM, but I am REALLY interested in what DID happen if it wasn't human error.. The MAPO button would have had to be pushed AFTER the warning was thrown, or the train would have e-braked 1500 feet behind the other train.. So, that rules out a heart attack or stroke, or whatever....

 

[BalooChicago]

intentional train crash

That was not an intentional train crash. The engineer attempted suicide after the accident out of grief. That accident happened because the engineer disregarded the signals and Metra did not have anything to prevent such human error.

 

[mpaul32001]

Nevermind...

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

What, tragic news! My deepest condolences to the CM and his family.


Here's hoping they get the trains back up and running, soon.

I do however sense the end of riding in the front car with the driver...

I could see that... Shame.

 

[TraceyC/FL]

I registered just to reply to something i hadn't read anywhere yet.

My parents took my youngest to the MK for her 5th birthday today. At that time the (stupid) news reports were still saying Epcot. She called me and said that it was at the TTC and they could see the trains. She was going to take a picture or 2.

So apparently, they aren't covered from view - which totally SHOCKS me. They park in the handicap parking, but she called me from the TTC because she was sorting out a ticket mess.

Anyway, i've learned lots from you CM's and former CM's - thanks for sharing your knowledge. Monorail Driver remains my dream Disney job.

Many thoughts and prayers to the family that lost their loved one, and to all the Disney extended family.

 

[joel_maxwell]

Not to be a zealot here, and blame the unfortunate CM, but I am REALLY interested in what DID happen if it wasn't human error.. The MAPO button would have had to be pushed AFTER the warning was thrown, or the train would have e-braked 1500 feet behind the other train.. So, that rules out a heart attack or stroke, or whatever....

So let me get this straight since I have never driven one nor been trained too. Is this the sequence of events:

-monorail in motion
-Alert on controls of obstruction on track etc
-Driver can override alert (which if done incorrectly and they have to E-Brake they get only 3 of those mistakes)

If so...

What would set off the alert where the Driver would have the choice to override and the obstruction be false. What would a scenario be for that.

 

[yellowrocket]

I read recently where the Walt Disney World Monorail System is one of the safest public transportation systems in the world... carrying X number of people per year X number of miles....

I hope this comes out in any public debate over the safety. I'm aware the currently fleet is getting up there in years, but their age is nothing compared to commuter trains, subways, and lightrail systems.... of course, those aren't owned by a multinational conglomerate.

 

[dismedic]

To the poster who asked about speed vs impact, Even at 15 MPH the kinetics of the mass of the mono would cause such an impact as seen in the still photos, Remember the nose is nothing more than fiberglass and supports not much impact resistant, Look at a newer vehicles that are involved in a head on or near head on collision the nose of the vehicle is usually crushed again composed of fiber glass plastic and crumble zones that reduce the impact kinetics , in my job I see it each day with little or no injury as a result of the impact, unfortunately the cab of the mono was not built tough, It appears from the photos that the two had collided violently and intruded almost all the way into the cab back wall upon impact,those who have ridden in the cab can imagine the seat position of the operator vs the nose of the cab in the impact photos, from numerous rides in the mono cabs i can see how this was a fatality.

Condolences to the family of this CM all Mono CMs are great they make the Disney expirience of the mono cab ride unforgetable for mono gecks like myself.

In late may we had been in the cab of purple on the resort loop waiting for others to board and the cab doors had been open , the CMs had been talking to each other about "pinks" overruns" previouse to purples arrival at the MK terminal, to quote the CMs they stated Pink was having "air brake issues" and kept missing the stop point at the MK terminal they just laughed it off and it appeared this was the norm for it, Now Im not eluding to this was the cause but just a mear coincidence for discussion, maybe soemone can clarify what they may have been talking about.

Hopefully the Disney / Monorail family can over come this tragedy , RCFD is one heck of a department and I am sure did everything in their power to possibly save this CMs life.
God Bless all involved.

 

[sleepybear]

This is so shocking and sad. And those pictures are very hard to look at. The only good thing about the situation is that it didn't happen earlier, when there would have been far more people on board.

 

[joel_maxwell]

That's horrible.
And the person who filmed that really shouldn't have.

That was my first impression. Although, he/she probably didn't realize there was a fatality. If in fact they did and kept filming, search there basement for dead kittens and dogs.

 

[hpyhnt 1000]

Wow... I mean, I dont know what to say...

What on earth happend? Condolences to the families, but my goodness, how could this have happend?

 

[Desperad07]

Re:

I don't mean this to sound insensitive but the subject is up in the air, so I'll put my two cents in. I don't know how Disney could shut the monorail down for an extended period of time (some have noted a year or other long intervals). It was a one-time accident that should be investigated and fixed, but the concept of the ride should not be shelved unless the system completely failed. Nor should the practice of cockpit riders. I think another issue is the logistics of transportation for some top Deluxe resorts. Again, not to sound insensitive...i just think that would create such a massive problem that Disney would look to get this fixed and resolved immediately. People are sad and angry and confused right now. But in two weeks, some family is going to check into their $400-a-night Polynesian stay and not expect to have to take busses everywhere. That's not insensitive for them at that particular moment...but it's an unfortunate issue that Disney must deal with (and likely has with ride-specific accidents in the past, even if they were due to health issues) after the dust clears on this awful accident.

 

[luvlifeinfl]

My Gosh this is just devistating. We had just had a similar thing happen here in the Washington, DC area on our Metro system. After looking and scanning through reply's and posting the most important thing here is a life is gone and all the speculation of the what happened is also important, but just remember a person is gone.

 

[DMC-12]

I thought that would be pretty obvious. It would not be the first time something like this has happened.

intentional train crash

UHhhhhhhh Wow... that is such a piece of garbage article. :dazzle::hurl:

That was not an intentional train crash. The engineer attempted suicide after the accident out of grief. That accident happened because the engineer disregarded the signals and Metra did not have anything to prevent such human error.

Yes... thanks... exactly!!! :king::wave:

 

[Krozar]

There is reason that a pilot is only allowed 3 overruns (E-Brakes) in their CAREER before they are banned from the trains for life..

2 overruns. 3rd is a strike out.

It's no longer for a whole career. The union considered that too unfair to people with seniority. There is an expiration but it's long.

So, that rules out a heart attack or stroke, or whatever....

Deadman would have activated.

 

[disnyfan89]

After hearing about all the safety features I too have to wonder if this was an intentional accident? One thing that still isn't clear is information about the two drivers, which monorail hit who, and if the unforunate driver is even the one who caused the accident. Based on the information we know, which is very little, it's hard to tell which driver was in the moving monorail. One thing is clear however, this is going to play out much like the BTM incident.

 

[Eeyore]

Sorry everybody, I deleted the link to the post crash video (if anyone wants to see it I'm sure a web search will bring it up easily). That video shouldn't have been taken and although it is noteworthy I don't feel right about it being linked to from here. Sorry.

 

[Krozar]

I don't mean this to sound insensitive but the subject is up in the air, so I'll put my two cents in. I don't know how Disney could shut the monorail down for an extended period of time (some have noted a year or other long intervals). It was a one-time accident that should be investigated and fixed, but the concept of the ride should not be shelved unless the system completely failed. Nor should the practice of cockpit riders. I think another issue is the logistics of transportation for some top Deluxe resorts. Again, not to sound insensitive...i just think that would create such a massive problem that Disney would look to get this fixed and resolved immediately. People are sad and angry and confused right now. But in two weeks, some family is going to check into their $400-a-night Polynesian stay and not expect to have to take busses everywhere. That's not insensitive for them at that particular moment...but it's an unfortunate issue that Disney must deal with (and likely has with ride-specific accidents in the past, even if they were due to health issues) after the dust clears on this awful accident.

I agree. Ridership in the billions. Who can boast such a safety record? Disney will fix this.

 

[hardcard]

2 overruns. 3rd is a strike out.

It's no longer for a whole career. The union considered that too unfair to people with seniority. There is an expiration but it's long.



Deadman would have activated.

sorry.. didn't know that had changed, but that obviously demonstrates the severity of doing so without explicit permission...


I hope I am wrong, but it seems to point in that direction.. The Monorail pilots are experienced on the platform for roughly 30 shifts before driver training, they KNOW the system.. this is not a training issue.. It's something else, unfortunately.

 

[DznyGrlSD]

Speaking of overriding the system then - do the monorails have some sort of 'black box' that they can check the sequence of events leading up to the crash?